Sinclair Centre Redevelopment

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Nice try there: Con = "Conservative," not "Conservationist." Red Tories maybe, but Blue Tories DGAF.

FWIW, "conservative" and "conservationist" are two sides of the same coin. Both want things to remain the same (or how they once were), and as a result are extremely resistant to change. Whether it's preserving social values or structures or park space or neighbourhoods, it's all based on preserving the status quo with little other thought needed.

The federal Conservative Party currently trends towards being socially conservative (at least as far as Canadian political parties go), but economically fairly liberal (unless there's some big tax cut they've promised that I haven't heard of?).

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by chowhou

FWIW, "conservative" and "conservationist" are two sides of the same coin. Both want things to remain the same (or how they once were), and as a result are extremely resistant to change. Whether it's preserving social values or structures or park space or neighbourhoods, it's all based on preserving the status quo with little other thought needed.

The federal Conservative Party currently trends towards being socially conservative (at least as far as Canadian political parties go), but economically fairly liberal (unless there's some big tax cut they've promised that I haven't heard of?).

Right, but conservatives aren't always conservationists, and vice versa. Many conservatives think of certain neighbourhoods/buildings/green spaces as "eyesores," and many conservationists lean left (there's even two in City Council!).

And out-of-control laissez faire of the Blue Tory variety usually runs against preservation - privatizing everything for a quick buck often leads to everything getting bulldozed.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

and many conservationists lean left (there's even two in City Council!).

The Green Party is a conservative party.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by chowhou

The Green Party is a conservative party.

*Conservationist. They're left-wing NIMBYs, like COPE.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

*Conservationist. They're politically left-wing.

The Green Party is a conservative party.

Municipally:
They want to prevent the Broadway corridor from "developing too fast": Conservative
They want to ban renovictions to make sure people can stay exactly where they are with no changes to the status quo: Conservative
They want to preserve the park board, purely for the sake of preservation of the status quo it seems: Conservative
They want to preserve public consultation on development which is well accepted to favour conservative NIMBYs: Conservative

It's okay to admit that green politics often have a conservative bend to them. Don't get me started on the Green Party nuclear+hydro energy policies.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by chowhou

- snip -

Again, you're confusing "conservative" with "conservationist" (also, the municipal Greens with the federal Greens, which aren't always connected). The political right couldn't care less about social justice, climate action, safe supply or bike lanes, those are strictly liberal things.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Again, you're confusing "conservative" with "conservationist" (also, the municipal Greens with the federal Greens, which aren't always connected). The political right couldn't care less about social justice or climate action, those are strictly liberal things.

Like I said previously, two sides of the same coin. It's the same mentality. Preserve, do not allow change, keep the status quo. Also, fail to consider the effects of preventing change.

And I'd be careful assuming people can't be conservative in some areas and liberal in others. It's all well and good that the Green Party espouses climate action policies, but the policies that matter most at the municipal level are their conservative policies.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by chowhou

Like I said previously, two sides of the same coin. It's the same mentality. Preserve, do not allow change, keep the status quo. Also, fail to consider the effects of preventing change.

And I'd be careful assuming people can't be conservative in some areas and liberal in others...

That's my point. The Greens are anti-urbanist social progressives.

Left-wing YIMBY:
Forward
OneCity

Left-wing NIMBY:
Greens
COPE

Right-wing YIMBY:
Progress Vancouver
Vancouver 1st

Right-wing NIMBY:
NPA
TEAM

The political spectrum is a graph, not a line.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

That's my point. The Greens are anti-urbanist social progressives.

Progressive conservatives even?

NIMBYism is a conservative/conservationist set of politics and right now it's what matters most in the City. So if you're a NIMBY party, you're a conservative party as far as I'm concerned.

[Migrant_Coconut]

No, conservative progressives. Same reason Doug Ford's not a liberal just because he's greenlighting a lot of housing. You're free to say Jean Swanson and Colleen Hardwick are the same and give them the same desk, but they're more likely to fight than agree.

Now, back to our regular scheduled programming about what'll happen to Sinclair Centre from here on out.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

That's my point. The Greens are anti-urbanist social progressives.

The political spectrum is a graph, not a line.

Funny that you left out the actual governing party in Vancouver.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Funny that you left out the actual governing party in Vancouver.

Dunno where to put them. For every pro-development decision they make (e.g. keep current rate of development on Broadway), they roll out an anti-development one (e.g. no rezoning of Shaughnessy) the next week.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Dunno where to put them. For every pro-development decision they make (e.g. keep current rate of development on Broadway), they roll out an anti-development one (e.g. no rezoning of Shaughnessy) the next week.

I think they are more pro-housing and pro-development than their haters would like to admit.

City staff stands in the way of rezoning more than any party that has run Vancouver for decades now IMO.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I think they are more pro-housing and pro-development than their haters would like to admit.

City staff stands in the way of rezoning more than any party that has run Vancouver for decades now IMO.

If they come up with a Hastings Plan tomorrow, I'll be the first to applaud - that's hardly "hating." So far though, all they've done is coast off the previous rezonings from the Robertson and Stewart councils.

[madog222]

We really didn’t need to get into politics in this thread, being a federal site/project doesn’t made that on topic.

[VancouverOfTheFuture]

Originally Posted by madog222

We really didn’t need to get into politics in this thread, being a federal site/project doesn’t made that on topic.

doesnt it, when the politics of the government could dictate what happens to the site.

many times different political governments have done different things with federal lands/buildings. its inherently political.

[madog222]

Originally Posted by VancouverOfTheFuture

doesnt it, when the politics of the government could dictate what happens to the site.

many times different political governments have done different things with federal lands/buildings. its inherently political.

It was initially until a certain someone derailed it with post 158. After that it's just a bunch of back and fourth on political name definitions.