Official Fredericton, NB projects thread

[Freddypop]

February PAC agenda:

https://www.fredericton.ca/sites/def...ar/feb2021.pdf

[Taeolas]

Originally Posted by Freddypop

February PAC agenda:

https://www.fredericton.ca/sites/def...ar/feb2021.pdf

Nothing as interesting as Moncton's agenda.

Pretty sparse overall. Still, the new apartment building on George street will be interesting. It's a more densification on the edge of downtown which would be good. Also looks like the design is going to try to stay somewhat similar to the housing around it.

I think the Forest Hills Road project was already a given; this is just a tweek to the design?

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by Taeolas

Nothing as interesting as Moncton's agenda.

Pretty sparse overall. Still, the new apartment building on George street will be interesting. It's a more densification on the edge of downtown which would be good. Also looks like the design is going to try to stay somewhat similar to the housing around it.

I think the Forest Hills Road project was already a given; this is just a tweek to the design?

Yes, the previously approved design was four storeys so they're just adding a floor to it.

A new Union Street apartment building was supposed to be on this month's agenda but it looks like it's been bumped. Hopefully we'll see it next month.

[Taeolas]

The new place being built at the end of Main Street near the Royal Road is going to be 3 stories. The walls of the third story are going up now. (I really doubt they will go 4)

This is a view from behind the new building.

[OliverD]

A building permit has been issued for the first building in the new development off of Limerick Road. It is for a 48-unit apartment building.

[OliverD]

The owners of Namaste Bistro, an Indian restaurant in Miramichi, are opening a location in the front portion of the former King Street Ale House location. Rumour has it that a barcade will open in the rear part, presumably post pandemic.

[OliverD]

Found renderings of the second phase of Jack Yousseff's development at the bottom of Douglas Ave.

[adamuptownsj]

Are there similar plans to remove the onramps and reintegrate Devonshire Drive into Douglas/Smith/etc?

[NufCed57]

Originally Posted by OliverD

Yes, the previously approved design was four storeys so they're just adding a floor to it.

A new Union Street apartment building was supposed to be on this month's agenda but it looks like it's been bumped. Hopefully we'll see it next month.

A shame they moved the discussion about that building, I was hoping to use this month's meeting as an opportunity to discuss this trend of cramming apartment buildings into Devon without any corresponding retail/public use space or transportation / infrastructure upgrades.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

Are there similar plans to remove the onramps and reintegrate Devonshire Drive into Douglas/Smith/etc?

Not that I'm aware of.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by NufCed57

A shame they moved the discussion about that building, I was hoping to use this month's meeting as an opportunity to discuss this trend of cramming apartment buildings into Devon without any corresponding retail/public use space or transportation / infrastructure upgrades.

In terms of retail the new developments have been adjacent to a fairly good retail node - pharmacy, liquor store, restaurants (fast food and sit down), groceries, vet, etc.

[Franco401]

Originally Posted by OliverD

In terms of retail the new developments have been adjacent to a fairly good retail node - pharmacy, liquor store, restaurants (fast food and sit down), groceries, vet, etc.

Yes, but those are mostly happening in Nashwaaksis. South Devon has the bones of a very vital, complete neighbourhood but is doomed to car-dependency if residential construction outstrips the improvement of amenities. I think the city missed a big opportunity by not zoning at least some commercial at Station Pointe, with all the frontage on Station Rd now occupied.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by Franco401

Yes, but those are mostly happening in Nashwaaksis. South Devon has the bones of a very vital, complete neighbourhood but is doomed to car-dependency if residential construction outstrips the improvement of amenities. I think the city missed a big opportunity by not zoning at least some commercial at Station Pointe, with all the frontage on Station Rd now occupied.

All of the things I mentioned are right in Devon. I don't think it was really up to the city to zone commercial at Station Pointe if the owner didn't want it. Maybe if that development started today there would be a commercial component though.

Regardless, the city does prescribe moving in the direction of a mixed use corridor along Union in its secondary municipal plan:

It is the long term objective of Council to endeavor to retrofit the existing suburban highway commercial oriented development to a more concentrated mixed residential and commercial urban core.

https://www.fredericton.ca/sites/def...schedule_a.pdf

So they want to concentrate commercial developments between St. Mary's and Clark, which I think makes sense. There's quite a few properties along that stretch that are ripe for redevelopment.

