Ottawa Transit Strike: Should transit workers be allowed to strike?

[YOWflier]

No. Transit should be an essential service.

Some of the stuff being said, and indeed written in this very thread, is laughable and clearly shows how uneducated some people are on this topic. The primary contractual dispute is over the city's attempt to gain back control over driver/route scheduling. Currently the city publishes the required routes and schedule and the OC drivers have the ability to schedule THEMSELVES.

What happens is that the drivers with the most seniority are cherry picking the best routes (many that take less time to operate than the driver earns) which leaves the crap routes to the less senior drivers. The city wants to take back control, eliminating the ability for drivers to schedule themselves, in order to get a better grip on an out-of-control OC budget. You can learn about that in the city auditor general's scathing report on OC that talks about the abuse going on at OC to the tune of ~8 million dollars per year.

Of course, the drivers won't have any part in relinquishing their power. Their own union president says they won't resume talks so long as this scheduling issue remains.

So here we are 2 weeks before Christmas, students can't get to their exams, seniors can't get to medical appointments, and the city has been crippled. The OC drivers have been negotiating since April and could have picked any time to strike outside of this busiest time of the year, but they purposely chose this time because it causes maximum damage and inconvenience. Their own union president admitted to this in an interview with Steve Madeley this morning.

This strike is morally reprehensible.

[Mille Sabords]

Originally Posted by ac888yow

No. Transit should be an essential service.

Some of the stuff being said, and indeed written in this very thread, is laughable and clearly shows how uneducated some people are on this topic. The primary contractual dispute is over the city's attempt to gain back control over driver/route scheduling. Currently the city publishes the required routes and schedule and the OC drivers have the ability to schedule THEMSELVES.

What happens is that the drivers with the most seniority are cherry picking the best routes (many that take less time to operate than the driver earns) which leaves the crap routes to the less senior drivers. The city wants to take back control, eliminating the ability for drivers to schedule themselves, in order to get a better grip on an out-of-control OC budget. You can learn about that in the city auditor general's scathing report on OC that talks about the abuse going on at OC to the tune of ~8 million dollars per year.

Of course, the drivers won't have any part in relinquishing their power. Their own union president says they won't resume talks so long as this scheduling issue remains.

So here we are 2 weeks before Christmas, students can't get to their exams, seniors can't get to medical appointments, and the city has been crippled. The OC drivers have been negotiating since April and could have picked any time to strike outside of this busiest time of the year, but they purposely chose this time because it causes maximum damage and inconvenience. Their own union president admitted to this in an interview with Steve Madeley this morning.

This strike is morally reprehensible.

Thanks for making that clear. One assumes that everyone follows these details but not necessarily. It's important to understand how heinous this strike really is. My South American blood is ready to go break some windows at Union headquarters, although I'm Canadianized enough to actually carry this out. I'm itching, though.

[Justin10000]

Originally Posted by Mille Sabords

And stranding hundreds of thousands of people over a contract dispute is an unequal privilege only transit workers have over everybody else. That's unfair. I support the people who get me around, so long as they DO get me around. Making me a hostage of their contract dispute does not make me a willing supporter.

Sometimes you have to make the tough choice. I doubt these workers want o strike, as they are not making much money. But what can you do with a mayor like O'Brien?

How can you justify shutting down a large city on a contract item, when other unions' only recourse is to inconvenience only their employer? There is somerthing completely unfair and out of proportion here.

How is it unfair, when that is the only choice you have? Tell me, when was the last serious strike in Ottawa? You are talking about taking away a right that is rarely utilized. Not to mention taking away a worker's right to strike would potentially be more expensive in the long run.

If transit contracts lead to strikes every three years, at the worse possible time of the year, when the weather is at its shittiest and the most vulnerable people in society can't get around the city to go to work or school and earn their livelihood, something is seriously wrong. I'm sorry but I just can't suck this one up like any other.

Yes. Something is seriously wrong, and currently the problem seems to be with the city, not the workers.

