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  #9961  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 3:30 AM
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Indeed.

And some Canadian cities are composed nearly entirely of these unsustainable cookie cutter subdivisions: with more to come.

I used my credit card today too, but I did not congratulate myself.
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  #9962  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 1:24 PM
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I came across this, I thought you would be interested :

:: 1278 Mountain Road Plan site ::

http://www.plaza.ca/portfolio/New_Br...016%202012.pdf

Source : http://www.plaza.ca/properties-portfolio.php
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  #9963  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 1:54 PM
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Thread limit

Um guys,

Isn't there some sort of limit to the number of pages a thread can have (or posts)?

We're approaching 500 pages and 10k posts.
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  #9964  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 2:00 PM
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2011 Census - Moncton CMA

Note: Private dwellings occupied by usual residents up 13% from 2006 (population up 9.7%)
This reflects a high rate of residential construction in the Moncton CMA

Footnote: City of Dieppe - Private dwellings occupied by usual residents up 29.8% from 2006 (population up 25.6%)

Last edited by monctonian; Feb 9, 2012 at 2:16 PM.
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  #9965  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 3:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gehrhardt View Post
Um guys,

Isn't there some sort of limit to the number of pages a thread can have (or posts)?

We're approaching 500 pages and 10k posts.
Once you hit roughly 10k posts, they archive the thread and start a new one.

Calgary has a half-dozen archived threads now.
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  #9966  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 3:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ErickMontreal View Post
I came across this, I thought you would be interested :

:: 1278 Mountain Road Plan site ::

http://www.plaza.ca/portfolio/New_Br...016%202012.pdf

Source : http://www.plaza.ca/properties-portfolio.php
That would put it right in front of the community college, wouldn't it?
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  #9967  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 4:00 PM
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Originally Posted by mylesmalley View Post
That would put it right in front of the community college, wouldn't it?
Yep, that's where that grundgy old strip mall used to be before they tore it down last year, right next to DQ.

Plaza Corp also owns the Northwest Centre, and it appears that they are planning a driveway connection between this strip and the Northwest Centre parking lot.

It also should be noted that Plaza Corp has also purchased the old Irving service station lot on the other side of the Northwest Centre too. No indication what would go in there, but it would be a high visibility site, right next to the Wheeler Blvd off ramp. I think it would be a good location for a restaurant chain franchise of some form.

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re: the 10k post limit on the thread - is this something we have to bring to the mods attention or will this occur automatically.....
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  #9968  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 4:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Haliguy View Post
Congrats Moncton on your amazing growth rate. However it won't be the same next time as the migration of the Acadian population into Moncton slows down and as the Ship yard contract and offshore exploration picks up... Halifax is in for a major growth spurt. Oh yes and we will have a new mayor hopefully...haha
I wonder if HFX growth will in turn be tempered next time "as the migration of the Cape Breton population into Halifax slows down".
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  #9969  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 6:13 PM
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The counties of NB with pop changes between 2006-2011 (2001-2006 in brackets)

Northern NB (North of Moncton, for argument's sake)

Kent -616 (+66)
Northumberland -1359 (-1949)
Gloucester -1156 (-3981)
Restigouche -1240 (-2300)
Carleton +387 (-552)
Madawaska -349 (-1540)
Victoria -398 (-853)

Total Change in the North: -4731 (-11175)

Southern NB
York +7212 (+3660)
Sunbury +1601 (-234)
Kings +3481 (+1616)
Queens -622 (-154)
Westmorland +11309 (+8161)
Saint John +1929 (-1786)
Albert +1284 (+814)
Charlotte -349 (-468)

Total Change in the South: +25845 (+11591)


There's no question that the north is still losing people by and large. Every county except Carleton is shrinking (and I expect Carleton's growth is thanks to Fredericton). However, the drop in population has slowed considerably in the last five years. It's hard to say what the cause is. I doubt we'll know until the next batch of data comes out.

