Centre Slush Puppie [500 de la Cité, Gatineau] | 4000 seat arena | Completed

[reidjr]

Originally Posted by Acajack

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/07082010/...rena-hull.html

http://www.cyberpresse.ca/le-droit/a...esjardins-.php

Why don't you like this project.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by reidjr

Why don't you like this project.

I don't have anything against this specific project per se, except that it will deprive our downtown of a good people-drawing card. And it needs as many of them as it can get.

Post 1410 here sums it up nicely:
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...14#post4971714

[Cre47]

Lot of opposition for having the arena downtown now. A site has been setup. I expect some councillors to jump ship but Bureau considering how committed he is (maybe too hard-head) with the Montcalm spot, might continue to keep his same position.

Maybe the Brigil proposal will resurface with all this opposition, even if it was shot dead by the city right off the bat. Now it sounds like he is planning 1100 residential units at the site. Not a good alternative really for the Moreau Street/Highway 50 area off Saint-Louis

I'm fearing just the renovation scenario which would a shame because of all the bickering with the provincial government which supports a lost cause that is extremely unpopular in Western Canada unless the feds decide to fund for the new Green Riders stadium in Regina, the new arena for the Oilers, the new Tiger Cats Stadium plan and of course the Landsdowne project. Odds are stacked against Labeaume but Quebecor (although apparently not for the arena) decides to step in (though they were planning to be involved with the Nordiques project a few months ago anyways) but giving the harsh editorials this morning in Toronto and Western Canada papers, the chances for Labeaume getting no help from the feds are high. We know for the Conservatives, Western Canada is sacred for them so to keep power - apparently Harper said they never contributed directly in any sports project so far. Of course this won't be good for the new Guertin arena. Worse case would be losing the junior team.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Cre47

Lot of opposition for having the arena downtown now. A site has been setup. I expect some councillors to jump ship but Bureau considering how committed he is (maybe too hard-head) with the Montcalm spot, might continue to keep his same position.

Maybe the Brigil proposal will resurface with all this opposition, even if it was shot dead by the city right off the bat. Now it sounds like he is planning 1100 residential units at the site. Not a good alternative really for the Moreau Street/Highway 50 area off Saint-Louis

I'm fearing just the renovation scenario which would a shame because of all the bickering with the provincial government which supports a lost cause that is extremely unpopular in Western Canada unless the feds decide to fund for the new Green Riders stadium in Regina, the new arena for the Oilers, the new Tiger Cats Stadium plan and of course the Landsdowne project. Odds are stacked against Labeaume but Quebecor (although apparently not for the arena) decides to step in (though they were planning to be involved with the Nordiques project a few months ago anyways) but giving the harsh editorials this morning in Toronto and Western Canada papers, the chances for Labeaume getting no help from the feds are high. We know for the Conservatives, Western Canada is scared for them so to keep power - apparently Harper said they never contributed directly in any sports project so far. Of course this won't be good for the new Guertin arena. Worse case would be losing the junior team.

This site is getting some media attention these days:
http://www.nonguertincentreville.com/

It is not specifically identified with Brigil but it does make reference to "Brigil Platine'''s proposal in a few places. Brigil's Gilles Desjardins is likely behind it.

Everything is going to tighten up in a big way on the senior government side in the next few months and years. This is bad news for Marc Bureau's plan for a new downtown arena as money from Quebec is likely going to be really hard to get. Hull's provincial member (who has to be onside to fight for money from Quebec City) was quoted on the news today as saying "how can I go and fight to get funding for a project when I am not even sure most of the population is behind it?", and referred to the opposition to a downtown arena like the Web page.

So in spite of what the city says (and the best interests of downtown revitalization in my opinion), we may end up getting the Brigil project, simply because that is the one that has money behind it.

