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  #981  
Old Posted Feb 1, 2011, 6:01 PM
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Originally Posted by halifaxboyns View Post
I'm actually not surprised. Easements are really tricky legal things - honestly I had one application here in Calgary that required and easement and it got hung up for 6 months going through legal. So it's probably not the fault of planners; it's lawyers.

....says the planner!


(just kidding!!!)
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  #982  
Old Posted Feb 2, 2011, 1:24 AM
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Sounds like council delayed again on the easement
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  #983  
Old Posted Feb 2, 2011, 1:43 AM
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How did they delay it?
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  #984  
Old Posted Feb 2, 2011, 1:46 AM
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How did they delay it?
granting an easement subject to negotiation on the value of the easement.
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  #985  
Old Posted Feb 2, 2011, 1:54 AM
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So we are stuck with that bombed out hole at least into the tourist season?
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  #986  
Old Posted Feb 2, 2011, 2:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Jstaleness View Post
So we are stuck with that bombed out hole at least into the tourist season?
Who knows i hope not, but after watching council tonight its no surprise why it takes so long to get things done in this city.
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  #987  
Old Posted Feb 2, 2011, 3:37 AM
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Originally Posted by hoser111 View Post
....says the planner!


(just kidding!!!)
I shared SDM's confusion and frustration. Although I will say - in my case, the delay was very much because of the COC law department. They give a new meaning of 'anal retentive' - i'm sure their furniture budget is sky high since they'd keep sucking up chairs.
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  #988  
Old Posted Feb 2, 2011, 11:08 AM
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Waterside Centre still in limbo

Ryan Taplin/Metro
Waterside Centre
JENNIFER TAPLIN
METRO HALIFAX
Published: February 02, 2011 12:04 a.m.
Last modified: February 01, 2011 11:43 p.m.

Council approved one application and put off another regarding the Waterside Centre on Lower Water Street.

Armour Group has waited over eight months for an encroachment and an easement so they can run a pipe from the development under the street and Historic Properties to the harbour. Seawater will be used for heating and cooling.

Last night council approved the encroachment for the road work, but put off the easement for the work across Historic Properties. After voting down a concession Armour requested on the encroachment, council voted in favour of a standard encroachment contract. But the assessment numbers on the easement didn’t make sense so Coun. Sue Uteck moved to put it off a week to negotiate an easement fee.
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  #989  
Old Posted Feb 2, 2011, 5:20 PM
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It doesn't seem like much of a stretch to imagine that extra council and staff time will cost more than the increase in fees that the city will negotiate.
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  #990  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2011, 9:29 PM
fenwick16 fenwick16 is offline
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Originally Posted by sdm View Post
Waterside Centre still in limbo

Ryan Taplin/Metro
Waterside Centre
JENNIFER TAPLIN
METRO HALIFAX
Published: February 02, 2011 12:04 a.m.
Last modified: February 01, 2011 11:43 p.m.

Council approved one application and put off another regarding the Waterside Centre on Lower Water Street.

Armour Group has waited over eight months for an encroachment and an easement so they can run a pipe from the development under the street and Historic Properties to the harbour. Seawater will be used for heating and cooling.

Last night council approved the encroachment for the road work, but put off the easement for the work across Historic Properties. After voting down a concession Armour requested on the encroachment, council voted in favour of a standard encroachment contract. But the assessment numbers on the easement didn’t make sense so Coun. Sue Uteck moved to put it off a week to negotiate an easement fee.
Was this ever resolved? Surely they can't still be negotating the easement fee?

There is a letter attached in this link that explains the Armour Group position - http://www.halifax.ca/council/agenda...0201ca1115.pdf. It also explains where the salt water pipes for the cooling will go through Historic Properties - a 6 ft wide "Centre Court Pedestrian Walkway". So when people see this area being dug up, we will know that it has been resolved.

Although this news story is a year old, it explains the difficulties involved with the restoration - http://www.armourgroup.com/news.php?news_id=88.

Last edited by fenwick16; Mar 12, 2011 at 9:42 PM. Reason: added a sentence
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  #991  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2011, 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted by fenwick16 View Post
Surely they can't still be negotating the easement fee?
Given the HRM I wouldn't be so sure (see Jazz thread for example).
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  #992  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2011, 12:18 AM
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Originally Posted by fenwick16 View Post
Was this ever resolved? Surely they can't still be negotating the easement fee?

There is a letter attached in this link that explains the Armour Group position - http://www.halifax.ca/council/agenda...0201ca1115.pdf. It also explains where the salt water pipes for the cooling will go through Historic Properties - a 6 ft wide "Centre Court Pedestrian Walkway". So when people see this area being dug up, we will know that it has been resolved.

