Ottawa's shovel ready projects (funding requests)

[waterloowarrior]

$14B in projects ready to go: Municipalities

BY MIKE DE SOUZA, CANWEST NEWS SERVICEJANUARY 14, 2009 12:21 PM

OTTAWA - More than 1,000 municipal infrastructure projects worth nearly $14 billion are “shovel ready” for job creation from coast to coast, according to a new list unveiled Wednesday by the Federation of Canadian Municipalities.

The list represents an inventory of projects that are awaiting funds to start and was compiled following weeks of extensive consultations by the federation and its members.

The federation says many municipalities have put these projects on the backburner, but could launch them this year and create thousands of jobs if money was available from the different levels of government.

“The municipal world is ready to co-operate with the provinces, territories and the Canadian government to (tackle) the economic problems of Canada,” said Sherbrooke, Que., Mayor Jean Perrault, the president of the federation, during a media conference call. “The construction phase of an infrastructure project creates most of the jobs and getting projects underway this spring is crucial to offsetting the economic slowdown.”

The projects include new investments in roads and bridges, waste management, buildings, public housing, water and waste water treatment facilities as well as public transit for cities and communities that are home to more than 19 million people across the country.

The federation has been urging the Harper government to fast-track transfer payments from a new infrastructure program so that municipalities can get started on the projects and begin putting people to work as part of a stimulus package for the economy.

Municipal officials have complained that there is too much red tape and administrative delays in getting the money flowing into their communities, but federal Transport, Infrastructure and Communities Minister John Baird has pledged to speed up the process by reducing red tape.

Perrault said the funding should be modelled after the federal gas tax transfer which provides federal money for cities based on the size of their population. He also argued in favour of reducing double environmental assessments of new projects by both the federal and provincial governments explaining that many of the projects on hold in their list would not put Canada’s environment in jeopardy.

“The environment is important. There are mechanisms and rules that we must follow,” said Perrault, “but what we told Prime Minister (Stephen) Harper and John Baird to reduce the red tape and that if there were environmental studies that overlap, why not have just one and ensure that it’s propitious.”

Conservation groups and the NDP have both criticized the federal government for musing about reducing federal environmental assessments in favour of a single review of some of the smaller infrastructure projects.

Baird said on Tuesday that the gas tax transfer program worked well since it did not require federal environmental assessments to operate.

