Trans Canada Highway Twinning: Segments U/C

[Dengler Avenue]

By the way, I found her email address on https://dir.gov.bc.ca/gtds.cgi?show=...tCode=R2PROMAN.
It is Maike.Schimpf@gov.bc.ca.
While we are at it, maybe it's also a good idea to call/email Jennifer Fraser at 250 828-4298 (or Jennifer.Fraser@gov.bc.ca) since she's in charge of the TCH program.
It's time to flood their emails and phone lines.

I'm glad that an initial search on LinkedIn which led me to B.C. MTI's website turned up stuff.

[Metro-One]

Here are renders of the now removed interchange.

This was the design / materials used at every open house and consultation for the last 3 to 4 years.

Not a single hint of downgrading to at grade until todays announcement. (Which was an announcement for the contract being rewarded, and didn’t directly mention the downgrade).

Chase5 by Ian, on Flickr

Chase1 by Ian, on Flickr

[Dengler Avenue]

Alright I just wrote an email to Mike Schimpf and Jennifer Fraser. It may go to their spam folder but at least I've tried.

Dear Maike Schimpf & Jennifer Fraser:

While I was happy to learn that the twinning of Trans-Canada Highway near Chase, B.C., would commence, I was also appalled to learn that the original design, which included 1 interchange and which was the final design shown in community consultations, has been scrapped and replaced with 2 T-protected intersections instead, and that B.C. MTI did not notify anyone of this until now. This is not right, and I ask that the original design be upheld.

Sincerely,
(Insert name)

Feel free to follow my template and make the tone stronger.

[ssiguy]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

The reality is, all BC governments cheap out. This is nothing new.

BC wouldn't know what an overpass was if it slapped them in the face. It's not roads only however as BC also has remarkable poor rail corridors considering it's a port city. They are so many level crossings in Greater Vancouver and the FV but of course the province has absolutely no intention of ever doing anything about them even the ones on heavy trucking routes.

People who have never been to BC don't fully appreciate just how incredibly bad and inadequate the highway system is in the province.

[Dengler Avenue]

This was quick. Schimpf actually got back to me 7 minutes ago.

Good evening (Insert my name)

I’d be happy to set up a time to chat with you to discuss the details of the revisions to the design which are an outcome of public consultation in earlier public engagement.

Please let me know if there’s acceptable times to you later this week (Thursday) or early next week, apologies I am not available Friday as it is a vacation day I’ve taken to be with my kids.

Thank you for your email. And I look forward to chatting with you soon.

Kind regards,
Maike

Alright what do I do now? Who else got a similar reply? Who can go??

[craner]

^So they deleted the interchange based on public consultation ? Yeah sure.
I don’t understand why we do such short stretches at a time (<4km). If we’re going to put all this energy into design and construction let’s go 25 kms at least. 3.3kms doesn’t even deserve an announcement and all this hype. .... but at least it’s being done under the “community benefits program” so the costs can be increased.
Man this pisses me off.

[Dengler Avenue]

Anyway my decision is this. I will wait for Metro-One to get reply from her first. For the rest of you, if you care, write to her, Jennifer Fraser and Lindsey LeBlanc. I’m suspecting of some divide-and-conquer tactic here so we need to work together. (Lol, I hope they aren’t reading this.)

All this feels so surreal right now because this is the first time that something I do on SSP has real life implications for me.

Ps: Please don’t throw me under the bus, people. I still have to reply in a timely manner so she doesn’t think I’m just a heckler.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

This was quick. Schimpf actually got back to me 7 minutes ago.

Alright what do I do now? Who else got a similar reply? Who can go??

I'd ask her to provide you with links to the input from citizens who engaged with them as well as asking her how this could be the final design when the general public was never shown these plans. I'm not sure exactly how you word this but they need to be called out on their bullshit. People asked for an interchange so it's really hard to believe after X number of open houses with an interchange as the stated solution that enough people would have changed their minds to make a protected-T intersection (WTF is that anyway?!) the preferred solution.

I'd also tell her that you feel you've been strung along for years and that it appears they are more interested in listening to special interest groups than the general public and that they don't appear to be concerned with safety. Let her know that you fear for your life when you travel on B.C. highways. Remind her that there's an election next spring and that the completely neglected, subpar POS (use a nicer phrase!) B.C. highway network will be a key issue for many voters including yourself.

You should also contact trucking associations and ask them to send out some releases.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by craner

^So they deleted the interchange based on public consultation ? Yeah sure.
I don’t understand why we do such short stretches at a time (<4km). If we’re going to put all this energy into design and construction let’s go 25 kms at least. 3.3kms doesn’t even deserve an announcement and all this hype. .... but at least it’s being done under the “community benefits program” so the costs can be increased.
Man this pisses me off.

Shows their complete contempt for drivers and just how little they understand the importance of highways to the economy.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

BC wouldn't know what an overpass was if it slapped them in the face. It's not roads only however as BC also has remarkable poor rail corridors considering it's a port city. They are so many level crossings in Greater Vancouver and the FV but of course the province has absolutely no intention of ever doing anything about them even the ones on heavy trucking routes.

People who have never been to BC don't fully appreciate just how incredibly bad and inadequate the highway system is in the province.

This is true across Canada.

Just like when it comes to twinning 17 or 11 between North Bay and Nipigon. Drive it. Pull a trailer. It will become apparent which is better, or what challenges they face.

BC is not flat. No, seriously, you cannot just put down roads or rails in the shortest route as there are huge mountains in the way. Tunneling for hundreds of km is not a solution, neither is flattening the mountains. However, that doesn't mean it should be done cheaply. For instance, you can use the mountains to allow you to have frontage roads higher or lower than the highway.

