Lamenting the decline of the car - Page 11

OldDartmouthMark · #**201** Posted **Mar 2, 2019, 2:05 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssiguy

That is very true. VW and BMW tend to be more for the left-leaning urban crowd that always like to speed. I find Volvo is also in that camp but for a slightly older crowd. Mazda also fits that narrative. GMs are for the suburban centre-right voters, trucks are the redneck Trump & Ford {politician} crowd. Buick is definitely for reserved retirees. Toyota, Honda, Hyundai and Nissan cars are your ultra Liberal voting base...…...middle class with no strong ideological base.

Mercedez is very much split into 2 camps. The cars are more urban professional while the SUVs are very much for the conservative Chinese crowd because brand power and showing off wealth is a common and accepted especially amongst Mainlanders.

Completely disagree. Those are just common stereotypes with no basis in fact. People buy vehicles based on their needs, wants, desires, and financial situation... not their political preferences.

jonny24 · #**202** Posted **Mar 2, 2019, 4:36 AM**

The REAL answer to all of this don't have kids (hard to beat that carbon footprint), drive a 2 door, V6 pickup truck, that drives you and a spouse anywhere, can haul anything you want, not drive like a bus and still fit in your inner-city driveway

Of course, GM seems to be leading the charge in phasing out the 2 door short box...

(Ok, I bought the V8

)

Architype · #**203** Posted **Mar 2, 2019, 6:31 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

Completely disagree. Those are just common stereotypes with no basis in fact. People buy vehicles based on their needs, wants, desires, and financial situation... not their political preferences.

There is actually a fair bit of evidence to support this theory, but of course it's not meant to be foolproof.

Quote:

Study shows the car you drive may reveal whom you voted for

https://nypost.com/2017/11/29/study-...you-voted-for/

Quote:

Foreign-brand compact cars are usually bought by Democrats

https://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/01/a...on-wheels.html

Quote:

An artificial intelligence algorithm developed by Stanford researchers can determine a neighborhood’s political leanings by its cars

https://news.stanford.edu/2017/11/28...ical-leanings/

whatnext · #**204** Posted **Mar 3, 2019, 6:56 PM**

I have to laugh at Ford's latest commercials to try and paint the mom-wagon Edge as a sports vehicle by slapping an ST badge on it. Features lots of laughable scenarios trying to disguise their inability to compete - like trying to haul a gigantic stuffed bear in your sedan (cuz that happens so often)

lio45 · #**205** Posted **Mar 3, 2019, 7:50 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by whatnext

I have to laugh at Ford's latest commercials to try and paint the mom-wagon Edge as a sports vehicle by slapping an ST badge on it. Features lots of laughable scenarios trying to disguise their inability to compete - like trying to haul a gigantic stuffed bear in your sedan (cuz that happens so often)

There's no fundamental reason a SUV can't both be available as a soccermom-wagon, in its more basic forms, and a performance machine, in other versions.

Look at this: 0-100 km/h in two seconds. (The stock version is potent enough, but why stop there)

http://hennesseyperformance.com/vehi...ngine-upgrade/

240glt · #**206** Posted **Mar 4, 2019, 2:08 AM**

We rented a Ford Edge a while ago for a road trip. I thought it handled pretty well for an SUV. Not much cargo space in it though.

My mum had a Grand Cherokee Laredo with the 318 V8 in it, That truck was surprisingly fast. Handled like shit though.

Around here, the type of vehicle you drive can definitely give you some clues about the owner’s personality.

theman23 · #**207** Posted **Mar 4, 2019, 2:31 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Architype

There is actually a fair bit of evidence to support this theory, but of course it's not meant to be foolproof.

https://nypost.com/2017/11/29/study-...you-voted-for/

https://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/01/a...on-wheels.html

https://news.stanford.edu/2017/11/28...ical-leanings/

Yeah, but these all seem to be the opposite of what ssiguy observed.

Rollerstud98 · #**208** Posted **Mar 4, 2019, 3:53 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 240glt

We rented a Ford Edge a while ago for a road trip. I thought it handled pretty well for an SUV. Not much cargo space in it though.

My mum had a Grand Cherokee Laredo with the 318 V8 in it, That truck was surprisingly fast. Handled like shit though.

Around here, the type of vehicle you drive can definitely give you some clues about the owner’s personality.

I had an Infiniti FX35 for a coupe years, handled amazing and was decently peppy. Was based off of the G35 platform and was very fun to drive. I would have liked to be in the FX50 with the 390hp V8 but it wasn’t worth the extra cost at the time. May one day step in to one for fun although most are already quite high mileage vehicles.

Architype · #**209** Posted **Mar 4, 2019, 4:11 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by theman23

Yeah, but these all seem to be the opposite of what ssiguy observed.

Quite possibly the fault of the observer; I'm sure there are strong regional variations, but the research proved there are correlations. Some of these correlations are quite obvious and typically socioeconomic in nature.

OldDartmouthMark · #**210** Posted **Mar 8, 2019, 8:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Architype

There is actually a fair bit of evidence to support this theory, but of course it's not meant to be foolproof.

https://nypost.com/2017/11/29/study-...you-voted-for/

https://www.nytimes.com/2005/04/01/a...on-wheels.html

https://news.stanford.edu/2017/11/28...ical-leanings/

The "science" used in those studies is somewhat suspect and a little dangerous, IMHO. Making basic observations and then generalizing without any background information is similar to the thought process on which racism is based.

Using similar analysis, one could say that all Canadians in locations that receive a lot of snow are far right conservative because they own 4-wheel-drive pickups, when in fact they probably own them because of a practical need to get around in the snow - it has nothing to do with politics, or race, etc...

Generalizations without actual knowledge is never a good thing, in my opinion.