I think it's totally unfair to attribute all of Moncton's growth to draining from the North Shore. In fact, based on those numbers, I think it's probably fair to say that less than a quarter of the pop growth here was a result of migrants from the North. We can't forget that Moncton isn't the only draw. A lot of people have gone west and to the other urban areas in the province.

I also have to reject the notion that the spigot is somehow going to get turned off. It's pretty clear we still have another 125k worth of people to poach from up north


Also. I don't' doubt for a second that the shipbuilding contract is going to be great for Halifax, let's not get ahead of ourselves. Once the construction job peak levels off, the city is going to end up with a couple thousand extra jobs including spinoffs. Obviously that's fantastic, but it won't represent more than a 2 or 3% increase in employment in the city. To suggest that a bump like that is going to usher in a golden age of in-migration is a bit naive.
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  #9970  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 6:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mylesmalley View Post
The counties of NB with pop changes between 2006-2011 (2001-2006 in brackets)

Northern NB (North of Moncton, for argument's sake)

Kent -616 (+66)
Northumberland -1359 (-1949)
Gloucester -1156 (-3981)
Restigouche -1240 (-2300)
Carleton +387 (-552)
Madawaska -349 (-1540)
Victoria -398 (-853)

Total Change in the North: -4731 (-11175)

Southern NB
York +7212 (+3660)
Sunbury +1601 (-234)
Kings +3481 (+1616)
Queens -622 (-154)
Westmorland +11309 (+8161)
Saint John +1929 (-1786)
Albert +1284 (+814)
Charlotte -349 (-468)

Total Change in the South: +25845 (+11591)


There's no question that the north is still losing people by and large. Every county except Carleton is shrinking (and I expect Carleton's growth is thanks to Fredericton). However, the drop in population has slowed considerably in the last five years. It's hard to say what the cause is. I doubt we'll know until the next batch of data comes out.

I think it's totally unfair to attribute all of Moncton's growth to draining from the North Shore. In fact, based on those numbers, I think it's probably fair to say that less than a quarter of the pop growth here was a result of migrants from the North. We can't forget that Moncton isn't the only draw. A lot of people have gone west and to the other urban areas in the province.

I also have to reject the notion that the spigot is somehow going to get turned off. It's pretty clear we still have another 125k worth of people to poach from up north
Spot on Myles

If you look at the population gains in Westmorland and Albert Counties, which for all intents and purposes is metro Moncton and environs, it totals 12,593 which is three times the population loss in northern NB.

Even if every single person who decamped the north in the last five years moved to Moncton (which we all know is not credible), that would only account for 1/3 of the population growth in the Moncton region.

I would generously estimate that northern migration accounts for 25% of the population growth in southeastern NB. Perhaps 10% of the population growth is natural (births). By my estimate there have been 2,000-2,500 international immigrants to the region in the last five years. This would be perhaps another 20%. The rest of the population growth (about 45-50%) therefore arises from elsewhere in NB or from other provinces.

As such, even if northern migration stopped completely tomorrow, if everything else remained stable, the metro growth rate would only drop from 9.7% to 7.2%. This would hardly be a catastophe.

It's also interesting to note that this 7.2% figure is very close to the actual growth rate in Moncton and Riverview. This would go along with the presumption that anglophones (generally) settle in these two communities while francophones (generally) settle in Dieppe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mylesmalley View Post
Also. I don't' doubt for a second that the shipbuilding contract is going to be great for Halifax, let's not get ahead of ourselves. Once the construction job peak levels off, the city is going to end up with a couple thousand extra jobs including spinoffs. Obviously that's fantastic, but it won't represent more than a 2 or 3% increase in employment in the city. To suggest that a bump like that is going to usher in a golden age of in-migration is a bit naive.
Also very true Myles. I have heard that the shipbuilding contract will only double the workforce at the Irving Shipyard. This will be about 2,500-3,000 additional employees. You can multiply this by typical family size and also use a multiplier for additional jobs created due to increased economic activity, but it would still be difficult to imagine Halifax's population increasing by more than 25-30,000 as a result of this contract.

