[Dartmouth] Dartmouth Towers | ? m | 3 x 33 fl | U/C

[someone123]

This is for the proposal near the hotels by the Dartmouth approach of the Macdonald bridge.

Website: https://www.dartmouthtowers.com/

New rendering:

[Saul Goode]

Originally Posted by someone123

This is for the proposal near the hotels by the Dartmouth approach of the Macdonald bridge.

Gee, what an original and inspirational name they've chosen.

Update: I notice that at the top of their web page, the title is "Dartmouth Towers", but at the bottom it's "Best Towers Dartmouth" - which obviously is in reference to the fact they'll be on Best Street. Unfortunately, that results in an even cheesier name for the project.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Combined with all of the other proposed projects, this view will change dramatically over the next few years. It would be cool to see a rendering of the 'old bridge' area with all of the proposed buildings included.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

Combined with all of the other proposed projects, this view will change dramatically over the next few years. It would be cool to see a rendering of the 'old bridge' area with all of the proposed buildings included.

I wonder if any studies have been done to determine where all the residents of these new buildings will work? Being so close to the bridge could contribute to awful traffic congestion if many of them will be working on the peninsula. If on the other hand, the residents will be working in Burnside, then why build the towers in this location? Commuters will have to traverse the bottleneck of the bridge approaches in order to get to Burnside. Maybe it would be better to concentrate housing options closer to where people actually work???

[Saul Goode]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Commuters will have to traverse the bottleneck of the bridge approaches in order to get to Burnside.

Nope - they'll have direct access to Windmill Road, which bypasses all of that.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Saul Goode

Nope - they'll have direct access to Windmill Road, which bypasses all of that.

Good to hear.

[ns_kid]

This is a fascinating proposal. If built as envisioned -- along with other projects now under development or proposed -- it will dramatically change the Dartmouth skyline. The rendering makes no attempt to soft-pedal how imposing these structures will appear behind the low-rise residential properties between Windmill Road and the harbour.

As outlined by the developers, the structures can be built as-of-right; however, they propose a site plan application to allow the buildings to be joined by a common podium. Unlike a development agreement, this will require no by-law changes. What I don't know is if the process gives councillors an opportunity to try to leverage height changes in exchange for the increased podium dimensions. For the record, the developers' web site suggests they are prepared to build to 33 stories even if the site plan application fails.

[Helladog]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Maybe it would be better to concentrate housing options closer to where people actually work???

Good point but not everyone wants to live where they work.

[Colin May]

All traffic will exit onto Best Street and Mott and then Windmill Road. The noise from the bridge traffic and the wind are a negative. Walk 200 yards from our house and the wind is worse - no downed trees on our street in the past 40 years but walk up one block to Tulip and it is a different outcome. Not sure how many children will live in the towers and the elementary school which a decade ago was under threat of closure is now close to capacity. HRSB needs to decide how proposed developments in the area will impact on the elementary and the high school.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by Helladog

Good point but not everyone wants to live where they work.

And it's impossible in a lot of cases since many households have multiple employed people in them, like a dual-income couple, and they can't all work in the same spot.

This is right next to a major transit hub which is probably the best possible location given the city's current infrastructure. I think if you start getting into the weeds worrying about elementary school attendance and whatnot you will likely just end up with paralysis and about as much uncertainty as before. None of the HRM planners of 2015 predicted what 2020's growth rates would be.

[Colin May]

We need to plan for population change and how that change results in an increase or decrease in school population. Over the past 10 years the number of primary school children on two blocks of our street has greatly increased. In the past 2 years there has been a baby boom. Other streets that feed into Bicentennial have seen a similar increase, part of a normal cycle that school board planners rarely think about.
You can predict changes in school population because there is an almost predictable cycle of change in the average age of people in a neighbourhood. Hard to fathom why planners would not know the basics of population change.
Almost all home sales in our area have been to young couples or couples with young children or intending to have children.

No doubt the same situation exists in north end peninsula Halifax and areas feeding into Westmount and Oxford Street school .