SFUVancouver · #**211** Posted **Mar 8, 2019, 9:09 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by 240glt

We rented a Ford Edge a while ago for a road trip. I thought it handled pretty well for an SUV. Not much cargo space in it though.

[...]

My cousin has an Edge and I was surprised how small it felt inside compared to my Forester. From the outside, I expected a similar interior feel, but that wasn't the case.

isaidso · #**212** Posted **Mar 8, 2019, 11:52 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpongeG

i love Peugeot.

I'm not sure if Canadians are willing to trust French brands again. The last time they tried to break into the Canadian market they failed miserably. Their cars were ill equipped to handle our climate. Heaters weren't strong enough, repairs were exorbitant, and I don't think AC was even an option.

If this were France some of these things could be overlooked but this isn't France.

ssiguy · #**213** Posted **Mar 9, 2019, 4:42 AM**

While I don't know how well Peugeot will do but I don't think you can compare how it might do today based on how they did decades ago.

European cars still have a good reputation and panache. Also Ford and Chrysler are effectively out of the car market and Buick is also gone and even Chevy has greatly cut back it's models and sales of their cars have plunged. It gives people another European alternative to the bland car designs of Japan and Korea.

whatnext · #**214** Posted **Mar 9, 2019, 5:37 PM**

There was an interesting article in the Globe on money-stress. One of the reasons singled out for price inflation was the rising popularity of CUV's:

...The same might be said of car-buying, specifically the shift away from cars and into pricier SUVs. The market research firm J.D. Power says cars last year represented 27 per cent of retail vehicle sales, down from 42 per cent in 2014.

A demonstration of the SUV-car price gap: J.D. Power said the cost of a Honda CRV is a $10,000 step up from a Honda Civic, which is built on the same platform as the CRV. This price gap helps explains why the monthly payments on new vehicle loans are higher and last longer than they used to.

J.D. Power numbers show the average car-loan payment was $666 a month early this year, up $100 from 2015. Just over half of new vehicle loans have terms of 84 months or longer...

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/inve...e-so-stressed/

isaidso · #**215** Posted **Mar 9, 2019, 6:05 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssiguy

While I don't know how well Peugeot will do but I don't think you can compare how it might do today based on how they did decades ago.

Agree, but once your reputation is gone its tough getting people to fork over $35,000+.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssiguy

European cars still have a good reputation and panache. Also Ford and Chrysler are effectively out of the car market and Buick is also gone and even Chevy has greatly cut back it's models and sales of their cars have plunged. It gives people another European alternative to the bland car designs of Japan and Korea.

Surely Canadian consumers are sophisticated enough not to assume any car brand from Europe will be good simply because BMW, Mercedes, Volvo, etc. are from Europe? Skoda, Fiat, and Lada are from Europe too. French cars aren't going to be high quality because German cars are of high quality. Then again, maybe consumers here won't know any better.

Mister F · #**216** Posted **Mar 9, 2019, 8:00 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

Using similar analysis, one could say that all Canadians in locations that receive a lot of snow are far right conservative because they own 4-wheel-drive pickups, when in fact they probably own them because of a practical need to get around in the snow - it has nothing to do with politics, or race, etc...

The thing is, though, Canadians in areas with a lot of snow don't actually own 4 wheel drive vehicles more than areas with less snow. Montreal and Quebec City get more snow than just about any other major city in the country, yet Quebecers buy more compact cars than any other province. SUVs and trucks are king in the Prairies, a region with the same amount of snowfall as Toronto.

Seems that the popularity of SUVs and trucks has a lot more to do with culture than weather.

OldDartmouthMark · #**217** Posted **Mar 9, 2019, 10:40 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mister F

The thing is, though, Canadians in areas with a lot of snow don't actually own 4 wheel drive vehicles more than areas with less snow. Montreal and Quebec City get more snow than just about any other major city in the country, yet Quebecers buy more compact cars than any other province. SUVs and trucks are king in the Prairies, a region with the same amount of snowfall as Toronto.

Seems that the popularity of SUVs and trucks has a lot more to do with culture than weather.

Exactly my point. Montreal and Quebec are known for efficient snow clearing, and being urban areas they will like the advantages of smaller cars for parking and efficiency, and don't need a large 4 wheel drive monster.

But they are buying these cars to fit their needs, not their politics!

SpongeG · #**218** Posted **Mar 10, 2019, 4:57 AM**

Tesla Still Owes $1.6 Billion in Leases for Closing Stores: Report
Not so fast, Elon.
BY ROB STUMPFMARCH 9, 2019

http://www.thedrive.com/news/26857/t...-stores-report

SFUVancouver · #**219** Posted **Mar 10, 2019, 6:33 AM**

^ Imagine my shock that PostMedia's driving column continues its inexplicable vendetta against Tesla.

ssiguy · #**220** Posted **Mar 10, 2019, 7:46 PM**

European cars have a style and reputation of non-comformity that American, Japanese, and Korean cars don't.

Let's take a look at all the car brands that have in Canada collapsed in the last 30 years:
Plymouth, Pontiac, Chrysler, Mercury, Buick, Oldsmobile, Izuzu, Saturn, Saab, Renault, Suzuki, and in the coming years Dodge, Ford {except for the Mustang} and there are even rumours that Lincoln maybe on the way out. The only 2 remaining domestic brands are Chevy and Cadillac which are both suffering from plunging car sales. Chevy is getting rid of the Impala. Cruze, and Volt while Cadillac is ditching the CT6 and XTS which makes you wonder if their entire car lineup is on the way out as well. Fiat remains with plunging sales due to being an inferior product so it too maybe on the chopping block.

We seem to be on a very quick path of where none of the 'Big 3' are making in cars in NA which is amazing when you consider that just 45 years ago they enjoyed over 90% of the car market.