[Justin10000]

Originally Posted by jchamoun79

So is being a paramedic, or a firefighter.

Should they be allowed to strike?

Of course they should, if the City is treating them poorly. But no city, in their right minds would ever treat those departments like they treat transit. In any budget, it is ALWAYS transit that receives the brunt of cuts, or savings measures. It's nuts. Transit is just as important as fire services, and police services, yet Cities do not see that.

[Jamaican-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by ac888yow

No. Transit should be an essential service.

Some of the stuff being said, and indeed written in this very thread, is laughable and clearly shows how uneducated some people are on this topic. The primary contractual dispute is over the city's attempt to gain back control over driver/route scheduling. Currently the city publishes the required routes and schedule and the OC drivers have the ability to schedule THEMSELVES.

What happens is that the drivers with the most seniority are cherry picking the best routes (many that take less time to operate than the driver earns) which leaves the crap routes to the less senior drivers. The city wants to take back control, eliminating the ability for drivers to schedule themselves, in order to get a better grip on an out-of-control OC budget. You can learn about that in the city auditor general's scathing report on OC that talks about the abuse going on at OC to the tune of ~8 million dollars per year.

Of course, the drivers won't have any part in relinquishing their power. Their own union president says they won't resume talks so long as this scheduling issue remains.

So here we are 2 weeks before Christmas, students can't get to their exams, seniors can't get to medical appointments, and the city has been crippled. The OC drivers have been negotiating since April and could have picked any time to strike outside of this busiest time of the year, but they purposely chose this time because it causes maximum damage and inconvenience. Their own union president admitted to this in an interview with Steve Madeley this morning.

This strike is morally reprehensible.

[lrt's friend]

What happens is that the drivers with the most seniority are cherry picking the best routes (many that take less time to operate than the driver earns) which leaves the crap routes to the less senior drivers.

As far as I know, this has been a longstanding privilege. A large portion of bus drivers have to work split shifts, which most workers don't have to put up with. It seems to me only reasonable that older drivers with more seniority should be given the privilege of getting first choice on route bookings. I think it is very simplistic to suggest that this procedure on its own is the cause of these additional costs. If there is abuse, work with union to come up with a much less dramatic solution.

[Jamaican-Phoenix]

Originally Posted by Mille Sabords

Thanks for making that clear. One assumes that everyone follows these details but not necessarily. It's important to understand how heinous this strike really is. My South American blood is ready to go break some windows at Union headquarters, although I'm Canadianized enough to actually carry this out. I'm itching, though.

Same here dude. Only difference is that I'm currently stuck in North Bay right now.

[waterloowarrior]

• Video Link

[waterloowarrior]

Commentary: OC Transpo dispute all about power
By Fred Sherwin
Orléans Online As OC Transpo's 2,300 operators, dispatchers and mechanics are about to go on strike and leave thousands of commuters stranded in the process, a lot of people are probably asking themselves the same all encompassing question -- why?

It's quite simple really, power. It definitely can't be the money. Most bus drivers are already making between $45,000 and $52,000 a year and the city's latest contract offer would see them get raises of three, two and two per cent over the next three years along with a $2,000 signing bonus.

It also can't be because of the benefits. The city is offering to increase their paid sick leave from six to eight days and they'll be able to bank it. Female bus drivers would be able to take an extra two weeks off prior to taking maternity leave and collect 93 per cent of their pay.

A source close to the negotiations has informed me that the main sticking point is scheduling and block booking. Right now the union is reponsible for scheduling their members.

For the city and especially Mayor Larry O'Brien, the key to any future agreement will be the city's ability to save money. The one place you can do that without cutting salaries is scheduling. For instance, the current set up allows for a driver to get paid for an eight hour shift even though his route is booked to run on a seven hour schedule. Multiply that by 10 drivers and you get 10 hours. Multiply it by a 1,000 drivers and you get 1,000 hours.

