SF Bay Area tech transplants unhappy with exodus to Austin, report says

[twinpeaks]

"One of the biggest themes of the early years of the pandemic was the exodus from San Francisco. Given the freedom of remote work, many Bay Area residents choose to move elsewhere — be it Iowa, Miami, Tahoe, Austin, or more recently, Sacramento. When SFGATE interviewed five tech professionals in 2021 who left for Austin, most were charmed by the capital of the Lone Star State. But a recent report from Insider suggests many transplants’ opinions have soured.

The problem? Even as high-profile companies and power brokers like Elon Musk move to the area, the tech scene remains nascent compared to California’s, according to Insider. There exists a differential in “talent density” between Austin and Silicon Valley, one founder and investor told Insider. Even as Austin gains a foothold as a tech hub, talent remains concentrated in the Bay Area — meaning more successful companies, and therefore more talent. The effects compound.

To put it simply — a growing tech sector doesn’t automatically equate to Silicon Valley-levels of dynamism. The founder who spoke with Insider summarized his woes succinctly: “Austin is where ambition goes to die,....”

https://www.sfgate.com/local/article...n-18343754.php

[LA21st]

Yea, this isn't a surprise. If you follow Tik tok/instagram, this has been known. I'd say I started seeing a change with progammers/tech bros saying they made a mistake leaving the Bay/California.

People are moving back from places like Florida and Texas in a hurry. 2023 numbers will be interesting. The covid era has flipped.

[chris08876]

Its like leaving the French Riviera for the Jersey Shore... one is clearly better than the other!

Maybe this is also a sign for the Bay Area to up that housing inventory. Folks want to move there.

[JManc]

The Bay Area was always the nexus of tech talent and innovation even with sizable presence in Austin. Even much of Tesla's more innovative "techie" stuff is still in the Bay Area. Austin always struck me as tech's secondary market to widen net for talent but the more innovative and decision making still comes from corporate in the Bay Area.

As for people in the Bay area; many would leave given the chance because not everyone working in tech makes big tech money.

[TWAK]

Originally Posted by JManc

The Bay Area was always the nexus of tech talent and innovation even with sizable presence in Austin. Even much of Tesla's more innovative "techie" stuff is still in the Bay Area. Austin always struck me as tech's secondary market to widen net for talent but the more innovative and decision making still comes from corporate in the Bay Area.

As for people in the Bay area; many would leave given the chance because not everyone working in tech makes big tech money.

I personally want to move back, but a lot of portions of the state are cheaper so they could totally move to where I live, or the popular destination (for Bay Area people) of Sac. There was a chance my area would be put into the bay area as we are part of the media market, but with the deduction of Sonoma County that might not ever happen.

Probably about half the people I know who left already want to come back to the state, but not necessarily the Yay since there's LA, Sac and SD.

[R1070]

If I'm not mistaken, Austin isn't even the biggest tech job market in Texas. I think that title still belongs to DFW.

[dimondpark]

This is from the National Association of Realtors.

Austin(and Nola) has the biggest increase in homes languishing on the market, year-over-year, this is in a time of historically low inventories. Meanwhile SJ, the most expensive Metro in the country, literally has homes selling faster than 13 months ago.

Metro Area--Median Days on the Market, Aug 2023( Change in days from 12 months ago)
New Orleans--64 days(+15 days)
Miami------62 days(+13 days)
New York---59 days(+5 days)
Austin-----55 days(+15 days)
San Antonio---51 days(+12 days)
Kansas City-50 days(+4 days)
Jacksonville-49 days(+9 days)
Pittsburgh---48 days(+5 days)
Riverside---47 days(+3 days)
Memphis----46 days(+8 days)
Orlando----46 days(+7 days)
Philadelphia---45 days(+1 day)
Phoenix---45 days(+8 days)
Birmingham-44 days(+8 days)
Tampa-----44 days(+7 days)
Oklahoma City--43 days(+3 days)
Dallas-----42 days(+7 days)
Houston----42 days(+4 days)
Las Vegas--42 days(no data)
Atlanta----41 days(+5 days)
Los Angeles-41 days(+1 day)
Portland----41 days(+5 days)
Raleigh-----40 days(+10 days)
Buffalo-----39 days(+3 days)
Cleveland---39 days(no change)
Richmond---39 days(+1 day)
Charlotte---38 days(+2 days)
Baltimore--37 days(+1 day)
Boston-----37 days(+3 days)
Detroit----37 days(+4 days)
Hartford---37 days(+5 days)
Minneapolis-37 days(no change)
Nashville---37 days(+11 days)
Sacramento---37 days(-2 days)
St Louis---37 days(no change)
Chicago----36 days(-1 day)
Indianapolis-36 days(+1 day)
Denver-----35 days(+4 days)
Washington DC--35 days(-1 day)
San Diego--33 days(-3 days)
San Francisco--33 days(-3 days)
Seattle---33 days(-1 day)
Cincinnati-32 days(+2 days)
Louisville-32 days(+1 day)
Virginia Beach---31 days(-2 days)
Providence---30 days(-3 days)
Milwaukee--29 days(-3 days)
San Jose---27 days(-10 days)
Rochester--16 days(-7 days)

