[Moncton] Retail Thread

[gehrhardt]

I'm pretty sure Moncton's Target is now closed. There were rumours floating around yesterday about it being the last day.

The wife and I drove by around 7 pm and the parking lot was empty and the store was dark.

[Nashe]

Originally Posted by gehrhardt

I'm pretty sure Moncton's Target is now closed. There were rumours floating around yesterday about it being the last day.

The wife and I drove by around 7 pm and the parking lot was empty and the store was dark.

Many expectation.
Such botch.
Wow.

[MonctonRad]

Easily the biggest fail in Canadian retail history, even worse than Eaton's.

With Eaton's, the demise of the chain was due to third generation neglect and lack of interest - so unnecessary. With Target, it was poor planning and managerial incompetence of the highest order. Target wins this one because they flamed out so very quickly........

[OUIR@random]

Yes and no regarding Target Canada. Yes, Target Canada is mostly to blame for this fiasco, however Canadian shoppers are to blame also, people had unreasonable expectations regarding prices and selection among other things. Blaming management is too easy, I don't think that's the only reason Target Canada failed. Canadians did not patronize the stores and went on their merry way to Loblaws and Walmart, plain and simple. However, these people will be the first to say there is little competition in Canada. Like in a divorce both parties did mistakes and in the end it did not work out. The factors below are my observations from what I've seen in the media; online, newspapers, tv news, social media, opinions from friends, coworkers and relatives.

Target Canada Fiasco;
1 - Supply problems
2 - Price perceptions
3 - Selection was not what was offered in the US
4 - Canadians just didn't go to the stores
5 - Too many stores opened at once
6 - Subpar locations in some cases (dingy malls with little foot traffic, the Bedford, NS, location comes to mind)
7 - Anti-American sentiment (often by trolls on social media) or anti-big box sentiment, but most Canadians go out in droves to Costco and Walmart. Just Saying!
8 - Target Canada wanted to hit the ground running... to profits, it takes more or less 5 years for a business to establish itself.

[Taeolas]

While Canadian shoppers may have some of the 'blame' for Target's demise, the majority of the blame should fall on to Target itself. Their entire approach to coming into Canada seems to be a check list of what NOT to do.

Certainly, Canadian Shoppers did have some (probably unreasonable) expectations based on US Target experiences, but overall, it feels like Management bungled this. Their own expectations were out of line from reality.

Of course, it didn't help at all that their sense of timing was completely wrong (admittedly something they couldn't really plan for, but something they should have had some plans to handle just in case). They came in to Canada when the Loonie was the strongest it's been in decades, and they bailed out when the Loonie is 30 cents lower than those highs. So they ended up paying all those costs, and every year they were getting 10 cents less on the dollar for everything they did up here.

Had they come in here properly, with a saner plan, with the supply chains mostly worked out and so forth; they could have turned the Canadian Consumer to their side easily; we were primed to WANT to support them after all. (Their marketing was possibly one of the few things they did right; too bad the stores couldn't back that marketing up.)

And really, I'd say their pull out was a knee jerk reaction. While profit prospects didn't look the best after almost two years, jumping out after the billions invested and abandoning a market of 33 million people on a whim basically, seems to be an extreme reaction. Then again, considering the US side of the chain is floundering as well, it was probably all they could really do.

[L'homard]

I remember as they were about to open, tons of stories in Cdn media about "Target's low prices and wide selection," and could only think, uh-oh!
Target was unwise not to see this (hell, I'm a dummy and even I could see it) and act quickly to manage consumers' expectations accordingly.

[OUIR@random]

According to the news Pier 1 is closing over 100 stores in the next few years. Will another bite the dust at Wheeler Park..? Our Moncton location is fairly busy I believe, mid-tier retailers in North America continue to struggle though. Meanwhile, luxury retailers Nordstrom and Saks are doing well and opening stores across Canada and continue growing, the middle class is really struggling. Luxury stores are doing well and so is Dollarama, what's happening to our society, the rich are getting richer and the poor, poorer! No, 95% of New Brunswickers won't shed a tear for the recent tax increase for the richest people of this province.

[MonctonRad]

They're only closing 100 stores out of a total of 1,100 continent wide. If the Moncton store is busy, it should be safe.

When Staples contracted their store count last year, I thought we would lose one of our stores but both the Main St and Wheeler Park locations remain open. Moncton remains a (relatively) good retail market. I'm hopeful for our Pier One.

As for the comment regarding the richest earners, I remain convinced that if the trend continues and NB remains the highest tax jurisdiction on the continent, that our wealthy retirees will leave the province and that it will be damned difficult to find qualified people to move here to replace them. We will only end up shooting ourselves in the foot.

There is nothing wrong with a progressive tax system, but it should be fair for all, and it should be remembered that far more taxes can be raised though consumption taxes instead. There really aren't that many rich people out there. The recent changes to the tax system will raise at most $80M in new revenue. An increase of 2% on the HST however would have raised over $250M. It's simple math really.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

There is nothing wrong with a progressive tax system, but it should be fair for all, and it should be remembered that far more taxes can be raised though consumption taxes instead. There really aren't that many rich people out there. The recent changes to the tax system will raise at most $80M in new revenue. An increase of 2% on the HST however would have raised over $250M. It's simple math really.