Although this news story is a year old, it explains the difficulties involved with the restoration - http://www.armourgroup.com/news.php?news_id=88.
Those pipes, the one in the six foot easement, were put in place back in 2005 when there was site work done down there. So there won't be any digging.

One of the hurdles that slowed it down was that council wanted to increase the size of the pipes so other building could use them. Problem was to do that would be a significant cost to the developer because they would have had to dig up all the new site work, remove the pipes they already put there and buy new pipe then redo the site work.

There was a compromise in the end in that the developer allowed the city to increase the range of use for an existing easement (the parking lot to the south) already traveling through the property.
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  #993  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2011, 10:17 PM
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Posting this here mainly because most of it turns out to be talking to McCrea about the Waterside Centre, and because I couldn't find any current threads discussing the office situation.

Quote:
Offices shifting to suburbs
Migration from downtown Halifax 'recipe for disaster'
By CHRIS LAMBIE Business Editor
Thu, Apr 28 - 4:54 AM

Downtown Halifax office vacancy rates are high and developer Ben McCrea says he expects them to go up even more.

Cushman & Wakefield Atlantic has released numbers for the first quarter of this year indicating the overall office vacancy downtown is 8.9 per cent. Class A vacancy rates for downtown sit at 12.5 per cent.

"Vacancy rates have gone from . . . four and five per cent (in 2004 and 2005), they are now 12 and they are still going up," McCrea, Armour Group’s founder and chairman, said Wednesday.

"So there’s a huge movement of firms out of the downtown."

The downtown core has about 4.4 million square feet of office space.

"The downtown has given up space now for probably 10 quarters running," said Bill MacAvoy, managing director with Cushman & Wakefield Atlantic.

Suburban Halifax has 2.7 million square feet of office space. According to MacAvoy, overall office vacancy rates in the suburbs were 5.9 per cent for the first three months of this year. Class A office space in the suburbs had a 9.5 per cent

vacancy rate.

"They’ve been dropping rapidly," MacAvoy said. "In the last 90 days, there was 33,000 square feet absorbed."

That doesn’t bode well for Armour’s proposed $16-million, nine-storey Waterside Centre on Upper Water Street.

"As long as there’s negative absorption and firms keep moving to the suburbs, there’s not much market for a new office building," McCrea said.

Armour is still trying to secure tenants for the Waterside, he said.

"You’re not going to find very many people, if any, that are prepared to do speculative office buildings in this environment," McCrea said.

Last September, commercial real estate services firm CB Richard Ellis Ltd. said Halifax’s suburban office vacancy rate was 7.5 per cent, compared with 12.6 per cent in the fall of the previous year. The downtown office vacancy rate last September was 10.3 per cent, up from 6.9 per cent in the fall of 2009.

"That trend continues today and there doesn’t seem to be a bottom," McCrea said Wednesday.

That, coupled with construction costs in the downtown core being about 30 per cent higher than in the suburbs, creates "a recipe for disaster and the city doesn’t seem to be doing anything about it," he said.

"I think they’re back talking about chickens again."

Armour’s still waiting on an easement from the city that would allow the company to pipe sea water to the Waterside to help reduce the project’s cooling and heating costs.

"I don’t believe it’s a financial consideration anymore," McCrea said.

"We’re not negotiating; we’re just in a waiting mode."

He has been waiting more than a year for the easement.

"It is very difficult to negotiate with tenants and make commitments to tenants or make representations to tenants that were going to do something like a LEED gold building when we do not have the capacity at the moment to make good on it."

LEED is an acronym for leadership in energy and environmental design standards.

Demolition on the project started a year ago. The demolition involves the facades of six historical buildings on a block bounded by Hollis, Duke and Upper Water streets being maintained while a nine-storey metal and glass structure is built on the inside.

"That was a bad mistake because we ended up with a mess down there," McCrea said. "We’ve gone about boarding it up as best we can to try to make it half-decent. So we’ve tried to make it less of an eyesore. We’re just in complete exasperation with the lack of any progress on it. It’s gets to the point of being embarrassing."

Armour can’t go any further with the demolition without "putting an exterior structural hoarding around the whole thing, closing off all the sidewalks, closing off parts of the street, and I’m not doing that until we’re in a better position than we are today."

Armour and the Waterfront Development Corp. announced last fall they had agreed on a conceptual plan for the $70-million private portion of the $190-million Queen’s Landing development on the waterfront between Sackville Landing and Cable Wharf. The private component includes 100,000 square feet of new office space, a 200-room, four-star hotel with harbour views from every room and underground parking.

McCrea, whose company rebuilt Historic Properties in the 1970s, wouldn’t say what Armour’s construction deadline is under its deal with the provincial Crown corporation.

"Our agreement with the province and the Waterfront Development Corp. has a fairly lengthy time frame. That’s confidential. I’m not going to get into that. But it’s longer than normal because we saw this coming."