But the city can only do so much to encourage commercial developments. As the population of Devon grows so does the feasibility of new retail and office spaces.

[adamuptownsj]

Originally Posted by OliverD

Not that I'm aware of.

Disappointing. Lots of wasted land.

[NufCed57]

Originally Posted by OliverD

In terms of retail the new developments have been adjacent to a fairly good retail node - pharmacy, liquor store, restaurants (fast food and sit down), groceries, vet, etc.

Right, and all of those places are already well staffed, as far as I know. Where are all the people in this new building going to work? Or in the building across the street? They'll all drive somewhere across the bridge, or up the hill. Sustainable neighborhoods aren't just somewhere to put your body between shifts, they're places you can sleep, work, shop, and go out. Devon needs places of work. We're not going to provide meaningful employment for a whole neoghbourhood of intensifying residences with the mill and the liquor store.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by NufCed57

Right, and all of those places are already well staffed, as far as I know. Where are all the people in this new building going to work? Or in the building across the street? They'll all drive somewhere across the bridge, or up the hill. Sustainable neighborhoods aren't just somewhere to put your body between shifts, they're places you can sleep, work, shop, and go out. Devon needs places of work. We're not going to provide meaningful employment for a whole neoghbourhood of intensifying residences with the mill and the liquor store.

I don't disagree, but the argument could also be made that new housing in Devon could be attractive to people who currently work there but don't live there. I'd also argue that the residential intensification of Devon is a win for the city even without matching employment opportunities because Devon is a more walkable community than most of Fredericton's suburbs. Putting a 50 unit apartment building on Union is certainly better for the city than putting the same building on, say, Brookside Drive.

As more housing gets built Devon also gains the critical mass needed to attract more employers of various types, especially in retail and services. I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for any significant office buildings in Devon but that's ok.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

Disappointing. Lots of wasted land.

Maybe at some point down the line things will change but honestly, I don't see it as a problem right now. There are still plenty of development and redevelopment opportunities along Main and Union without resorting to reconfiguring the bridge's on-ramps.

[NufCed57]

Originally Posted by OliverD

I don't disagree, but the argument could also be made that new housing in Devon could be attractive to people who currently work there but don't live there. I'd also argue that the residential intensification of Devon is a win for the city even without matching employment opportunities because Devon is a more walkable community than most of Fredericton's suburbs. Putting a 50 unit apartment building on Union is certainly better for the city than putting the same building on, say, Brookside Drive.

As more housing gets built Devon also gains the critical mass needed to attract more employers of various types, especially in retail and services. I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for any significant office buildings in Devon but that's ok.

For the record, I am all for intensification in Devon - but it needs corresponding development in retail, commercial, infrastructure, and public space. Putting another 100-200 people in an apartment building with nothing for them to do in the neighbourhood besides get in their car and go where they actually need to be does not build a community. My fear is that Devon, a historical working-class neighbourhood, will be turned into yet another of Fredericton's myriad car-use-only residential suburbs.

[Taeolas]

Eyeballing the Union/Cliff area, I think having that used car dealer + McLean's really hurts that area. Those are two 'casual' businesses that really break up the walkability of that area. (Whatever happened to the planned reno and expansion McLeans was going to do?)

Still, leaving those there, there are some opportunities.

The corner of Cliffe and Union seems like a good spot for either a minimall or a commercial + residential block like we have next to Shoppers/A&W on Main, oriented along Cliffe, maybe with a slight L leg on Union. Have some light commercial and office in there and it would really boost that area IMO.

The block along Union between Hughes and St Anthony's should be flipped to full commercial or mixed use commercial/residential; maybe move the daycare next to St Anthony's to the back of the lot and use the corner for something else. Crerar Court should eventually be closed off and/or used for an apartment/condo block.

The Union facing block between Hayes and Cliffe is also a good spot for a mixed use 3-4 story building I think (commercial first, 3 story residential)

We also need some better trail links across Union to link the riverfront trail to the Northside trail.

Beyond all that, I think I'd love to see a Harvey's on the Northside in one of those areas. More restaurants in general in Devon would probably work well, especially with the more residential units brought in there.

[OliverD]

Please, no mini-malls.

There was recently a zoning change for the car dealer to expand their lot and the application mentioned the possibility of redeveloping the site at some point in the future.