[Radster]

Its just typical NIMBY opposition, headed by the owner of Vice Versa furniture store who does not want to relocate (very selfish), and many of those in support are also probably public servants who don't want to lose parking spots. All this space is now is like 90% surface parking, so its ripe for something big, and this arena would be perfect. It worked in MTL with the Bell Centre, so why not here? Its walking distance to the new Rapibus, centrally located, walking distance to many restaurants and bars (perfect for pre-post game sessions). Yes a couple dozen of local residents will have this in front of their homes, but other than that, it looks like mostly positives outweighing the few negatives.

Its all about the funding now. The provincial gvt. said there was no money available for arenas a few weeks ago, only to announce $50 Million for the new Quebec Nordiques arena. Gatineau politicians are making a fuss regarding this, so there is still hope for funding and for this downtown arena to become reality!

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Radster

Its all about the funding now. The provincial gvt. said there was no money available for arenas a few weeks ago, only to announce $50 Million for the new Quebec Nordiques arena.

Correction - it is in fact 175 million for the new arena in Quebec City!

[Cre47]

Apparently, the guy who was planning the ... well... failed protest yesterday (only two people participated in the protest before the meeting at City Hall) was the one behind the site and the petition.

Now since, the Brigil project has being officially abandonned and that I dislike the idea of rebuilding on the current site on Carillon, here are probably other possible sites for the new arena. Some of the those sites are also possible future locations for a new Museum of Science and Technology.

* Jacques-Cartier Park
* The former Rivermead Horse Race Track area (Aylmer Road and Rivermead and possibly planned for residential)
* Near the sports complex on Boul la Cite
* The E.B Eddy Plant
* On Cite-des-Jeunes near Mont-Bleu and the CEGEP as long as it doesn't affect nearby Gatineau Park
* Right near the Reno Depot and the Casino du Lac-Leamy (also a possible new residential area)
* Near the University (UQO) would also have being another area I was thinking but it won't have enough space I guess.

Note: Four of the seven are close to the Rapibus track while the other three are located in areas served by several routes (though the Cite-des-Jeunes location might be a bit of a walking distances of some of the routes (35, 37, 49) and probably the same with Jacques-Cartier Park as most routes (21, 33, 35, 37, 39, 59) are within about a 5-10 minute walk from the park.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Cre47

Apparently, the guy who was planning the ... well... failed protest yesterday (only two people participated in the protest before the meeting at City Hall) was the one behind the site and the petition.

Now since, the Brigil project has being officially abandonned and that I dislike the idea of rebuilding on the current site on Carillon, here are probably other possible sites for the new arena. Some of the those sites are also possible future locations for a new Museum of Science and Technology.

* Jacques-Cartier Park
* The former Rivermead Horse Race Track area (Aylmer Road and Rivermead and possibly planned for residential)
* Near the sports complex on Boul la Cite
* The E.B Eddy Plant
* On Cite-des-Jeunes near Mont-Bleu and the CEGEP as long as it doesn't affect nearby Gatineau Park
* Right near the Reno Depot and the Casino du Lac-Leamy (also a possible new residential area)
* Near the University (UQO) would also have being another area I was thinking but it won't have enough space I guess.

Note: Four of the seven are close to the Rapibus track while the other three are located in areas served by several routes (though the Cite-des-Jeunes location might be a bit of a walking distances of some of the routes (35, 37, 49) and probably the same with Jacques-Cartier Park as most routes (21, 33, 35, 37, 39, 59) are within about a 5-10 minute walk from the park.

Interesting to hypothesize but for the city there are only two options: the main one right downtown (Wellington/Montcalm) and the current site with either a renovation or a teardown/rebuild.

I don't think anything else is being considered.

[Cre47]

That was just areas I've proposed considering there are mainly bland spots in this city which would be more suitable then the proposed and the current site and in fact considering Bowater is done, I might add another suggestion. Another site near the future Rapibus albeit a bit of a walking distance (which might rank it low in my list) since just before St.Louis the proposed Rapibus track would move further away from Maloney. I think there are several sites that might be better then the two locations.

Also what I meant with the E.B Eddy, I meant nearby so within the Domtar lands east of Eddy. (I can't wait for this eyesore to be changed). The building on the west side I was thinking for the future Museum of Science and Technology.