The drivers say their biggest beef if with the city's desire to do block booking which would allow them to establish schedules twise a year. The fear on the drivers' part is that it will eliminate their seniority rights and the guys who have put in the most amount of years will end up having to work on weekends and holidays.

But here's the counter argument to that. The senior drivers get paid more. Why would the city want to give the guys who get paid the most the premium shifts? It would end up being the other way around. Block booking would enable the city to save money by eliminating overtime.

The city has done a preliminary look at the numbers and have estimated that they could save enough money through scheduling and block booking to eliminate 100 FTEs and save about $5 million in wages and benefits in the process. No wonder the union doesn't want to give up scheduling.

The deal the city is offering the union is a sweet one, especially when you consider the add-ons like the $2,000 signing bonus and the additional two sick days.

Now you may be thinking, what's two sick days? Not much until you multiply two sick days with 2,300 workers and divided it by 365 days in a year. The answer is 12.6 years. Now multipy that by an average salary figure of about $65,000 and you end up with another $819,000. That's hardly chicken feed. Better yet, under the current collective agreement, you don't even need to have a doctor's note or even a have descent excuse to take the first eight days off. It seems to me the drivers have no idea how good they have it.

So what happens next? Assuming the drivers go on strike, O'Brien seems bound and determined to come out on top, especially after Monday's budget fiasco. He's also pretty confident he has the public on his side. To which my response is, so did former regional chair Peter Clark when the last transit strike happened in November 1996.

The support lasted right up until about the second week of the strike when commuters started getting restless. Before long the public, which had originally been on Clark's side, started demanding an end to the work stoppage and the two sides ended up going to arbitration where the union ended up getting most of what they were looking for.

The current situation will likely follow the same pattern. The drivers will walk off the job. Commuters will suck it up for a week or so before they start calling the Lowell Green Show demanding the province pass back-to-work legislation. The province will ignore them and instead call in an arbitrator who will end up handing down a decision that gives the union most of what they want.

It's all too predictable and rather pathetic if you ask me. This strike is going to hurt a lot of vulnerable people such as the elderly and single mothers who don't have access to any other mode of transportation to get to work, or get their kids to school.

The rank and file need to give their heads a shake and do the right thing. They say its about respect and that their beef is with the city not the citizens. Well guess what guys? The city will save tens of thousands of dollars for every day you're on the picket line, while you'll have to make do with strike pay and whatever money you've managed to save up.

[Justin10000]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

As far as I know, this has been a longstanding privilege. A large portion of bus drivers have to work split shifts, which most workers don't have to put up with. It seems to me only reasonable that older drivers with more seniority should be given the privilege of getting first choice on route bookings. I think it is very simplistic to suggest that this procedure on its own is the cause of these additional costs. If there is abuse, work with union to come up with a much less dramatic solution.

I have a feeling that this is an attempt at Union Busting.

This is practiced in every transit agency, and no city has ever attempted to control the scheduling. Why is Ottawa trying to do it now?

[lrt's friend]

For the city and especially Mayor Larry O'Brien, the key to any future agreement will be the city's ability to save money. The one place you can do that without cutting salaries is scheduling. For instance, the current set up allows for a driver to get paid for an eight hour shift even though his route is booked to run on a seven hour schedule. Multiply that by 10 drivers and you get 10 hours. Multiply it by a 1,000 drivers and you get 1,000 hours.

This seems reasonable, however, it can effectively be used to cut salaries by reducing hours. By cutting hours from 8 to 7, you have cut salaries by 12.5%. This more than makes up for the $2,000 signing bonus. No wonder they are on strike!

[Mille Sabords]

Originally Posted by Justin10000

Sometimes you have to make the tough choice. I doubt these workers want to strike, as they are not making much money. But what can you do with a mayor like O'Brien?

How much money is an average Transpo driver making? Without the information, it's hard to make a statement like that one. On the internet I found a copy of the now-expired collective agreement. An average driver makes $50,394 a year. See below.