© Copyright (c) Canwest News Service

here's what they listed for the federaation of cdn municipalities

873 City of Ottawa ON 812,129 Earl Armstrong Road (River Rd. to Limebank Rd.)* Roads and bridges $33,000,000 377
874 City of Ottawa ON Limebank Road (Spratt to Earl Armstrong)* Roads and bridges $10,000,000 114
875 City of Ottawa ON Terry Fox Drive (north of Kanata Avenue to Flamborough Way / Goulbourn Forced Road)* Roads and bridges $45,000,000 514
876 City of Ottawa ON 1W/2W Water Feedermain (Phase 2 - Bells Corners to Kanata) Water and wastewater $13,000,000 148
877 City of Ottawa ON Integrated Road, Water and Sewer Projects Water and wastewater $25,000,000 285
878 City of Ottawa ON Hazeldean Road (Terry Fox to Carp Road)* Roads and bridges $55,000,000 628
879 City of Ottawa ON Trim Road (south of Innes Road to Blackburn Hamlet Bypass extension)* Roads and bridges $10,300,000 118
880 City of Ottawa ON Heron Road Bridge Renewal (over Rideau River) Roads and bridges $11,000,000 126
881 City of Ottawa ON McIlraith Bridge Renewal (over Rideau River) Roads and bridges $10,000,000 114
882 City of Ottawa ON Sidewalks, Traffic Control Signals, Traffic Signs and Streetlights Renewal Roads and bridges $2,000,000 23
883 City of Ottawa ON Resurfacing, including selected paved shoulders (Roads) Roads and bridges $17,000,000 194
884 City of Ottawa ON Resurfacing (Transit and Park & Ride Lots) Public Transit $1,500,000 17
885 City of Ottawa ON Bridges and Culverts Renewal (Roads) Roads and bridges $10,000,000 114
886 City of Ottawa ON Rural Road Upgrades Roads and bridges $4,000,000 46
887 City of Ottawa ON Rural Pathways Roads and bridges $2,000,000 23
888 City of Ottawa ON Housing Providers - Capital Repair Grant Program Public Housing $7,400,000 84
889 City of Ottawa ON OCHC Rehab/Redevelopment Program Public Housing $66,000,000 753
890 City of Ottawa ON Acquisition and Rehabilitation of Apartment Hotels 153 and 1057 Merivale Road to Supportive Housing Public Housing $6,000,000 68
891 City of Ottawa ON Affordable Housing Development Opportunities Public Housing $3,000,000 34
892 City of Ottawa ON 245 Chrichton Street - a 6 unit listed Heritage apartment building that was purchased to be demolished for the Vanier Parkway extension
Public Housing $2,000,000 23
893 City of Ottawa ON Transit Vehicle Replacement and Expansion Public Transit $85,000,000 970
894 City of Ottawa ON Strandherd Drive (Prince of Wales Drive to Woodroffe Avenue) $24,000,000 Public Transit $24,000,000 274
895 City of Ottawa ON Southwest Transitway Ext. (Phase 1: Fallowfield-Strandherd Park & Ride; Phase 2: Strandherd Park & Ride-Barrhaven Town Centre) Public Transit $46,000,000 525
896 City of Ottawa ON Park and Ride Facilities-Leitrim, Millennium, Riverview, Chapel Hill Public Transit $23,000,000 263
897 City of Ottawa ON Resurfacing (Transit and Park & Ride Lots) Public
Transit $2,000,000 23
898 City of Ottawa ON Bridges and Structures Renewal (Transit) Public Transit $6,000,000 68
899 City of Ottawa ON Next Stop Announcement System Public Transit $6,720,000 77
900 City of Ottawa ON Transitway Improvement Projects Public Transit $2,050,000 23
901 City of Ottawa ON O-Train Improvements and Upgrades Public Transit $891,000 10
902 City of Ottawa ON Paratransit Advanced Technology Support Public Transit $620,000 7

http://www.fcm.ca//CMFiles/FCM%20Sho...42009-4963.pdf



there is a lot of road spending and unfortunately not too much for transit.... Standherd drive - Prince of Wales to Woodroffe - not sure that's a 'public transit' project

[highdensitysprawl]

Originally Posted by waterloowarrior

here's what they listed for the federaation of cdn municipalities

there is a lot of road spending and unfortunately not too much for transit.... Standherd drive - Prince of Wales to Woodroffe - not sure that's a 'public transit' project

This list sure is 'pick and shovel' stuff...definately not sexy spending.

BTW. when I read the thread headline of 'shovel ready' sites it reminded me of a sign I saw once in upstate NY state (Malone, NY I think), that said 'shovel ready site....residential, commercial, industrial....you decide' Obviously, flexible zoning.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by waterloowarrior