This is still excellent news for the Halifax economy and should not be discounted, but will only mean an increase in the population base for the metro Halifax area of about 7-8% (on top of whatever increase would have occurred in any event).

Assuming a 6% base population increase over the next five years with an additional 8% increase due to the shipbuilding contract, Halifax's population could increase to 450,000 by 2016.

I will assume that Moncton's population increase over the next five years won't be quite as high as in the last five, but will still be higher than the base 7.2% growth rate if northern migration were factored out. I will therefore assume a growth rate of 8.5% which will give a Moncton CMA population in 2016 of 150,270.
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Last edited by MonctonRad; Feb 9, 2012 at 7:07 PM.
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  #9971  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 8:30 PM
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Not surprisingly 7 of the top 10 CSDs in NB now reside in the south of the province. Funny that Riverview (town) now has about the same population as Bathurst (city) and Campbellton (city) put together

Top 10 CSD population:


Saint John---70,063
Moncton-----69,074
Fredericton--56,224
Dieppe-------23,310
Riverview----19,128
Quispamsis---17,886
Miramichi-----17,811
Edmundston--16,032
Bathurst-----12,275
Rothesay-----11,947

And not too far off is Moncton Parish (area directly surrounding Moncton).

Moncton-------9,421

If current growth rates continue ( Rothesay @ 2.7, Moncton Parish @ 6.3) Moncton Parish would be a top 10 CSD by 2021!

Riverview remains the most densely populated of the big 10.

Population density of top 10 CSDs:

Riverview----564.6
Moncton-----489.3
Dieppe-------430.8
Fredericton--427.0
Rothesay----343.6
Quispamsis---313.5
Saint John----221.8
Edmundston--149.8
Bathurst-----133.6
Miramichi-----99.0
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  #9972  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 8:40 PM
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While the Moncton CMA didnt go up any spots this time around nationally...our urban area (now population centre) did jump from 30 to 27! Passing Sudbury,
Chicoutimi and Thunder Bay

Also it is now considered a "Large" population center after passing the 100,000 mark
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  #9973  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 8:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mylesmalley View Post
Also. I don't' doubt for a second that the shipbuilding contract is going to be great for Halifax, let's not get ahead of ourselves. Once the construction job peak levels off, the city is going to end up with a couple thousand extra jobs including spinoffs. Obviously that's fantastic, but it won't represent more than a 2 or 3% increase in employment in the city. To suggest that a bump like that is going to usher in a golden age of in-migration is a bit naive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MonctonRad View Post
Also very true Myles. I have heard that the shipbuilding contract will only double the workforce at the Irving Shipyard. This will be about 2,500-3,000 additional employees. You can multiply this by typical family size and also use a multiplier for additional jobs created due to increased economic activity, but it would still be difficult to imagine Halifax's population increasing by more than 25-30,000 as a result of this contract.

This is still excellent news for the Halifax economy and should not be discounted, but will only mean an increase in the population base for the metro Halifax area of about 7-8% (on top of whatever increase would have occurred in any event).

Assuming a 6% base population increase over the next five years with an additional 8% increase due to the shipbuilding contract, Halifax's population could increase to 450,000 by 2016.

I will assume that Moncton's population increase over the next five years won't be quite as high as in the last five, but will still be higher than the base 7.2% growth rate if northern migration were factored out. I will therefore assume a growth rate of 8.5% which will give a Moncton CMA population in 2016 of 150,270.
Fenwick posted this in the Halifax census thread:http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...55#post5584255

Quote:
Here is a link to the undercount estimates for 2006 - http://www12.statcan.gc.ca/census-re...01_2_2-eng.cfm . It seems to vary quite a bit from city to city.

If the net undercount of 2.84% for Halifax in 2006 was applied to the 2011 census numbers then the HRM population would be about 390K x 1.0284 = 401K at the time of the 2011 census.
Since our population growth is likely higher than what the latest census numbers show, your guesstimates on Halifax's future growth are going to be off.

