[Halifax] The Jade & Green Lantern (1595 Barrington) | Completed

[xanaxanax]

Also I don't know where people are getting the impression New Discovery Center Still needs to be built, Emera built the facility already, its built, the Discovery Center is leasing it for free for 25 years, its just interior design work for 40,000 sq feet and purchases of new exhibits that and some small work to the sounding area on the rounds with signage and painting the building ect... Thats does not require a huge time frame of years of work, they have 17 or so million founded for this project confirmed, and they should start spending it on resources while they wait and encourage for more financial donations, I know I would be more inclined to money if this was moving in a more forward direction. How big of a difference is that extra 2 million they are waiting for going to make and once the new location is operating with free rent I'm sure their revenue is going to be a lot larger than what it is now with a lot more people visiting it. I bet the New Discovery Center could realistically be operating in 6 or 7 or so months from tomorrow.

Look they have $6,000,000 from the Province of Nova Scotia, $3,000,000 from the Federal Government, $2,000,000 from the City of Halifax, $1,000,000 from Nova Scotia Power with addition of a with a free 25-year lease , $1,000,000 Medavie Health Foundation, The claimed to be over 50% over of their private sector target which would be another $4,000,000 confirmed, they must have some financial capital they've been saving up for this. I think the hold ups and delays are unreasonable and I honestly don't understand why they are the slightest bit necessary to push this off for another year or possibly two years.

[Alex Hawk]

Was away for a bit. Some good counterpoints raised by counterfactual and company. I don't think anyone wants to delay Barrington St developments. The street is starting to come back and there a few projects that will really make a difference. It's a bit ironic that Reznick was being interviewed about delays. I think many Haligonians will be scratching their heads on the timing of his well placed interview with the Herald, knowing the history of this "developer/investor". Why is it ok for him to wait decades until the timing is right for his development but not allow other developers like Ghosn the time to do it right. The Discovery Centre is really the red herring. It was an opportunistic moment for Ghosn to buy himself some more time to raise capital and market the new property so he can differentiate his project from other competitors --- like Reznick. In any event the Roy will be great for the City in just 2 years we'll see construction cranes at 1595 around the time that the convention centre will be nearly complete along with some other major projects closeby.

[Alex Hawk]

Originally Posted by xanaxanax

Also I don't know where people are getting the impression New Discovery Center Still needs to be built, Emera built the facility already, its built, the Discovery Center is leasing it for free for 25 years, its just interior design work for 40,000 sq feet and purchases of new exhibits that and some small work to the sounding area on the rounds with signage and painting the building ect... Thats does not require a huge time frame of years of work, they have 17 or so million founded for this project confirmed, and they should start spending it on resources while they wait and encourage for more financial donations, I know I would be more inclined to money if this was moving in a more forward direction. How big of a difference is that extra 2 million they are waiting for going to make and once the new location is operating with free rent I'm sure their revenue is going to be a lot larger than what it is now with a lot more people visiting it. I bet the New Discovery Center could realistically be operating in 6 or 7 or so months from tomorrow.

Look they have $6,000,000 from the Province of Nova Scotia, $3,000,000 from the Federal Government, $2,000,000 from the City of Halifax, $1,000,000 from Nova Scotia Power with addition of a with a free 25-year lease , $1,000,000 Medavie Health Foundation, The claimed to be over 50% over of their private sector target which would be another $4,000,000 confirmed, they must have some financial capital they've been saving up for this. I think the hold ups and delays are unreasonable and I honestly don't understand why they are the slightest bit necessary to push this off for another year or possibly two years.

On the surface it might seem like a simple project but what we are dealing with is a concrete empty shell. I would guess a year of construction on the building itself with some significant structural/mechanical work. Then the exhibits if custom manufactured will take 18 months from concept to commissioning. So maybe it could be done in 1.5 years. Will try to dig up some info.

[fenwick16]

Originally Posted by Alex Hawk

On the surface it might seem like a simple project but what we are dealing with is a concrete empty shell. I would guess a year of construction on the building itself with some significant structural/mechanical work. Then the exhibits if custom manufactured will take 18 months from concept to commissioning. So maybe it could be done in 1.5 years. Will try to dig up some info.

Thanks for the information Alex Hawk. It is the empty concrete shell shown in the picture below. That section was formerly occupied by the Electropolis Studios, I believe. NSPI didn't do any work on that section that I am aware of.

There is a thread for the new Discovery Centre with a few renderings at this link - http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=205365

[Alex Hawk]

I found out that the ceiling height of the new build is 72ft and a 14,000 sqft footprint. If they build 4 floors and assuming generous common areas deductions, they should be able to fit up at least 50,000 sqft at $200 sqft that's $10m for the building alone. Not sure how much new exhibits cost per sqft. and how much floor space will be exhibit related vs. other functions. I think 18 months turnkey is a realistic timeline to commissioning if they start in April. So we're looking at December 2015 or early 2016 opening.