( clambie@herald.ca)
Source: http://thechronicleherald.ca/Business/1240480.html
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  #994  
Old Posted Apr 28, 2011, 10:51 PM
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I was about to post that here as well. It's a pretty depressing article overall, particularly where it confirms that Amour is still wating for the easement and it's been over a year. At least McRea is still trying to push forward and hasn't given up or anything. And it's nice to hear anything about Queen's Landing.

I happened to have some photos of the site circa last week (obviously nothing has changed there but sometimes I just like taking pictures, ha).



and the boarded up windows he mentioned in the article (forgive the black and white, I can never leave pictures alone...)
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  #995  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2011, 12:30 AM
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I get the impression that Ben McCrea isn't pushing ahead with this because of lack of pre-leasing contracts. Is it really the municipality holding this up or is it Ben McCrea?

quoted from the Chronicle Herald Story posted above.
Quote:
Armour is still trying to secure tenants for the Waterside, he said.

That doesn’t bode well for Armour’s proposed $16-million, nine-storey Waterside Centre on Upper Water Street.

"As long as there’s negative absorption and firms keep moving to the suburbs, there’s not much market for a new office building," McCrea said.

Armour is still trying to secure tenants for the Waterside, he said.

"You’re not going to find very many people, if any, that are prepared to do speculative office buildings in this environment," McCrea said.

Last September, commercial real estate services firm CB Richard Ellis Ltd. said Halifax’s suburban office vacancy rate was 7.5 per cent, compared with 12.6 per cent in the fall of the previous year. The downtown office vacancy rate last September was 10.3 per cent, up from 6.9 per cent in the fall of 2009.

"That trend continues today and there doesn’t seem to be a bottom," McCrea said Wednesday.

That, coupled with construction costs in the downtown core being about 30 per cent higher than in the suburbs, creates "a recipe for disaster and the city doesn’t seem to be doing anything about it," he said.

"I think they’re back talking about chickens again."

Armour’s still waiting on an easement from the city that would allow the company to pipe sea water to the Waterside to help reduce the project’s cooling and heating costs.

"I don’t believe it’s a financial consideration anymore," McCrea said.

"We’re not negotiating; we’re just in a waiting mode."


Hopefully the Waterside won't become like the Toronto Stump - Bay Adelaide Centre . This stump of a tower remained partly completed for about 15 years in downtown Toronto before it was dismantled and redeveloped.



Residential development can still be pursued in the downtown core, so it isn't a hopeless situation. Having lots of residential projects in the downtown core would probably be a better goal than almost all commercial, since it will result in a more vibrant downtown core with lots of pedestrians to support retail developments. It seemed to work in Toronto; when there was little office tower construction there seemed to be many condo towers being built.
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  #996  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2011, 12:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fenwick16 View Post
I get the impression that Ben McCrea isn't pushing ahead with this because of lack of pre-leasing contracts. Is it really the municipality holding this up or is it Ben McCrea?

quoted from the Chronicle Herald Story posted above.




Hopefully the Waterside won't become like the Toronto Stump - Bay Adelaide Centre . This stump of a tower remained partly completed for about 15 years in downtown Toronto before it was dismantled and redeveloped.



Residential development can still be pursued in the downtown core, so it isn't a hopeless situation. Having lots of residential projects in the downtown core would probably be a better goal than almost all commercial, since it will result in a more vibrant downtown core with lots of pedestrians to support retail developments. It seemed to work in Toronto; when there was little office tower construction there seemed to be many condo towers being built.
Ideally the city would expropriate Waterside and restore the gutted registered heritage buildings with some help from the province and feds. We would then have a true historic district.
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  #997  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2011, 1:27 AM
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Quote:
Offices shifting to suburbs
Migration from downtown Halifax 'recipe for disaster'
By CHRIS LAMBIE Business Editor
Thu, Apr 28 - 4:54 AM

Downtown Halifax office vacancy rates are high and developer Ben McCrea says he expects them to go up even more.

Cushman & Wakefield Atlantic has released numbers for the first quarter of this year indicating the overall office vacancy downtown is 8.9 per cent. Class A vacancy rates for downtown sit at 12.5 per cent.

"Vacancy rates have gone from . . . four and five per cent (in 2004 and 2005), they are now 12 and they are still going up," McCrea, Armour Group’s founder and chairman, said Wednesday.

"So there’s a huge movement of firms out of the downtown."

The downtown core has about 4.4 million square feet of office space.

"The downtown has given up space now for probably 10 quarters running," said Bill MacAvoy, managing director with Cushman & Wakefield Atlantic.

Suburban Halifax has 2.7 million square feet of office space. According to MacAvoy, overall office vacancy rates in the suburbs were 5.9 per cent for the first three months of this year. Class A office space in the suburbs had a 9.5 per cent

vacancy rate.