https://www.realtor.com/research/august-2023-data/[/QUOTE]

[homebucket]

Not surprised.

Just looking at the weather alone, it's easy to see why one would second guess their move and long to move back to the Bay

The highs for SF ranged from 62-86F with an average of 71F for the month of August.

Originally Posted by KevinFromTexas

Our August. Every single day above normal, and the 110F we saw on the 17th is just two degrees off the all time high.


https://www.facebook.com/photo/?fbid...06266070869655

[Wigs]

Interesting that Rochester, NY is hot right now.
An underrated Metro, imho

[AviationGuy]

Originally Posted by homebucket

Not surprised.

Just looking at the weather alone, it's easy to see why one would second guess their move and long to move back to the Bay

The highs for SF ranged from 62-86F with an average of 71F for the month of August.

Those temperatures you showed on the chart were mostly way above normal. Still, the summers here are miserable even with normal temperatures. We do have 7 to 8 months of mild to cool weather (sometimes too cold), but California is better all the way around regarding weather.

If I could afford it, CA is where I would live, preferably in a coastal city like Santa Barbara, where I lived for a while in the 80s.

[Architype]

Originally Posted by dimondpark

This is from the National Association of Realtors.

Austin(and Nola) has the biggest increase in homes languishing on the market, year-over-year, this is in a time of historically low inventories. Meanwhile SJ, the most expensive Metro in the country, literally has homes selling faster than 13 months ago.

Metro Area--Median Days on the Market, Aug 2023( Change in days from 12 months ago)
New Orleans--64 days(+15 days)
Miami------62 days(+13 days)
New York---59 days(+5 days)
...

https://www.realtor.com/research/august-2023-data/

I noticed the top three here don't seem to have much in common, except that they are coastal cities close to sea level, all prone to some effect from climate change, but could that be a real connection?

[mrnyc]

Originally Posted by JManc

The Bay Area was always the nexus of tech talent and innovation even with sizable presence in Austin.

nope.

the miami valley was the silicon valley of the earlier 1900s.


America's forgotten forerunner to Silicon Valley

By Krissy Clark
Reporter, Marketplace


Before Silicon Valley became a world-renowned technology hub, the home of US innovation was in Dayton, Ohio. It's almost impossible to go one day without using one of its inventions.


more:
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-31989802

[TWAK]

^Isn't Seattle kinda Silicon Valley North?

Originally Posted by AviationGuy

Those temperatures you showed on the chart were mostly way above normal. Still, the summers here are miserable even with normal temperatures. We do have 7 to 8 months of mild to cool weather (sometimes too cold), but California is better all the way around regarding weather.

If I could afford it, CA is where I would live, preferably in a coastal city like Santa Barbara, where I lived for a while in the 80s.

I haven't been to Austin, but is it humid? Californians like myself can't handle it...at all. It's too much to ask for people that haven't lived or adapted to it!
Lived in San Antonio for a few months and have visited H-town, and both of them were humid as hell.

[montréaliste]

Originally Posted by mrnyc

nope.

the miami valley was the silicon valley of the earlier 1900s.


America's forgotten forerunner to Silicon Valley

By Krissy Clark
Reporter, Marketplace


Before Silicon Valley became a world-renowned technology hub, the home of US innovation was in Dayton, Ohio. It's almost impossible to go one day without using one of its inventions.


more:
https://www.bbc.com/news/business-31989802

Thanks for the link. I had no idea about Dayton’s erstwhile prominence before reading that article.

