Arizona elections 2010

[glynnjamin]

Ugh, I hate looking at that district that used to belong to JD Hayworth! It runs from like South Scottsdale all the way up to Cave Creek. It is a huge swath that encompasses pretty much rich whites only. Ugh. Can't wait to see how they rig it up this year.

[phxbyrd]

How can you be against both JD and Goddard at the same time? If you think most AZ politicians are bad then just say that.

[glynnjamin]

Just because they are part of different parties doesn't mean I can't disagree with them both. JD Heyworth is a worthless tea bagger who is trying to capitalize on this anti-tax nonsense "sweeping the nation" and has never been anything more than a blowhard. Terry Goddard has plans for privatizing education inside this state that should make anyone even thinking about having children considering a move. There are some decent politicians here but those two are not them. I'm tired of having senators that resist "pork" as if taking Federal money for projects is a bad thing. I'm also tired of governors who put education at the bottom of the list of items to fund. A Democrat in Arizona is a republican in Massachusetts...just sayin'

[HooverDam]

^Im not familiar with Goddards plans specifically, but bringing more privatization and choice into AZ schools sounds like a great thing to me. I attended Arizona public schools from 1989-2002, they're an abortion. From English classes with 200 kids in them, to having multiple teachers who admitted that they were teaching classes outside their fields of expertise, it was truly a joke as a learning environment. If Goddards plans are just Vouchers or something like that and you're in a huff then thats pretty silly.

[glynnjamin]

You can pretend that public money going towards religious education is no big deal but I think it is an abomination. I agree that the public schools are a nightmare - I work at one - but taking money away from them will only punish the poorer kids and create a wider gap between the haves and have-nots. My biggest issue with Goddard's plan is to cut CTE money.

[HooverDam]

Originally Posted by glynnjamin

You can pretend that public money going towards religious education is no big deal but I think it is an abomination. I agree that the public schools are a nightmare - I work at one - but taking money away from them will only punish the poorer kids and create a wider gap between the haves and have-nots. My biggest issue with Goddard's plan is to cut CTE money.

Does Goddard have this plan outlined anywhere online or are you just going to keep referring to it cryptically?

If I had kids I'd much rather them go to Brophy Prep than most any public HS and Im not religious at all, Id just tell them to take a nap during Chapel or whatever as they'd still come out way ahead of going to a public HS.

[glynnjamin]

Well his website doesn't have shit as far as his platform so I can't cite anything textual. All I know is that I have friends and family who work at the AZ Dept of Education and these are the things that have come down to them.

And that's fine if you want to send your kids to Brophy - but I don't want to pay with my money to teach your kids about fairy jesus and his godmothers. Sunnyslope High School and University High School are both consistently rated higher than Brophy...they are public schools. SOME get it right, despite the obstacles in place.

[mwadswor]

Originally Posted by glynnjamin

I don't think I'd buy in Phx ever again unless it was downtown. I have legitimate concerns about the ability of this state to govern itself and provide the necessary jobs and water that are needed to keep people here. In 10 years time, I would not be surprised to see the state's parks sold to the highest bidder and an extreme cap on water usage (along with skyrocketing water prices). I don't think Phoenix is a long term investment kind of place any more. If people like JD Hayworth and Terry Goddard end up in office, you can kiss our public schools goodbye as well. I would not want to raise a child here.

I have high hopes for another mini-boom in the next couple years but I feel like the city will be harmed by the incompetence of the state and the surrounding cities (specifically Glendale, Peoria, and Mesa).

This. I love Tempe and Phoenix, but given the state of government in Arizona, I have no confidence of the long term viability of this state. I wouldn't buy a house here because I don't want to put down roots here, unfortunately. I want to raise a family one day, and I refuse to do that in this state. Not to mention, it'll make the job hunt easier when I finish law school if I can search nationally without having to worry about a house here.

Phoenix would be a great city if it weren't in Arizona... maybe Phoenix, Tempe, and maybe Scottsdale can secede and form a new state

Originally Posted by glynnjamin

You can pretend that public money going towards religious education is no big deal but I think it is an abomination. I agree that the public schools are a nightmare - I work at one - but taking money away from them will only punish the poorer kids and create a wider gap between the haves and have-nots. My biggest issue with Goddard's plan is to cut CTE money.