The current site is actually among the worst locations mentionned in this thread in terms of access to public transit service (right now only two routes serving the area every hour at night (and they pass at the same time on weeknights) - actually one you have to walk about 5 minutes). Sure the Rapibus would be nearby, but there are only stops planned for Montcalm and Montclair, a good 10-15 minutes from the site and walking into not necessarily walk-friendly areas at night. If the new arena would be at the current site, I suggests to add a station at des Allumettieres. Not sure about a pedestrian crossing over the 50 connecting to the arena but it would certainly be better this then crossing junctions with the 50 or poorly lit (if) paths.

[harls]

Originally Posted by Cre47

If the new arena would be at the current site, I suggests to add a station at des Allumettieres. Not sure about a pedestrian crossing over the 50 connecting to the arena but it would certainly be better this then crossing junctions with the 50 or poorly lit (if) paths.

There is also that conglomerate of transients that lives next to the creek behind Gite-ami... I know people that purposely avoid those paths at night just because they think they are going to be jumped. They even closed that tunnel under the 50 that connects with Amherst on the other side (I think?). Not sure if a bridge would be much better, but maybe if there is a station there like you say, it would be more active.

[Radster]

Makes no sense to build a station that is literally only 200-300m from the Montcalm station.

To walk to the Montcalm station from the current arena takes less than 10 minutes, all you need to do is take the bike path by the creek.
Daytime its safe, night time they can add some lighting, and security cameras, and its all good.

Alternatively, one can cross Allumettieres, then take Rue Morin a few blocks to Papineau street, by the Brasseurs du Temps and voila you are at Montcalm st by the new Rapibus station.

Both routes are less than 10 minute walk from Rapibus. Furthermore, this is an ideal location for cars too, as there is a perfect connection to Aylmer via Allumettieres, and Gatineu/Hull/Chelsea via HWY50, as well as ample parking on site and vicinity.

[Cre47]

I've already posted it on the Gatineau projects thread, but a new council vote on the downtown proposal has been delayed (no surprise) until after the holidays sign that this Council is still divided and that the mayor is unable to swing some of the opponents of the project.

If the Gatineau Olympiques are moving to somewhere else outside of Gatineau, a lot of fingers will be pointing on the Mayor. Assistance is around 2500 per game which is very weak. Clearly this stalemate is hurting the team in the stands.

[reidjr]

Originally Posted by Cre47

I've already posted it on the Gatineau projects thread, but a new council vote on the downtown proposal has been delayed (no surprise) until after the holidays sign that this Council is still divided and that the mayor is unable to swing some of the opponents of the project.

If the Gatineau Olympiques are moving to somewhere else outside of Gatineau, a lot of fingers will be pointing on the Mayor. Assistance is around 2500 per game which is very weak. Clearly this stalemate is hurting the team in the stands.

2500 is some what weak but the probleam in the q right now is there are teams with much worse attendance.What may not help city council is the league can not afford to lose gatineau if they do it would be a huge blow to the league.

[wingman]

It wouldn't be just a huge blow to the league, but to the city as well! The Olympiques help keep Gatineau on the Quebec map more than people think...

I like the current site, but can also see why the mayor wants to use the Wellington/Montcalm location. Remember, next year Montcalm is going to be totally redone adding a permanent bus lane with a minimum of three lanes from Tache to Papineau. I am sure the mayor would like to include this centre in the final plans.

I like the idea of the Domtar property near the portage bridge. Natural connection to the Promenade, makes it more profitable for the business there rather than having to close at 4ish - similar to Wellington/Montcalm I guess. Also close to the 50 access road for those coming from the east.

Keeping in mind that over 60% of the supporters for the team come from Gatineau (read old Gatineau), it is unlikely to think many of them will even use the STO. If parking is a problem people may not go! Unless they do some sort of park and ride thing.

Attendance will pick up after xmas, always does. But that old rink is hurting attendance for sure - as great as it is with regard to atmosphere is it too cramped and decrepit, not to mention the fact it was build in 1957!