The $25 Billion shipbuilding contract is not just about the shipyard, there will be many spin-offs in all sectors of Halifax's economy. Halifax is also going to benefit from Shells $1 Billion off shore exploration. I would expect in the next decade that Halifax's growth rate will likely be the highest in Atlantic Canada and one of the highest in Canada.


Source



This is only showing the number of Jobs, population figures would be higher due to family members (and that's before the Shell announcement).

I wouldn't be surprised if you see a lot more New Brunswickers (including Monctonians) headed for Halifax for work in the coming decade.

And it's a little naive to think that Moncton will maintain a high rate of growth.

Not trying to bicker but if you guys keep bringing up Halifax...
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  #9974  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 9:02 PM
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THE BIG 3

Census Subdivision



CMA/CA


Last edited by mmmatt; Feb 9, 2012 at 9:37 PM.
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  #9975  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 9:23 PM
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Originally Posted by q12 View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if you see a lot more New Brunswickers (including Monctonians) headed for Halifax for work in the coming decade.

And it's a little naive to think that Moncton will maintain a high rate of growth.

Not trying to bicker but if you guys keep bringing up Halifax...
I also think it's a little naive to assume that the only community in Atlantic Canada that will benefit from the shipbuilding contract will be Halifax.

I fully expect Saint John to see significant benefit with their industrial base. Moncton has a strong base in transportation and logistics as well as metal fabrication shops and other potential suppliers as well.

Moncton will continue to do very well q12. But thanks for your concern in any event.
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  #9976  
Old Posted Feb 9, 2012, 11:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by q12 View Post
Fenwick posted this in the Halifax census thread:http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...55#post5584255



Since our population growth is likely higher than what the latest census numbers show, your guesstimates on Halifax's future growth are going to be off.

The $25 Billion shipbuilding contract is not just about the shipyard, there will be many spin-offs in all sectors of Halifax's economy. Halifax is also going to benefit from Shells $1 Billion off shore exploration. I would expect in the next decade that Halifax's growth rate will likely be the highest in Atlantic Canada and one of the highest in Canada.


Source



This is only showing the number of Jobs, population figures would be higher due to family members (and that's before the Shell announcement).

I wouldn't be surprised if you see a lot more New Brunswickers (including Monctonians) headed for Halifax for work in the coming decade.

And it's a little naive to think that Moncton will maintain a high rate of growth.

Not trying to bicker but if you guys keep bringing up Halifax...
A billion isn't as much as you think it is

And again, I'm not arguing that it will be big for Halifax. It isn't going to change the world though.

Indulge my assumptions. These are all hilariously rough estimates.

Let's say for arguments sake that every cent of that 25bn gets spent on jobs in Halifax. If you take an hourly rate of 75 (which is realistic considering overhead expenses, skills shortages driving up wars, and assuming the unions get involved). If you assume those wages stay constant with inflation, those wages will essentially double over the life of the contract. So, average it all out at 100$ an hour. 25bn, divided by 2000 hours per year, divided by 100 dollars per hour, times 25 years averages out to 5000 jobs for 25 years.

5,000 is a lot of jobs! If you double it because of spinoffs, you're left with 10k. Toss in families, etc, and you'll definitely see a big bump in population.


BUT... A very large component of that 25bn is going to be raw materials, equipment, and components. I'm not going to guess what percentage that is, however in manufacturing it isn't unrealistic for that to come in at more than 50% of your total cost. Now included in that is the significant components that will be coming from away, including raw materials. Unless I'm mistaken, there aren't any sizeable steel foundries in Atlantic Canada, so your raw steel is going to have to come from away. Raw materials component production certainly produces direct and spinoff jobs, but there's no net benefit to Halifax if it happens to be done anywhere else.

Then of course are the hundreds if not thousands of sub-contractors who do everything from soup to nuts. Sure, a lot will be from Halifax, but that work is going to be spread all over Nova Scotia and the Maritimes. Work being done by a fab shop in New Glasgow is great for the province, but won't contribute whatsoever to jobs or population growth in Halifax.

So at the of the day, all you can do is take the most jobs possible, and subtract away. Every penny that isn't spent in Halifax is one that's helping create jobs away.