[iheartthed]

The article was pretty light on details, but why would anyone have gone to Austin expecting to tap into a talent market as robust as Silicon Valley? That says more about the person than it does about Austin.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by TWAK

^Isn't Seattle kinda Silicon Valley North?

I haven't been to Austin, but is it humid? Californians like myself can't handle it...at all. It's too much to ask for people that haven't lived or adapted to it!
Lived in San Antonio for a few months and have visited H-town, and both of them were humid as hell.

Austin woud be humid to Californians, yes. Most of the country is lol. I don't think Austin and San Antonio is as bad as Houston and Dallas though. I lived in San Antonio briefly, and yea.
Heat stroke one day.

Florida is the worst I've ever felt. I can't believe people subject themselves to that. Ocean breeze my ass. Chicago and DC aren't a walk in the park either.

I loathe humidity. Limits your time outdoors and you feel gross. Just had family visit from DC and they couldn't believe how pleasant the weather was. Yea, humidty is trash.

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by AviationGuy

Those temperatures you showed on the chart were mostly way above normal. Still, the summers here are miserable even with normal temperatures. We do have 7 to 8 months of mild to cool weather (sometimes too cold), but California is better all the way around regarding weather.

If I could afford it, CA is where I would live, preferably in a coastal city like Santa Barbara, where I lived for a while in the 80s.

Yeah. The article also said there were only 2 days in July where it didn’t hit triple digits. So that means in the last 60 days or so there were only 4 days where it was below 100. That’s absolutely brutal.

[AviationGuy]

Originally Posted by TWAK

^Isn't Seattle kinda Silicon Valley North?

I haven't been to Austin, but is it humid? Californians like myself can't handle it...at all. It's too much to ask for people that haven't lived or adapted to it!
Lived in San Antonio for a few months and have visited H-town, and both of them were humid as hell.

Humid overall, yes. We're not nearly far enough west to have consistently low humidity. But it's not as bad as east of here, where the temperatures are usually lower in the summer, but higher humidity. This summer, though, it's been just as hot east of here, which is highly unusual.

We do have some very low humidity days during the winter after a strong cold front comes through, especially if it's polar air. It's like further north, where the winter air can be so dry that you itch constantly. But usually it's not that bad here in the winter.

Need to keep in mind that this summer, and 2011, have been far above normal. Also, we're in the highest category of drought. Our normally beautiful landscape is devastated. Our trees don't do well in such droughts and we're losing many of them already, because we're on strict water rationing and we can't put enough water on trees to keep them healthy. Many residents have simply given up, not thinking about the fact that they are going to spend thousands of dollars having trees cut down, like after the extreme cold of February 2021.

[AviationGuy]

Originally Posted by homebucket

Yeah. The article also said there were only 2 days in July where it didn’t hit triple digits. So that means in the last 60 days or so there were only 4 days where it was below 100. That’s absolutely brutal.

And there's no sign of the heat breaking. Normally we would have some tropical showers and thunderstorms about now, but there's nothing in the forecast. Last year, we went into a wet pattern in August, and things were as green as spring around here. This year, around here it looks like CA in their normally dry summers, with everything brown.

[mhays]

Originally Posted by R1070

If I'm not mistaken, Austin isn't even the biggest tech job market in Texas. I think that title still belongs to DFW.

Depends what you mean by "tech."

IT departments are a function of any office, factory, etc. Dallas would be strong in this category.

Some lists include factories if they make tech products. Others include factories if the jobs involve tech skills (some overlap but very different).

Is biotech included? Dallas isn't a major player there.

Engineering, of any kind? Call centers for tech topics? Website design? Desktop publishing? Photography? Cable installers (tech infrastructure)? Lots of professions can be included if you broaden the tent enough.

Or you can narrow "tech" to software and computers. Some count everyone at tech companies. Others count by job roles, for very different results.

Austin would be strong in software (#3?) and hardware plants. I'd guess call centers too but those go to cheap cities and it might be graduating out of that as a core role.

There's no right answer of course. What's "tech" is just as subjective as "city" or "downtown."