Aaaanndd this. I don't understand people who advocate for vouchers or other forms of privatizing education in Arizona. You see a situation where a school obviously has a crippled budget, forcing the quality of education down the tubes, and your solution is to reduce their budget even further so you can give the money to someone else? No, the solution is to recognize that public education in Arizona is abhorrent because we're not investing in it, and the state legislature likes to use education funds as a piggy bank any time they're having trouble balancing the budget.

It's like stripping public transit funding until busses only run hourly during weekday daylight hours, then saying that we might as well get rid of the busses altogether because no one is riding them.

And none of this is really development news sooo.... http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...18#post4784718

[mwadswor]

Post here about the Arizona senate and governor elections this fall. City council and neighborhood meetings are nice, but this is really our best chance to guide the future development of our city and state. Let's help each other make an informed choice this November.

[HooverDam]

Its pretty laughable to me when people blame money/lack thereof as the key issue in our poor educational system in AZ. Nothing could be further from the truth. From first hand experience I can tell you every public school I ever attended (save for my Freshman and Sophomore years at Paradise Valley HS) was a brand new school, with brand new facilities, the finest in computers, bells, whistles, etc. They were able to poach the 'best' teachers from other schools in part because of these amenities and it was still a ridiculous joke.

The fundamental problem is a lack of competition, vouchers may help foster competition and that can only be a good thing.

[glynnjamin]

No Hoover, it really is lack of money...let me try to illustrate:

The districts around Phoenix have been both blessed and plagued by massive growth over the past 10 years. They have seen rapid rises in students within their district boundaries but those spikes in students come miles away from the existing schools. For every 2 massive home development sites, a new elementary, secondary, and possibly even high school must be built. Those districts spent millions to build out and accommodate the rising population only to see those children leave town almost immediately after the doors opened. Now the districts' budgets are tapped out and they are receiving less money from the state than they were before. This is the major problem plaguing the outlying districts in cities like Dysart and Surprise.

Then you get into issues with funding. Most people thing that education funding comes from one giant pot labeled EDUCATION. What actually happens is there are federal, state, and local monies collected for basic education and then there are federal, state, and local monies collected for specific types of education. A perfect example would be the Glendale Union High School District. The district received a lump sum of money for technology improvements thanks to the Obama stimulus package. That money went towards buying and installing SMARTboards (approx 25 per school, 9 schools) at $2,100 a piece, Mobi tablets (18 per school, 9 schools) and $150 a piece, and Classroom Performance Systems (15 per school, 9 schools) at $900 a piece. That's over $600,000 on new equipment alone.

Meanwhile, the state of Arizona has chosen to stop funding CTE maintenance fees in their new budget. CTE maintenance fees simply covers the cost of powering, funding, and repairing the Career & Technical Education courses' equiptment that has been bought with Federal money. If Arizona doesn't pay the maintenance fees, the federal government stops giving the state CTE money. In other words, the state pays $200,000 a year and receives over $2M a year in federal funds. The state will no longer pay the $200k so the fed will no longer give us the $2M. What does that mean in the classroom? Entire labs of computers, cameras, machinery, tools, hospital and culinary equipment will all go unused next year because there is no money to pay the salaries of the teachers who were funded through federal CTE money.

Oh, and that Prop 100 that we are voting on in a few weeks? Well if that passes, you'll be able to keep class sizes at about 40 and won't have to pay for your kids to play sports. If it doesn't pass, you can forget about a lot of things your kids used to get. Regardless of its passage, Title 1 classes will be getting brand new computer systems, smartboards, and special education aides paid for with Federal Title 1 money.

You see, if everything went into one pot, the schools might run the way you'd expect them to with the money they are given...but it isn't. Sometimes money has to be spent on the bells and whistles but can't be spent on the foundation. Arizona schools lag behind other states because they don't pay their teachers enough (that's money that comes from the state) to lure more educated faculty from other states. If you were getting paid $32k a year and you were told that you had to go get your masters (paid for out of your own pocket) or else you would lose your job - would you do it? COULD you do it? Or would you go find another profession? That's what is happening in education. The "perks" have been eroded away. You no longer get summers off, you have to take classes to improve your skills. You no longer get the security of a state-backed retirement system because the state is broke. You no longer get the job security that this profession used to have. Why would anyone become a teacher? Where is the incentive? More competition isn't going to fix that! The state isn't going to give the public schools more money to compete with the private schools. They will continue to erode away the ability of public schools to function while propping up private education until private school becomes the ONLY option.