[milomilo]

I want the TCH to be upgraded too, but assuming the supply of money to the project remains constant, it's going to be a long process. And the question has to be asked, should the priority be to spend the money on grade separating interchanges, or to increasing the length of 4-laned highway, while making the at grade intersections safe with protected tees and signals?

It's clear that BC prefers the latter approach, and I've come around to believe it's probably the more sensible one, short of a huge increase in funding. I'd rather drive on a longer section of 4 lane road while occasionally stopping for lights than have to drive on more crappy old 2 lane roads, with a few more interchanges in the shorter upgraded sections. Just build the new road in such a way that the interchanges can be added later.

I do agree though that it is shameless dishonesty to advertise one plan then build another.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by milomilo

I want the TCH to be upgraded too, but assuming the supply of money to the project remains constant, it's going to be a long process. And the question has to be asked, should the priority be to spend the money on grade separating interchanges, or to increasing the length of 4-laned highway, while making the at grade intersections safe with protected tees and signals?

It's clear that BC prefers the latter approach, and I've come around to believe it's probably the more sensible one, short of a huge increase in funding. I'd rather drive on a longer section of 4 lane road while occasionally stopping for lights than have to drive on more crappy old 2 lane roads, with a few more interchanges in the shorter upgraded sections. Just build the new road in such a way that the interchanges can be added later.

I do agree though that it is shameless dishonesty to advertise one plan then build another.

There will be a massive stimulus package to boost the destroyed economy. I'll bet if the BC government wanted some for this, too do it right, they would get it without issue.

[milomilo]

But whether that's true or not in the future, that source of money does not exist now. The situation until and up to now is that if BC wants more of the TCH to be upgraded, it has to tax its citizens or borrow more.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by milomilo

I want the TCH to be upgraded too, but assuming the supply of money to the project remains constant, it's going to be a long process. And the question has to be asked, should the priority be to spend the money on grade separating interchanges, or to increasing the length of 4-laned highway, while making the at grade intersections safe with protected tees and signals?

It's clear that BC prefers the latter approach, and I've come around to believe it's probably the more sensible one, short of a huge increase in funding. I'd rather drive on a longer section of 4 lane road while occasionally stopping for lights than have to drive on more crappy old 2 lane roads, with a few more interchanges in the shorter upgraded sections. Just build the new road in such a way that the interchanges can be added later.

I do agree though that it is shameless dishonesty to advertise one plan then build another.

It's a question to which, lol, honestly, I can't decide an answer either. Maybe normally, I'm okay with the latter approach. With possible stimulus coming in though, we may as well seize the chance to do it right. Northern Ontario, on the other hand, hehehe...

Meanwhile I still need to think about what to write back to Schimpf since she replied 23 minutes after I wrote to her. I'm trying to combine what Metro-One and swimmer_spe told me...

Edit: This may be the one instance where I rather B.C. MTI put it on hold until there's money coming in. By the way, even with the downgraded design, the cost went up by $60M no less. Why... This is reminiscent of the Island Highway fiasco that I've heard said.

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

It's a question to which, lol, honestly, I can't decide an answer either. Maybe normally, I'm okay with the latter approach. With possible stimulus coming in though, we may as well seize the chance to do it right. Northern Ontario, on the other hand, hehehe...

Meanwhile I still need to think about what to write back to Schimpf since she replied 23 minutes after I wrote to her. I'm trying to combine what Metro-One and swimmer_spe told me...

Even if some stimulus money came in, I'd suspect that it would only fast forward the simpler projects to the next few years. Anything large scale like big bridges or bypassing towns will take years to plan, stimulus or not.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by milomilo

But whether that's true or not in the future, that source of money does not exist now. The situation until and up to now is that if BC wants more of the TCH to be upgraded, it has to tax its citizens or borrow more.

I wold argue that was up to about Jan 2020. Today, 4 months later, that will not be the case. The problem so many people tend to ignore is the near future. We are not in the world of Jan 2020 anymore, and I doubt we will return there for some time. It is time to begin to work with the future that we will live in. Although nothing has been said for an economy stimulus, it is time to ready projects for stimulus money.

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

I wold argue that was up to about Jan 2020. Today, 4 months later, that will not be the case. The problem so many people tend to ignore is the near future. We are not in the world of Jan 2020 anymore, and I doubt we will return there for some time. It is time to begin to work with the future that we will live in. Although nothing has been said for an economy stimulus, it is time to ready projects for stimulus money.

The government hasn't announced any infrastructure stimulus money, so it's still the reality. And regardless, for a project starting this summer new money is irrelevant. That money won't get spent until next year at the earliest.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by milomilo

The government hasn't announced any infrastructure stimulus money, so it's still the reality. And regardless, for a project starting this summer new money is irrelevant. That money won't get spent until next year at the earliest.

What is the construction timeline of this project?

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

What is the construction timeline of this project?

That Chase work, the article says late summer.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

BC wouldn't know what an overpass was if it slapped them in the face. It's not roads only however as BC also has remarkable poor rail corridors considering it's a port city. They are so many level crossings in Greater Vancouver and the FV but of course the province has absolutely no intention of ever doing anything about them even the ones on heavy trucking routes.

People who have never been to BC don't fully appreciate just how incredibly bad and inadequate the highway system is in the province.

I've always found the highways in BC to be (pardon the expression) kinda "toy train-ish" in design.

I do realize there are huge geotechnical challenges there.