here's what they listed for the federaation of cdn municipalities

873 City of Ottawa ON 812,129 Earl Armstrong Road (River Rd. to Limebank Rd.)* Roads and bridges $33,000,000 377
874 City of Ottawa ON Limebank Road (Spratt to Earl Armstrong)* Roads and bridges $10,000,000 114
875 City of Ottawa ON Terry Fox Drive (north of Kanata Avenue to Flamborough Way / Goulbourn Forced Road)* Roads and bridges $45,000,000 514
876 City of Ottawa ON 1W/2W Water Feedermain (Phase 2 - Bells Corners to Kanata) Water and wastewater $13,000,000 148
877 City of Ottawa ON Integrated Road, Water and Sewer Projects Water and wastewater $25,000,000 285
878 City of Ottawa ON Hazeldean Road (Terry Fox to Carp Road)* Roads and bridges $55,000,000 628
879 City of Ottawa ON Trim Road (south of Innes Road to Blackburn Hamlet Bypass extension)* Roads and bridges $10,300,000 118
880 City of Ottawa ON Heron Road Bridge Renewal (over Rideau River) Roads and bridges $11,000,000 126
881 City of Ottawa ON McIlraith Bridge Renewal (over Rideau River) Roads and bridges $10,000,000 114
882 City of Ottawa ON Sidewalks, Traffic Control Signals, Traffic Signs and Streetlights Renewal Roads and bridges $2,000,000 23
883 City of Ottawa ON Resurfacing, including selected paved shoulders (Roads) Roads and bridges $17,000,000 194
884 City of Ottawa ON Resurfacing (Transit and Park & Ride Lots) Public Transit $1,500,000 17
885 City of Ottawa ON Bridges and Culverts Renewal (Roads) Roads and bridges $10,000,000 114
886 City of Ottawa ON Rural Road Upgrades Roads and bridges $4,000,000 46
887 City of Ottawa ON Rural Pathways Roads and bridges $2,000,000 23
888 City of Ottawa ON Housing Providers - Capital Repair Grant Program Public Housing $7,400,000 84
889 City of Ottawa ON OCHC Rehab/Redevelopment Program Public Housing $66,000,000 753
890 City of Ottawa ON Acquisition and Rehabilitation of Apartment Hotels 153 and 1057 Merivale Road to Supportive Housing Public Housing $6,000,000 68
891 City of Ottawa ON Affordable Housing Development Opportunities Public Housing $3,000,000 34
892 City of Ottawa ON 245 Chrichton Street - a 6 unit listed Heritage apartment building that was purchased to be demolished for the Vanier Parkway extension
Public Housing $2,000,000 23
893 City of Ottawa ON Transit Vehicle Replacement and Expansion Public Transit $85,000,000 970
894 City of Ottawa ON Strandherd Drive (Prince of Wales Drive to Woodroffe Avenue) $24,000,000 Public Transit $24,000,000 274
895 City of Ottawa ON Southwest Transitway Ext. (Phase 1: Fallowfield-Strandherd Park & Ride; Phase 2: Strandherd Park & Ride-Barrhaven Town Centre) Public Transit $46,000,000 525
896 City of Ottawa ON Park and Ride Facilities-Leitrim, Millennium, Riverview, Chapel Hill Public Transit $23,000,000 263
897 City of Ottawa ON Resurfacing (Transit and Park & Ride Lots) Public
Transit $2,000,000 23
898 City of Ottawa ON Bridges and Structures Renewal (Transit) Public Transit $6,000,000 68
899 City of Ottawa ON Next Stop Announcement System Public Transit $6,720,000 77
900 City of Ottawa ON Transitway Improvement Projects Public Transit $2,050,000 23
901 City of Ottawa ON O-Train Improvements and Upgrades Public Transit $891,000 10
902 City of Ottawa ON Paratransit Advanced Technology Support Public Transit $620,000 7

http://www.fcm.ca//CMFiles/FCM%20Sho...42009-4963.pdf



there is a lot of road spending and unfortunately not too much for transit.... Standherd drive - Prince of Wales to Woodroffe - not sure that's a 'public transit' project

Impressive list for Ottawa, though one thing that is noticeable is that almost nothing has been earmarked for the east end of the city. It’s pretty much all south and west.

Anyway, compared to Ottawa what Gatineau has put on the list is a joke. I think there are just three or four items and just about the sexiest thing is the addition of a bike path alongside the future Rapibus (for which funding has already been secured). You’d think that there were no infrastructure needs in Gatineau, or that we were up to our eyeballs in cash, neither of which is the case.

[lrt's friend]

Just like Clive Doucet predicted, all roads and buses. What about the Strandherd Bridge? I guess part of the $200 million federal LRT contribution is earmarked for that road project so we can't expect any more, or , is it because we really aren't ready to build it and it needs to be redesigned since it will no longer carry LRT?

I love the concept of building Park n Ride lots where there will be no rapid transit for years.

[Richard Eade]

The following lists the project, the estimated cost, and the number of jobs created by that job. I find the number of jobs an interesting figure. How is this calculated? Are these 'new' jobs, or is it work for existing company's existing employees? If one road resufacing project has X jobs, are they mutually exclusive to the Y jobs of another road resurfacing job?

I expect that it is simply a formula number since $2M gets 23 jobs whether it is for rural road upgrades, transitway resurfacing, or building demolishion.

The total costs listed are $515.461M and the total jobs is 6,071. This works out to about $85,000 per job, on average.