[phxbyrd]

Suunyslope HS is good because despite it's name half the kids come from very good neighborhoods while the other half get left behind from the bad ones. They focus on the good kids and get good results with them. If they had created two schools for the two groups of kids and split the faculty up at random the results would be predictable.

There is a ton of school choice in AZ because of all the charters. That's clearly not the answer, if it were we'd be on our way to the top and the opposite is happening.

If people want private schools they need to pay for them themselves. If there aren't enough then rich people need to start more and make scholarships available. I have my doubts about a 200 person english class but just change state law and fund the mandates. No HS classes over 30 and no elementary classes over 25 and all teachers much work in the subject area they were trained in.

I admitt to being ignorant about Goddard's education policies.

[Vicelord John]

I felt like I received a pretty good education at Washington High School.

[glynnjamin]

Sunnyslope actually has some of the highest graduation rates in the city. They work hard to give their poorer students the best opportunities. My wife is the registrar there and she would tell you that they graduate an amazing number of poor kids but they also have a strict 0-tolerance policy that allows them to get rid of the problem kids immediately and ship them to charter schools or other schools in the district. They get a bad rap for being racist but really, they just kick out the kids who fuck around and are distractions. Of course, Slope has the ability to do that because they are bringing in TONS of kids leaving St Mary's and Brophy (because their parents can't afford it any more). Thunderbird, on the other hand, has lost about 600 kids between two years ago and this year. We'll take anyone we can get over here...and it shows.

[phxbyrd]

Even though I have my differences and disapointments about Phil Gordon I think he should move a couple of miles and run for the district 3 congressional seat. That's Shadeggs seat and he's always been against federal dollars for AZ. Gordon has the name recognition and fund raising ability to win and he would be able to team with Mitchell and Pastor to get federal dollars into Maricopa county. McCain could be much worse.

[phxbyrd]

Help me understand what you mean. Thunderbird (where I went) is losing kids because they have kicked them out, they are going to charters, or they have transfered to Slope ?

BTW, it's nice to trim the fat at a school and get rid of the bad kids but if you try to educate all no questions asked it will be reflected in the results no matter how hard you try.

[glynnjamin]

Sorry, 'Slope has a population base of rich kids and really poor kids. They have seen an influx of kids on a variance from other parts of town who have transfered from private schools like Brophy and St Mary's. Their enrollment numbers are excellent and have actually grown over the past two years. The kids who are a problem (drugs, fights, gang affiliation, etc) are kicked out of the school.

Those problem kids go to the next closest school...Thunderbird. We at Thunderbird (where I work), have seen a dramatic drop in enrollment. We went from 1800 kids to 1200 kids in two years. Because we get paid per student, we will accept any and all transfers/variances/etc. Our school went from being one of the highest rated non-private schools in the state (US News) to a school that probably won't meet "Excelling" standards this year. The kids who are here now are terrible. They don't want to be here and they don't try. There are still a few of the rich kids from the mountain that keep this place looking good but it has been overrun by poor minorities who don't care about education.

I went to Greenway and graduated in 2001 - when I graduated, Thunderbird was the richest, nicest, best school in the district. Now it's a joke.

[glynnjamin]

I wish Gordon would run for Governor. I'm not entirely sure why he isn't. He's not my favorite politician but at least he cares about Phoenix and has made it a place that is livable.

[phxbyrd]

I didn't realize you worked at Thunderbird (go Chiefs) so we can actually talk. I went there and live in Moon Valley now. As you must know, Tbird is also a segregated school with rich kids and very poor kids. Why don't they just start kicking out the bad (poor) kids too and they can have the same results as Sunnyslope? Or have all the good Tbird kids flooded North Canyon? If they had drawn the lines in a different manor then a HS serving the area between bell and thunderbird between Lookout Mt. and 19th ave. could have been one of the best in the state year in and out.

[phxbyrd]

I honestly don't know if Gordon has what it takes to be a good governor. US House seems more like his depth. You have me worried about Godard over education now but I do think he's smarter than Gordon.

p.s. what's the story with district 2? I bet it gets blown up after the next census.