So there. Pick it apart if you want. I know it isn't air tight. But an awful lot of this type of contract is hyping it up. I can't state this enough that this type of work coming to the east coast is huge. But by no means is it a guarantee that we'll be dug out of the economic hole we've been in for decades. If anything, this should be the thing that kickstarts Maritime ambition and encourages going after even more big contracts like this.
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  #9977  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2012, 2:14 AM
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Quote:
Turner Drake & Partners Ltd

Market Survey :: December 2011

:: Office Vacancy Rate ::

We also included all the major centres in Atlantic Canada. The overall vacancy rate by location is as follows: Greater Fredericton 6.43%; Greater Saint John 10.73%; Greater Moncton 6.69%; Greater St. John’s 3.53%; Halifax Regional Municipality 7.89%; Greater Charlottetown 12.95%.

:: Warehouse Vacancy Rate ::

Our survey includes all the major centres in Atlantic Canada. The overall vacancy rate by location is as follows: Greater Fredericton 8.92%; Greater Saint John 1.42%; Greater Moncton 5.82%; Greater St. John’s 3.32%; Halifax Regional Municipality 7.81%; Greater Charlottetown 22.09%.

Source : https://www.turnerdrake.com/survey/attachments/103.pdf
Erick posted this on the Saint John thread. Note that the office vacancy rate in Moncton is currently a respectable 6.7%, similar to Fredericton and less than SJ, Charlottetown and Halifax.

If the rate falls a little bit more, this could give impetus to some new office construction in the downtown.
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  #9978  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2012, 12:33 PM
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Mountain Road

Does anyone know what is "store" is going up on mountain road. It looks like some kind of coffee store? It is up by the petro Canada?

Any new news on stores opening up downtown? I wonder what will happen to Passages, Betty Rubin, Olivier, and Samuel & Co.? Maybe they will open up downtown?
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  #9979  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2012, 12:47 PM
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Moncton's free parking deal could cost $42M

A controversial parking deal signed with a Toronto developer is coming back to haunt Moncton and could cost the city as much as $42 million.

The contract, which was supposed to expire next month, was signed 10 years ago to provide free parking for the Roger's call centre. The call centre is located on some prime downtown real estate in the city.

In 2002, the city offered 385 free parking spots where the developer built the call centre. The contract has the potential to increase that number of free parking spots to 490.

Coun. Brian Hicks said the contract with Rogers was supposed to be for 10 years, but he was furious when he saw the deal's fine print.

Hick said he does not remember being warned about clauses that allow the developer to extend the life of the contract.

“When you read it carefully, you could come up with a scenario, others have, that this is a 50-year parking deal and not a 10-year parking deal,” he said.

Hicks has been trying ever since to find out how that happened to the contract.

Hicks said the contract goes on to say, if the developer puts a building on the parking lot, the city still has to come up with the free parking spots.

The implications of a 50-year free parking contract could be significant, according to the city councillor.

Hicks said 50 years of lost parking revenue on prime real estate adds up to $42 million.

CBC News
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-br...rking-653.html
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  #9980  
Old Posted Feb 10, 2012, 12:51 PM
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this is a 50-year parking deal and not a 10-year parking deal

I hate to inflame the community but this needs to be shared

As reported on CBC.CA - ROGERS EYESORE PARKING for 50 YEARS

Quote:
In 2002, the city offered 385 free parking spots where the developer built the call centre. The contract has the potential to increase that number of free parking spots to 490.

Coun. Brian Hicks said the contract with Rogers was supposed to be for 10 years, but he was furious when he saw the deal's fine print.

Hick said he does not remember being warned about clauses that allow the developer to extend the life of the contract.

“When you read it carefully, you could come up with a scenario, others have, that this is a 50-year parking deal and not a 10-year parking deal,” he said.

Hicks has been trying ever since to find out how that happened to the contract.

Hicks said the contract goes on to say, if the developer puts a building on the parking lot, the city still has to come up with the free parking spots.
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-br...rking-653.html

Who signed a contract without reading it?
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