City of Ottawa Pop: 812,129

Category: Roads and bridges
Hazeldean Road (Terry Fox to Carp Road)* $55,000,000 628
Terry Fox Drive (north of Kanata Avenue to Flamborough Way / Goulbourn Forced Road)* $45,000,000 514
Earl Armstrong Road (River Rd. to Limebank Rd.)* $33,000,000 377
Resurfacing, including selected paved shoulders (Roads) $17,000,000 194
Heron Road Bridge Renewal (over Rideau River) $11,000,000 126
Trim Road (south of Innes Road to Blackburn Hamlet Bypass extension)* $10,300,000 118
Limebank Road (Spratt to Earl Armstrong)* $10,000,000 114
McIlraith Bridge Renewal (over Rideau River) $10,000,000 114
Sidewalks, Traffic Control Signals, Traffic Signs and Streetlights Renewal $2,000,000 23
Rural Road Upgrades $4,000,000 46
Rural Pathways $2,000,000 23

Category: Water and wastewater
Integrated Road, Water and Sewer Projects $25,000,000 285
1W/2W Water Feedermain (Phase 2 - Bells Corners to Kanata) $13,000,000 148

Category: Public Housing
OCHC Rehab/Redevelopment Program $66,000,000 753
Housing Providers - Capital Repair Grant Program $7,400,000 84
Acquisition and Rehabilitation of Apartment Hotels 153 and 1057 Merivale Road to Supportive Housing $6,000,000 68
Affordable Housing Development Opportunities $3,000,000 34
245 Chrichton Street - a 6 unit listed Heritage apartment building that was purchased to be demolished for the Vanier Parkway extension $2,000,000 23

Category: Public Transit
Transit Vehicle Replacement and Expansion $85,000,000 970
Southwest Transitway Ext. (Phase 1: Fallowfield-Strandherd Park & Ride; Phase 2: Strandherd Park & Ride-Barrhaven Town Centre) $46,000,000 525
Strandherd Drive (Prince of Wales Drive to Woodroffe Avenue) $24,000,000 274
Park and Ride Facilities-Leitrim, Millennium, Riverview, Chapel Hill $23,000,000 263
Next Stop Announcement System $6,720,000 77
Bridges and Structures Renewal (Transit) $6,000,000 68
Transitway Improvement Projects $2,050,000 23
Resurfacing (Transit and Park & Ride Lots) $2,000,000 23
Resurfacing (Transit and Park & Ride Lots) $1,500,000 17
O-Train Improvements and Upgrades $891,000 10
Paratransit Advanced Technology Support $620,000 7

So how does $85M of transit vehicle replacement and expansion generate 970 jobs? These must not be Ottawa jobs.

Aren't some of the road projects already (mostly) paid for by development charges?

I find it interesting that a 6-unit Heritage building (Chrichton Street) is being demolished for an extension of the Vanier Parkway.

Does anyone have any quick links to the projects which have been forwarded?

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

The following lists the project, the estimated cost, and the number of jobs created by that job. I find the number of jobs an interesting figure. How is this calculated? Are these 'new' jobs, or is it work for existing company's existing employees? If one road resufacing project has X jobs, are they mutually exclusive to the Y jobs of another road resurfacing job?

I expect that it is simply a formula number since $2M gets 23 jobs whether it is for rural road upgrades, transitway resurfacing, or building demolishion.

The total costs listed are $515.461M and the total jobs is 6,071. This works out to about $85,000 per job, on average.

City of Ottawa Pop: 812,129

Category: Roads and bridges
Hazeldean Road (Terry Fox to Carp Road)* $55,000,000 628
Terry Fox Drive (north of Kanata Avenue to Flamborough Way / Goulbourn Forced Road)* $45,000,000 514
Earl Armstrong Road (River Rd. to Limebank Rd.)* $33,000,000 377
Resurfacing, including selected paved shoulders (Roads) $17,000,000 194
Heron Road Bridge Renewal (over Rideau River) $11,000,000 126
Trim Road (south of Innes Road to Blackburn Hamlet Bypass extension)* $10,300,000 118
Limebank Road (Spratt to Earl Armstrong)* $10,000,000 114
McIlraith Bridge Renewal (over Rideau River) $10,000,000 114
Sidewalks, Traffic Control Signals, Traffic Signs and Streetlights Renewal $2,000,000 23
Rural Road Upgrades $4,000,000 46 Rural Pathways $2,000,000 23