Is that "not much money?" How is that comparable with other major transit companies? Hard to say, but since they agreed to those wages in the last round then they must've thought they were ok. So the question of money really is about raises. 3%, 2% and 2%, with a $2,000 signing bonus. Are you getting that kind of a raise? Do you get to strand hundreds of thousands of people in a major city if you don't?

Originally Posted by Justin10000

How is it unfair, when that is the only choice you have? Tell me, when was the last serious strike in Ottawa? You are talking about taking away a right that is rarely utilized. Not to mention taking away a worker's right to strike would potentially be more expensive in the long run.

Choice? How about work to rule? How about wearing jeans instead of the uniform, as the Gatineau cops have been doing. How about ads in the paper explaining the issues. And, excuse me, but how is taking away the right to strike more expensive in the long run?

Originally Posted by Justin10000

Yes. Something is seriously wrong, and currently the problem seems to be with the city, not the workers.

Why is the problem with the city? Do we know that the city is treating its drivers badly? From my perspective, I more often see drivers treating ME badly, and moreso my wife, who has the temerity of disturbing them with a stroller. Who the hell are these animals to treat the citizens like that? How about they treat US well for a change? Isn't that something we, the public, and the citizens who own the transit company, should DEMAND that of our "working brothers"?

[Cre47]

http://zeromeanszero.blogspot.com/20...ry-obrien.html

In the blog it was reported that Lowell Green threaten a OC driver to do physical damage to him (so presume threaten to hurt him) as well as several other people and there was also a rumor that cueball phoned CFRA to thank them for that... so would it mean Larry approved the physical threats a la Mussolini made by Lowell. If this kind of rumor is true... another indication this mayor has completely lost it. And his behavior lately is a big concern too. CFRA is a disgrace (as it is always the case) sure you can be upset about the strike but to go all the way to make threats like that though. But Lowell seems to have already encourage people to do physical damage to strikers in the past. Anyways read today's blog. There is other nonsense from Larry in there.

[jchamoun79]

Originally Posted by waterloowarrior

• Video Link

What a major douchebag this guy is! CTV showed him out on the picket line this afternoon, where he had the audacity to ask, in the most arrogant voice possible, "What's wrong with inconveniencing people?"

[TransitZilla]

Originally Posted by ac888yow

NWhat happens is that the drivers with the most seniority are cherry picking the best routes (many that take less time to operate than the driver earns) which leaves the crap routes to the less senior drivers. The city wants to take back control, eliminating the ability for drivers to schedule themselves, in order to get a better grip on an out-of-control OC budget. You can learn about that in the city auditor general's scathing report on OC that talks about the abuse going on at OC to the tune of ~8 million dollars per year.

Do you have a link to this Auditor General's report?

I was looking on the website with the Auditor General's reports (http://www.ottawa.ca/city_hall/mayor.../index_en.html) but I can't find it.

[YOWflier]

No, I don't. The information I have on the report was heard on the radio.

[kingcobra]

Although I am a unionized federal employee, the transit service should be deemed as essential.

I go to work and return home by doing a 30 minutes-long walk every day until the strike is over.

[highdensitysprawl]

Originally Posted by Justin10000

I have a feeling that this is an attempt at Union Busting.

And your problem being?

[lrt's friend]

This is indeed a power struggle between the union and the mayor's office, and with the mayor's failings at city council, it becomes that much more important to find a victory. On the other hand, from the union's perspective, it equally important not to cave into a mayor who is perceived to be weak. This is not a scenario for reasonable compromise. We could be in for a lengthy strike.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by bradnixon

Do you have a link to this Auditor General's report?

I was looking on the website with the Auditor General's reports (http://www.ottawa.ca/city_hall/mayor.../index_en.html) but I can't find it.

I tried to find the report as well and ended up in the same place. I wish we could see the straight facts on the booking issue so we could better understand the situation. As it stands, all we are getting is spin from both sides.