[reidjr]

Originally Posted by wingman

It wouldn't be just a huge blow to the league, but to the city as well! The Olympiques help keep Gatineau on the Quebec map more than people think...

I like the current site, but can also see why the mayor wants to use the Wellington/Montcalm location. Remember, next year Montcalm is going to be totally redone adding a permanent bus lane with a minimum of three lanes from Tache to Papineau. I am sure the mayor would like to include this centre in the final plans.

I like the idea of the Domtar property near the portage bridge. Natural connection to the Promenade, makes it more profitable for the business there rather than having to close at 4ish - similar to Wellington/Montcalm I guess. Also close to the 50 access road for those coming from the east.

Keeping in mind that over 60% of the supporters for the team come from Gatineau (read old Gatineau), it is unlikely to think many of them will even use the STO. If parking is a problem people may not go! Unless they do some sort of park and ride thing.

Attendance will pick up after xmas, always does. But that old rink is hurting attendance for sure - as great as it is with regard to atmosphere is it too cramped and decrepit, not to mention the fact it was build in 1957!

Bottom line is i can't see council saying no to a new arena some may not like one spot but i am sure it will get done.Everything i have been reading today point to they want a arena not just for hockey but for concerts and shows and yes i can see that beeing a big boost to the area.

[Cre47]

With yesterday's funding announcement for a new Colisee, which might only benefit the junior hockey team Remparts for many years still even though there is a chance for a new NHL team in Quebec City, it is time for the City Council to get its act together on this one. Enough of the stupidity.

[AuxTown]

It's nice to see that Gatineau is not free from the idiocy that we experience here in Ottawa. Sometimes, living here makes me feel like I'm living in the movie "Idiocracy". The movie is pretty dumb but it really does a good job satirizing the state of North America today and where we might be heading. Check it out if you ever have a couple of spare hours: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0387808/

[Cre47]

Problem is: This project has divided the Council bigger then ever. Bureau's vision of a new arena on Montcalm is losing more and more support from the Council and actually since last week, a majority of council is against the project on Montcalm. This is becoming more and more likely, it will end up as a project on the site of the actual Robert-Guertin Arena. Hopefully, it won't just be a renovation project, became that will be just lame. A brand new arena is needed very badly as the BOB is falling apart.

[KHOOLE]

Originally Posted by Cre47

Problem is: This project has divided the Council bigger then ever. Bureau's vision of a new arena on Montcalm is losing more and more support from the Council and actually since last week, a majority of council is against the project on Montcalm. This is becoming more and more likely, it will end up as a project on the site of the actual Robert-Guertin Arena. Hopefully, it won't just be a renovation project, became that will be just lame. A brand new arena is needed very badly as the BOB is falling apart.

I hope that Bureau's idea carries the day. A "multifunctional" building would mean that there would be something going on nearly 24/7 in the old Hull downtown area and help to revitalize what should be a vibrant area with the Brewery Creek, green space, beer pubs, restaurants, theatres and nightlife Quebec style. Moreover, the O-train could go straight to it from the Bayview Yards and over the Prince of Wales bridge. It would be a wonderful tourism opportunity for Gatineau by attracting residents and tourists stuck in a very boring Uptown Ottawa.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by KHOOLE

Moreover, the O-train could go straight to it from the Bayview Yards and over the Prince of Wales bridge.

Yes, but only once the Prince of Wales bridge is allowed to rot, then rebuilt in about 30 years as "BRT", then planned for conversion to O-Train use, then a new council is voted in in Ottawa, who can the plan, then replaced by one that supports the plan, then Gatineau council rejects the plan, and then they get replaced by a council which supports it, about which time the new Ottawa council rejects it, by which time the BRT bridge has to be replaced again anyway, with a regular traffic bridge with diamonds in the outside lanes, and then someone suggests maybe running a train into downtown Hull, so they decide to build a brand new rail bridge, but then the NCC decides it wouldn't be consistent with their vision of the world's most boring national capital, and insist that it be a tunnel, but the federal government won't pony up any cash, and some time in the 2300s there's this consultation process, and the cycle continues ad infinitum until the heat death of the sun.