Category: Water and wastewater
Integrated Road, Water and Sewer Projects $25,000,000 285
1W/2W Water Feedermain (Phase 2 - Bells Corners to Kanata) $13,000,000 148

Category: Public Housing
OCHC Rehab/Redevelopment Program $66,000,000 753
Housing Providers - Capital Repair Grant Program $7,400,000 84
Acquisition and Rehabilitation of Apartment Hotels 153 and 1057 Merivale Road to Supportive Housing $6,000,000 68
Affordable Housing Development Opportunities $3,000,000 34
245 Chrichton Street - a 6 unit listed Heritage apartment building that was purchased to be demolished for the Vanier Parkway extension $2,000,000 23

Category: Public Transit
Transit Vehicle Replacement and Expansion $85,000,000 970
Southwest Transitway Ext. (Phase 1: Fallowfield-Strandherd Park & Ride; Phase 2: Strandherd Park & Ride-Barrhaven Town Centre) $46,000,000 525
Strandherd Drive (Prince of Wales Drive to Woodroffe Avenue) $24,000,000 274
Park and Ride Facilities-Leitrim, Millennium, Riverview, Chapel Hill $23,000,000 263
Next Stop Announcement System $6,720,000 77
Bridges and Structures Renewal (Transit) $6,000,000 68
Transitway Improvement Projects $2,050,000 23
Resurfacing (Transit and Park & Ride Lots) $2,000,000 23
Resurfacing (Transit and Park & Ride Lots) $1,500,000 17
O-Train Improvements and Upgrades $891,000 10
Paratransit Advanced Technology Support $620,000 7

So how does $85M of transit vehicle replacement and expansion generate 970 jobs? These must not be Ottawa jobs.

Aren't some of the road projects already (mostly) paid for by development charges?

I find it interesting that a 6-unit Heritage building (Chrichton Street) is being demolished for an extension of the Vanier Parkway.

Does anyone have any quick links to the projects which have been forwarded?

The "heritage building" will not be demolished. It was originally slated to be torn down for the expansion of the Vanier Parkway that has now been cancelled. I believe that with this money it will be converted into some kind of "affordable" housing.

[Richard Eade]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

The "heritage building" will not be demolished. It was originally slated to be torn down for the expansion of the Vanier Parkway that has now been cancelled. I believe that with this money it will be converted into some kind of "affordable" housing.

Ah. It looked as if they were planning to extend the Vanier Parkway north along the river and then across a new bridge to meet up with the Macdonald-Cartier Bridge.

What is the rational in not connecting the Vanier Parkway to the bridge?

Yes, the NCC would need to be convinced that trucks should be allowed on the parkway, but it would offer an alternative route from the Queensway to Gatineau.

Although the parkway travels between residential neighbourhoods, it does not, as King Edward does, have any homes facing the road.

As much as I don't like to see Stanley Park destroyed, this does seem like one of the best routes north from the 417. For every potential route, there will be NIMBYs, but there needs to be a 'Greater Good' over-riding ruling for somewhere.

[waterloowarrior]

check out this OMB decision re: Vanier Parkway and one of the old bridge crossing studies
http://www.ncrcrossings.ca/en/1%2019...20Decision.pdf

[waterloowarrior]

Ottawa's 'shovel-ready' stimulus projects include major suburban road construction


BY JAKE RUPERT, THE OTTAWA CITIZENFEBRUARY 3, 2009 1:02 PM


OTTAWA — The city is preparing to get in line as the federal government doles out infrastructure money, and the local government's wish list includes a lot of money for new suburban roads.

The federal government announced a multibillion-dollar package for municipal construction projects in last week's budget, sending municipalities across the country to their drawing boards, looking for plans that need funding. Ottawa's preliminary list, which is expected to change before being finalized, was presented at a meeting of city council's economic affairs committee Tuesday and will be modified as details of what qualifies for the federal program are made clear in the coming weeks.

Last week, the government announced a $4-billion program to help municipalities build “shovel-ready” infrastructure projects. These types of projects are generally funded one-third each by the federal, provincial and municipal governments.