[fenwick16]

On May 20th, Council will give first reading and schedule a public hearing for the construction start extension for the 1595 Barrington development agreement (DA).

In this document (page 16 of the pdf document) - http://halifax.ca/council/agendasc/d...520ca1116i.pdf, the planning and permit application timetable is given by the WM Fares Group (in a letter to Richard Harvey).

• April 8, 2014: Complete preliminary drawings including, site plan, floor plans and building elevations
• April 9, 2014: Complete Landscape plan
• April 10, 2014: Complete Wind Tunnel Study
• April 11, 2014: Submit Development Permit application
• June 2, 2014: Submit Building Permit application

Hopefully more detailed plans will be posted on the halifax.ca website soon. It is good to see that this 15 storey tower is proceeding towards the building permit stage.

[Dmajackson]

DA Extension was approved tonight by Regional Council. They have until Summer 2016 to get the building footings in place. Only Councillor Watts dissented (she voted against the original proposal as well).

[hoser111]

Originally Posted by Dmajackson

DA Extension was approved tonight by Regional Council. They have until Summer 2016 to get the building footings in place. Only Councillor Watts dissented (she voted against the original proposal as well).

wtf is her problem?

[Waye Mason]

Originally Posted by hoser111

wtf is her problem?

I almost voted against this. The debate was really good, council was on the fence. The issue was complicated because this is an extension of an exemption to HRMbyDesign and the Barrington Street Conservation district.

Basically - when Council approves a DA it has a time limit on it. They are approved in the context of what is happening at that time and expected to build the building in that time, not land bank the land forever. (Empire group and International Place, right?).

If Council offered extensions to everyone all the time then there would be a ton of land banking, no incentive to developers to get on with it or lose the opportunity. And the context of an approval can change, if the rules/other buildings/transportation and infrastructure change, so you may want to revisit the approval, and make different demands/requirements if enough time passes.

Voting to extend a development agreement because of a tenant issue is not usually done - in this case it was because 3 levels of govt approved giving the Discovery Centre 22 mil but the approvals were delayed because of the provincial election and whatnot. Construction of the new DC should have been started a year ago, it starts this month. I believe the developer would go ahead if the extension was not granted, but really relocating the Discovery Centre 2 times in 18 months is not good for the centre.

I would not vote for another extension, the owner needs to fish or cut bait.

[xanaxanax]

Originally Posted by Waye Mason

I almost voted against this. The debate was really good, council was on the fence. The issue was complicated because this is an extension of an exemption to HRMbyDesign and the Barrington Street Conservation district.

Basically - when Council approves a DA it has a time limit on it. They are approved in the context of what is happening at that time and expected to build the building in that time, not land bank the land forever. (Empire group and International Place, right?).

If Council offered extensions to everyone all the time then there would be a ton of land banking, no incentive to developers to get on with it or lose the opportunity. And the context of an approval can change, if the rules/other buildings/transportation and infrastructure change, so you may want to revisit the approval, and make different demands/requirements if enough time passes.

Voting to extend a development agreement because of a tenant issue is not usually done - in this case it was because 3 levels of govt approved giving the Discovery Centre 22 mil but the approvals were delayed because of the provincial election and whatnot. Construction of the new DC should have been started a year ago, it starts this month. I believe the developer would go ahead if the extension was not granted, but really relocating the Discovery Centre 2 times in 18 months is not good for the centre.

I would not vote for another extension, the owner needs to fish or cut bait.

Waye did you have any talks with the developer about starting construction without disrupting the Discovery Centre

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Waye Mason

I almost voted against this. The debate was really good, council was on the fence. The issue was complicated because this is an extension of an exemption to HRMbyDesign and the Barrington Street Conservation district.

Basically - when Council approves a DA it has a time limit on it. They are approved in the context of what is happening at that time and expected to build the building in that time, not land bank the land forever. (Empire group and International Place, right?).

If Council offered extensions to everyone all the time then there would be a ton of land banking, no incentive to developers to get on with it or lose the opportunity. And the context of an approval can change, if the rules/other buildings/transportation and infrastructure change, so you may want to revisit the approval, and make different demands/requirements if enough time passes.

Voting to extend a development agreement because of a tenant issue is not usually done - in this case it was because 3 levels of govt approved giving the Discovery Centre 22 mil but the approvals were delayed because of the provincial election and whatnot. Construction of the new DC should have been started a year ago, it starts this month. I believe the developer would go ahead if the extension was not granted, but really relocating the Discovery Centre 2 times in 18 months is not good for the centre.