I thought that the new income tax brackets were only going to raise $30M.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by OliverD

I thought that the new income tax brackets were only going to raise $30M.

You may be right, I was only going off the top of my head. The $80M figure might have been for all new taxes combined. The $250M figure for an HST increase however is correct, and would take have taken care of about 60% of our deficit right there. It's the first place the government should have looked!!

[OUIR@random]

Yes, but raising sales tax (which I'm not really against) would upset most of the working class and low income earners, this Liberal government doesn't want that. Sales tax penalize minimum wage earners since sales tax is considered a regressive tax and doesn't change much of anything for high income earners. So again low income earners would be most penalized by this. New Brunswick might just be the most taxed juridiction in NA for the rich, well NB is possibly the most borderline bankrupt province or state in North America, so something needs to be done and the poorest people in this province can't give more of the very little they have left. BTW I'm not a low income earner or a high income earner, I'm right there in the middle, but I just like to have a non biased view on this topic, because as New Brunswickers we are all stuck in this financial mess together.

This is my last comment on this topic which is not a Retail Discussion per se.

[MonctonRad]

First confirmed tenants for "Port Royal Estates" {at the corner of Lady Ada and Mapleton)

There is a request for variance before the April meeting of the Moncton PAC to allow for a new Tim Horton's/Irving/Convenience store ay this intersection. Presumably the convenience store is a "Circle K".

Not very exciting I know. The last thing this city needs is another Irving or Timmies, but I'm not surprised that Irving and TH want into the Mapleton Road shopping district. This area will be booming for the next several years with new construction and is rapidly becoming the preferred western entry into the city of Moncton.

[habs33]

Does that mean the Tim's at the corner of Plaza and Mapleton will close?

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

First confirmed tenants for "Port Royal Estates" {at the corner of Lady Ada and Mapleton)

There is a request for variance before the April meeting of the Moncton PAC to allow for a new Tim Horton's/Irving/Convenience store ay this intersection. Presumably the convenience store is a "Circle K".

Not very exciting I know. The last thing this city needs is another Irving or Timmies, but I'm not surprised that Irving and TH want into the Mapleton Road shopping district. This area will be booming for the next several years with new construction and is rapidly becoming the preferred western entry into the city of Moncton.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by habs33

Does that mean the Tim's at the corner of Plaza and Mapleton will close?

Doubt it - when was the last time you saw a Timmies close......

[Taeolas]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Doubt it - when was the last time you saw a Timmies close......

Hmm, let's see... 6-7 years ago? Maybe closer to 10. When Timmies closed in Regent Mall. It's also around that time the one on Prospect street closed. (Wendy's took over the lot and built the new restaurant.)

Man that is a long time ago.

[Hogie75]

Originally Posted by habs33

Does that mean the Tim's at the corner of Plaza and Mapleton will close?

Interesting, I thought I had read somewhere that it was suppose to be a McDonalds/Irving/Convenience store?

And the last tim Hortons I remember seeing that closed was the one in dieppe when they opened the Wendys/Tim Hortons (it was next to McDonalds) I think it is now a Vogue Optical.

[Good2go]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Doubt it - when was the last time you saw a Timmies close......

Highfield Square.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

First confirmed tenants for "Port Royal Estates" {at the corner of Lady Ada and Mapleton)

There is a request for variance before the April meeting of the Moncton PAC to allow for a new Tim Horton's/Irving/Convenience store ay this intersection. Presumably the convenience store is a "Circle K".

Not very exciting I know. The last thing this city needs is another Irving or Timmies, but I'm not surprised that Irving and TH want into the Mapleton Road shopping district. This area will be booming for the next several years with new construction and is rapidly becoming the preferred western entry into the city of Moncton.

This image shows the land to be rezoned from ID (Integrated Development) to HC (Highway Commercial) for the new Irving/Circle K/Tim Horton's

[josh_cat_eyes]

I'm actually happy about this development. I would have hoped it would be a McDonalds but I am often out that way and need gas. I'd rather go there than the Esso which is hard to get in and out of.

Speaking of McDonalds I am hopeful they will chose a site for a new location. When the Walmart DriveThru closed I heard they were looking to build a new store in the area to replace it.

[Feneant]

Originally Posted by josh_cat_eyes

I'm actually happy about this development. I would have hoped it would be a McDonalds but I am often out that way and need gas. I'd rather go there than the Esso which is hard to get in and out of.

Speaking of McDonalds I am hopeful they will chose a site for a new location. When the Walmart DriveThru closed I heard they were looking to build a new store in the area to replace it.

That was discussed... the spot next to Jean Coutu on Mountain or another potential location was where this Irving is now going isn't it?

Funny but I was telling my wife Friday morning driving down Mapleton that I was amazed Tim's hadn't opened a location next to the TCH. But in our heads, it would be next to Princess Auto so as to be nice and visible from the highway. Our other option was McD's so maybe we'll get lucky and they open there. ( I admit it, I have a thing for nuggets! ).

In a few years (or once Irving builds on Mapleton and Elmwood) every exit in Moncton will have a major gas station except for Gorge... and considering my house backs on the commercial lot that's for sale next to the highway, I hope it gets overlooked since Mapleton and Mountain are so close.