If the money is distributed by population, Ottawa would see about $103 million from the program, and the provincial government has pledged to match the funds.

The city is expected to come up with its $100 million by taking on debt, including possibly borrowing against future development charges, and using unspent capital reserves.

In the list released Tuesday, the bulk of the money would go to suburban road works, including expansions of Hazeldean and Terry Fox roads in Kanata, Earl Armstrong and Limebank roads in Riverside South, and Trim and Tenth Line Roads in Orléans. Barrhaven could see a $52.6-million extension of the southwest Transitway, too.

Under other programs, the city is also expecting to get $22.7 million from the federal government for repairs to social housing, and $12.6 million for new and existing recreation facilities.

City manager Kent Kirkpatrick cautioned council members on the committee that the projects on the initial list are the ones staff think will qualify for the federal program, but they won’t know for sure until later when the details are announced.

“The goal here is to be ready as quickly as possible once we know the deal here,” he said.

If things work out as the city hopes, it will mean a lot of work for the local construction industry, and Mayor Larry O’Brien hopes to help make sure the businesses are ready.

On Tuesday, he announced plans to hold a round table with industry leaders, city staff, and anyone else who wants to participate, to discuss challenges they may face.

Mr. O’Brien said the discussions will not focus on specific projects, but rather on “identifying opportunities and challenges.

“The City of Ottawa is ready to take full advantage of this infrastructure money and we need to make sure the local industry is as well,” said Mayor O’Brien. “I look forward to hearing the valuable input of our industry leaders on how we can roll up our sleeves and get this work done over the next two years.”

[waterloowarrior]

here's the list

staff report
http://www.ottawa.ca/calendar/ottawa...ity%20List.htm

[Richard Eade]

I'm not sure if it has changed or not, but here is the latest list:
http://ottawa.ca/calendar/ottawa/cit...%20Doc%202.pdf

Just looking at the first few items; Baseline Station and the pedestrian bridge add up to the original $185M estimate (roughly, at $90M=$95M), but the estimate for this project has increased to $207M! If we are still only asking for 2/3s of the original $185, that leaves the City on the hook for $61.67M (our 1/3) PLUS the $22M cost escalation.

Shouldn't we be requesting money based on the latest estimates? This is just another example of the incompetence of City Staff.

[lrt's friend]

Looks like we are asking for a lot more money for road expansion than for transit. Why is it that we are a lot better at planning roads than transit? That speaks volumes about our priorities

[Dado]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

I'm not sure if it has changed or not, but here is the latest list:
http://ottawa.ca/calendar/ottawa/cit...%20Doc%202.pdf

Just looking at the first few items; Baseline Station and the pedestrian bridge add up to the original $185M estimate (roughly, at $90M=$95M), but the estimate for this project has increased to $207M! If we are still only asking for 2/3s of the original $185, that leaves the City on the hook for $61.67M (our 1/3) PLUS the $22M cost escalation.

Shouldn't we be requesting money based on the latest estimates? This is just another example of the incompetence of City Staff.

I think you're misreading the list. The $90M figure you're seeing is the running cumulative total of the list itself, not the project. What I see is that they've got $38M for the "tunnel" and College Ave overpass, and $5M for the pedestrian overpass of Woodroffe. I imagine that the so-called "tunnel" (and College Ave overpass) is in fact the following:
-utility relocations (~$6M iirc)
-an open trench that goes to Norice Ave, maybe with a station and bridge at Meadowlands/Tallwood (this was ~$22M iirc)
-the temporary surface station at Baseline (~$7M iirc)
-the College Ave bridge (~$3M?)

There's no way they can do much more than that for $38M and they have nothing more designed/currently under detailed design. The rest of the $207M total project is not on the list simply because it's not ready-to-go yet.

Also, my new "favourite" project to dislike, the SW Transitway through Barrhaven, appears yet again. Beats me why since staff already have a $79M budget authority from 2008 to carry out this project - it was supposed to have started in the autumn. I guess they're hoping to get it funded by the prov&feds without telling the latter it should already be under construction according to their own budget plans. It also beats me why the cost of this project has dropped by a couple dozen million in a year.