"They’ve been dropping rapidly," MacAvoy said. "In the last 90 days, there was 33,000 square feet absorbed."

That doesn’t bode well for Armour’s proposed $16-million, nine-storey Waterside Centre on Upper Water Street.

"As long as there’s negative absorption and firms keep moving to the suburbs, there’s not much market for a new office building," McCrea said.

Armour is still trying to secure tenants for the Waterside, he said.

"You’re not going to find very many people, if any, that are prepared to do speculative office buildings in this environment," McCrea said.

Last September, commercial real estate services firm CB Richard Ellis Ltd. said Halifax’s suburban office vacancy rate was 7.5 per cent, compared with 12.6 per cent in the fall of the previous year. The downtown office vacancy rate last September was 10.3 per cent, up from 6.9 per cent in the fall of 2009.

"That trend continues today and there doesn’t seem to be a bottom," McCrea said Wednesday.

That, coupled with construction costs in the downtown core being about 30 per cent higher than in the suburbs, creates "a recipe for disaster and the city doesn’t seem to be doing anything about it," he said.

"I think they’re back talking about chickens again."

Armour’s still waiting on an easement from the city that would allow the company to pipe sea water to the Waterside to help reduce the project’s cooling and heating costs.

"I don’t believe it’s a financial consideration anymore," McCrea said.

"We’re not negotiating; we’re just in a waiting mode."

He has been waiting more than a year for the easement.

"It is very difficult to negotiate with tenants and make commitments to tenants or make representations to tenants that were going to do something like a LEED gold building when we do not have the capacity at the moment to make good on it."

LEED is an acronym for leadership in energy and environmental design standards.

Demolition on the project started a year ago. The demolition involves the facades of six historical buildings on a block bounded by Hollis, Duke and Upper Water streets being maintained while a nine-storey metal and glass structure is built on the inside.

"That was a bad mistake because we ended up with a mess down there," McCrea said. "We’ve gone about boarding it up as best we can to try to make it half-decent. So we’ve tried to make it less of an eyesore. We’re just in complete exasperation with the lack of any progress on it. It’s gets to the point of being embarrassing."

Armour can’t go any further with the demolition without "putting an exterior structural hoarding around the whole thing, closing off all the sidewalks, closing off parts of the street, and I’m not doing that until we’re in a better position than we are today."

Armour and the Waterfront Development Corp. announced last fall they had agreed on a conceptual plan for the $70-million private portion of the $190-million Queen’s Landing development on the waterfront between Sackville Landing and Cable Wharf. The private component includes 100,000 square feet of new office space, a 200-room, four-star hotel with harbour views from every room and underground parking.

McCrea, whose company rebuilt Historic Properties in the 1970s, wouldn’t say what Armour’s construction deadline is under its deal with the provincial Crown corporation.

"Our agreement with the province and the Waterfront Development Corp. has a fairly lengthy time frame. That’s confidential. I’m not going to get into that. But it’s longer than normal because we saw this coming."
I think that the city and province need to start taking a serious look at this problem, maybe offer a few incentives such as small tax breaks or some other subsidies for locating in the downtown. This is a an absolute travesty, and the fact that this that this is being brushed aside while the city says all is good in Halifax while the core is dying is B.S ,the downtown is suppossed the cultural, recreational and and economic center of a city otherwise it's just a spread out massive suburb and that's not what we want!
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  #998  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2011, 2:18 AM
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bluenoser, you should take more pictures around here

they look epic, aha
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  #999  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2011, 2:58 AM
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I think the practice of demolishing heritage buildings to prepare a site for a possible future development is horrible. I am worried that we will have a repeat of this at the Roy Building.

I agree that the government should do more to encourage development in the core. The most obvious thing to do is to reduce tax rates in the core (including areas like Bayers Road which can be infilled), with even more tax breaks for heritage buildings. Transit service also needs to improve.

Unfortunately instead we are seeing more development in Bayers Lake that may pay off in the short term but will not pay for itself in the long run.
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  #1000  
Old Posted Apr 29, 2011, 7:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by someone123 View Post
I think the practice of demolishing heritage buildings to prepare a site for a possible future development is horrible. I am worried that we will have a repeat of this at the Roy Building.

I agree that the government should do more to encourage development in the core. The most obvious thing to do is to reduce tax rates in the core (including areas like Bayers Road which can be infilled), with even more tax breaks for heritage buildings. Transit service also needs to improve.

Unfortunately instead we are seeing more development in Bayers Lake that may pay off in the short term but will not pay for itself in the long run.
My suggestion would be to put the tax rate for downtown lower and raise that in Bayers Lake or Burnside. Then also cap the amount of parking buildings can have to a percentage of their normal maximum. If you start capping parking; people will soon see its 'difficult' to park in suburban offices - but for downtown (where most express routes go) - it will be easier, because access is improved!
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