I would not vote for another extension, the owner needs to fish or cut bait.

Thanks for your insight. It helps make sense of the whole process for those of us not intimately involved with it.

[halifaxboyns]

We have the same problem out here in Calgary but since we are dealing with Development Permits; it comes down to the date of commencement of construction. We offer a maximum of two (2) extensions for one (1) year. After that; sucks to be you...

I ran into that problem on a file in one of our Transit Oriented Development areas - they had their two extensions and I had to tell them sorry, no more.
I agree with Waye, the debate was good and I actually expected more councillors on the no side (as a level of impatience). I suspect if this comes back, you will see a resounding march to the negative side. Either build it or don't...

[Dmajackson]

A construction permit valued at $156'000 has been issued for this site. Work will begin after the Discovery Centre moves.

[Dmajackson]

Just as a side note Reflections Cabaret is moving the first week of September into the former TAO space in the Freemasons Building.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Looks like the new Discovery Centre will be getting some cash inflow:

http://thechronicleherald.ca/metro/1...bank-of-canada

I wonder if that might speed up the move?

[Waye Mason]

I am so happy this is finally public I am posting it myself.

From the staff report:

The Barrington Street commercial frontage will be reinstated following the original intention of the 1896 design. Granville Street will be revitalized with a commercial façade at pedestrian level. The Granville Street façade as well as the vertical addition will be simple in design and detail so as not to overwhelm the historic character and importance of the original building. Rhythm, materiality and scale of the new portion of the building will be complimentary to the original structure as well as the surrounding historical city fabric.

There will be 63 total residential units plus approximately 3,900 sq. ft. of commercial space at grade. A total of 29 parking stalls are provided, this represents less than a 2 to 1 unit to parking ratio.





I worked for two years trying to get the former owner to act. He kept backing away from acting saying it was an impossible site, which given the insurance money and snow load money he had coming at him made no sense to me. The price he wanted was frankly too high for the developable space the project yields, and the only way it worked was the Ghosn's doing this at the same time they do the Zellers/Discovery next door.

The Ghosn's have become really strongly committed to the heritage restoration part of this project, and it just makes sense for them to do it all at the same time. The Zellers project is going ahead as scheduled at the end of the extension. That corner will be transformed. Very excited.

[fenwick16]

Originally Posted by Waye Mason

I am so happy this is finally public I am posting it myself.

From the staff report:

The Barrington Street commercial frontage will be reinstated following the original intention of the 1896 design. Granville Street will be revitalized with a commercial façade at pedestrian level. The Granville Street façade as well as the vertical addition will be simple in design and detail so as not to overwhelm the historic character and importance of the original building. Rhythm, materiality and scale of the new portion of the building will be complimentary to the original structure as well as the surrounding historical city fabric.

There will be 63 total residential units plus approximately 3,900 sq. ft. of commercial space at grade. A total of 29 parking stalls are provided, this represents less than a 2 to 1 unit to parking ratio.

http://wayemason.ca/wp-content/uploa...enlantern1.jpg

http://wayemason.ca/wp-content/uploa...enlantern2.jpg

I worked for two years trying to get the former owner to act. He kept backing away from acting saying it was an impossible site, which given the insurance money and snow load money he had coming at him made no sense to me. The price he wanted was frankly too high for the developable space the project yields, and the only way it worked was the Ghosn's doing this at the same time they do the Zellers/Discovery next door.

The Ghosn's have become really strongly committed to the heritage restoration part of this project, and it just makes sense for them to do it all at the same time. The Zellers project is going ahead as scheduled at the end of the extension. That corner will be transformed. Very excited.

This looks fantastic. This and the Zellers project will be great for the city.

Waye, another great project for Barrington Street is the NFB building. Can you give an update on the progress, please?

[Keith P.]

The addition on top looks terrible from the Barrington side. Reminds me of the kind of undersized additions that owners of old buildings used to erect in the '50s/'60s. No doubt it is constrained by the height-phobic restrictions imposed on d/t though so this is what we are stuck with.

By contrast, the Granville side finally looks like something you would want.

[Drybrain]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

The addition on top looks terrible from the Barrington side. Reminds me of the kind of undersized additions that owners of old buildings used to erect in the '50s/'60s. No doubt it is constrained by the height-phobic restrictions imposed on d/t though so this is what we are stuck with.

By contrast, the Granville side finally looks like something you would want.

Maybe, but it could simply be a desire to maintain the historical massing as seen from Barrington Street.

Anyway, for a building that was being written off as a teardown only 12 months ago, I'm not going to nitpick what looks like a generally excellent restoration.

[hokus83]

wish it was taller