[Richard Eade]

Ahhh! Thanks for that clarification. You were right I was mis-reading/interpretting the table.

I agree with your sentiment about the SW Transitway extension. Baseline is in the same boat with $68M already allocated in 2008 for the work of building the Navaho overpass and the trenching of the tunnel (including SWM and water utilities work). I wonder if the upper levels of gov't will catch these things? Maybe the City thinks that just because a shovel has yet to break the ground that the project isn't 'really' started. Let's hear it for procrastination.

[Dado]

Hmm, I smell a rat... Staff have the budget authority to build the SW Transitway but they're waiting on prov&fed stimulus cash. Meanwhile, check out this post over in the roads thread:
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...&postcount=167

Looks like the Province is refusing to pony up the cash ($35M) for the Strandherd Bridge and since it can't be completed in two years it's ineligible for stimulus funding. But... what if the City can get provincial funding for something else, say something that is already funded from its own sources that could be completed in two years, and then use the budget authority thus liberated for the bridge? And isn't about a third of the bridge going to be for transit? That sure would make it easier to transfer funds from a transit project, if the other project happened to be a transit project of course, wouldn't it?

Just wondering.

[lrt's friend]

Hasn't the province already said no for using transit funding for the Armstrong-Strandherd Bridge if only bus lanes are to be included?

One has to wonder about bus lanes when there will probably be only one bus every half hour crossing there for the forseeable future.

[Richard Eade]

Originally Posted by Dado

Hmm, I smell a rat... Staff have the budget authority to build the SW Transitway but they're waiting on prov&fed stimulus cash. Meanwhile, check out this post over in the roads thread:
http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...&postcount=167

Looks like the Province is refusing to pony up the cash ($35M) for the Strandherd Bridge and since it can't be completed in two years it's ineligible for stimulus funding. But... what if the City can get provincial funding for something else, say something that is already funded from its own sources that could be completed in two years, and then use the budget authority thus liberated for the bridge? And isn't about a third of the bridge going to be for transit? That sure would make it easier to transfer funds from a transit project, if the other project happened to be a transit project of course, wouldn't it?

Just wondering.

Not like its never been done before. But if it were done so blatantly (again), would the Province stop trusting Ottawa?

[Richard Eade]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Hasn't the province already said no for using transit funding for the Armstrong-Strandherd Bridge if only bus lanes are to be included?

One has to wonder about bus lanes when there will probably be only one bus every half hour crossing there for the forseeable future.

I think that the Province has exactly the same thoughts. Just claiming that there are going to be transit-only lanes does not make it a transit priority project. Besides, there is no secret that a new Transit-only bridge is already being planned by staff for 20m south of the S-A Bridge. Since the transit lanes on the S-A Bridge will only given over to general traffic within 20 years, or so, is it really a 'Transit Project'?

I think the Province is correct in its assessment - this should not get transit funds. That said, there should be general infrastructure funds available from the Province for the bridge.

[Dado]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Hasn't the province already said no for using transit funding for the Armstrong-Strandherd Bridge if only bus lanes are to be included?

They have, though it's a bit rich since they're building the 417 to Kanata with bus lanes at their own expense. Anyway, because the Province won't fund the bridge the City has to look elsewhere.

The point here is that just because the Province doesn't deem it to be a transit project due to only having bus lanes doesn't mean that the City can't deem it to be so for its own internal funding rearrangement purposes.

[Dado]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

Not like its never been done before. But if it were done so blatantly (again), would the Province stop trusting Ottawa?

Well that's just it - it wouldn't be blatant. As far as anyone else knows, the SW Transitway is unfunded because the two major clues point in that direction: it hasn't begun yet and Ottawa is asking for money for it. How many people actually search through past City capital budgets to find this stuff out? There's probably no more than 4 people in the city who do that kind of thing. If the Province kicks in the cash for the SW Transitway then that would release committed funds for use elsewhere - but those funds might not be used for a few more years, so they'd just sit around in the SW Transitway pot for awhile. By the time some other "transit project" comes along, it would be a simple matter of getting Council to authorize the transfer of "residual funds" from the SW Transitway pot to that of the next project. And that's hardly going to raise any eyebrows because that does happen a fair bit (I mean, how often do those 10-30% contingencies actually get fully used up?).