[someone123]

Originally Posted by Colin May

You can predict changes in school population because there is an almost predictable cycle of change in the average age of people in a neighbourhood. Hard to fathom why planners would not know the basics of population change.

The vast majority of changes in demographics lately have happened due to internal migration and immigration, not natural increase. It's a lot harder to predict immigration.

It's good to try to model school demand for school planning purposes but a lot of people like to put the cart before the horse and argue that development should be slowed down or stopped until their speculative objections are dealt with. I'm not even sure the idea that the population depends so directly on construction is that solid as we see more overcrowding and have an undersupply of housing right now in Canada. Often the people are just crowding more into the same units or they live in an area and don't have proper housing. To assess the impact of a development you need to look at the net impact on population growth, not just the number of units in the building. For schools or traffic you also need to be able to guess at the future demographics. I'd guess that the rate of car ownership and number of children tends to be lower per unit in highrise apartments by transit than in detached housing neighbourhoods.

[IanWatson]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I wonder if any studies have been done to determine where all the residents of these new buildings will work? Being so close to the bridge could contribute to awful traffic congestion if many of them will be working on the peninsula. If on the other hand, the residents will be working in Burnside, then why build the towers in this location? Commuters will have to traverse the bottleneck of the bridge approaches in order to get to Burnside. Maybe it would be better to concentrate housing options closer to where people actually work???

You'd still get that bridge traffic if these towers were built deeper into Dartmouth; you'd just end up with traffic on on the roads in-between too.

[Keith P.]

I expect HRM to be totally unprepared to accommodate the pressures that this development will cause to occur. Not just schools, which are a bit of a guess given the nature of these eventual tenants, many of whom may well not have kids of that age. But they will all need to have jobs, which could be anywhere. The reality at present is that they will still largely require a vehicle to get to those and hence traffic will become far worse. You cannot easily get to/from the ferry terminal from here on foot because of the grade changes and the lack of any sort of integration with the bus service. Getting to the transit terminal requires a challenging uphill climb as well. Driving to Burnside from here is a slog because there is no direct route. None of these would be insurmountable obstacles in other places, but I expect that nothing will be done here despite the obvious need for improvements. Perhaps Sam will deign to give them a bike lane.

[Arrdeeharharharbour]

It's time to start implementing a solution to the issue of having the ferry terminal and the bus terminal at such a distance from each other. Perhaps a dedicated high-frequency shuttle bus?

[Saul Goode]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Getting to the transit terminal requires a challenging uphill climb as well.

While I agree with most all of your post, the walk from Wyse Road to the transit terminal is far from a "challenging uphill climb". It's a pretty gentle stroll up a relatively benign slope.

[Saul Goode]

Originally Posted by Arrdeeharharharbour

It's time to start implementing a solution to the issue of having the ferry terminal and the bus terminal at such a distance from each other. Perhaps a dedicated high-frequency shuttle bus?

Or even just co-ordinating bus and ferry service schedules.

For years the Holiday Inn (as it then was) operated a free shuttle to the ferry terminal, which I used frequently in bad weather (I worked in Metropolitan Place at the time).

[Nouvellecosse]

Nearly every route that serves the ferry terminal also stops at the bridge terminal. There's only maybe 1 or 2 out of around a dozen that doesn't so there's lot of connectivity there. But really, most people taking the ferry don't need access to the bridge terminal since most ferry commuters come from the Portland corridor so taking the ferry is the most direct way downtown. The majority of people coming from northern Dartmouth or the Woodland Ave corridor (like route #10) seem to prefer the bridge anyway as the ferry would likely add extra time and transfers.

[eastcoastal]

Originally Posted by Saul Goode

While I agree with most all of your post, the walk from Wyse Road to the transit terminal is far from a "challenging uphill climb". It's a pretty gentle stroll up a relatively benign slope.

It's not a gentle stroll for everybody. Better interchange between ferry and bus routes is better for everyone, but especially people who might have mobility concerns.

[Saul Goode]

Originally Posted by eastcoastal

It's not a gentle stroll for everybody. Better interchange between ferry and bus routes is better for everyone, but especially people who might have mobility concerns.

Of course. But as a general statement about the topography, it's hyperbole.