SAN FRANCISCO | Oceanwide Center | 910 & 636 FT | 61 & 54 Floors | ON HOLD

[gillynova]

Oceanwide:

[waterchicken]

Oceanwide from Jessie St, Sat 10-13
[IMG]10-13-2018 City Walk by Daniel Alm, on Flickr[/IMG]

[david_h]

Excavation begins!

[1977]

Originally Posted by david_h

Excavation begins!

Great to see! Thanks for the update, david_h.

[SoCal Alan]

Great picture, David!

So, looks like they are building both towers at the same time.

In the picture, are those steel columns, existing from before, or was that placed there for the new tower?

Alan

[Fvn]

^^ Looks like they're to support the cross bracing for the support of the CDSM wall

[timbad]

a few more from yesterday

from First St side



from Stevenson







from Jessie (the yellow digger in the hole was active when I was by there)



from Mission

[SoCal Alan]

Great pictures, Timbad. Thanks!

[gillynova]

Just imagine how this will look in 4 years

[SFBuildings888]

Originally Posted by gillynova

Just imagine how this will look in 4 years

The only bad thing is we have to wait a few more years for it to be finished.

[gillynova]

Originally Posted by SFBuildings888

The only bad thing is we have to wait a few more years for it to be finished.

Of course. Things take time. I'm sure we would all want it to be properly built than rushed.

[observatory]

While we wait, has anyone found a live webcam for this beast yet?

[SFBuildings888]

I saw somewhere that it might not be finished till 2023 now? Hope that is not true.

[Hudson11]

not good.

Genworth's Acquirer (China Oceanwide) Looks To Be Drowning In An Ocean Of Debt

[Zapatan]

That sucks, I was really looking forward to this one

[fimiak]

That is bad news but it is pre-emptive to think it affects this development from that article alone. The Chinese government probably does not want something as large and globally exposed as Oceanwide's properties to go bankrupt. Hopefully Oceanwide will build this project out (possibly with a short-term loan) and then sell the property as finished buildings.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by Hudson11

not good.

Genworth's Acquirer (China Oceanwide) Looks To Be Drowning In An Ocean Of Debt

I would point out re this article by Hindenburg Research (even the name should tell you something) that "Hindenburg Investment Research specializes in forensic research and activist short-selling".

I am a regular user of SeekingAlpha which means I know the site is a stew of short sellers pitching their latest ideas to drive down stock prices. Like all research firms specializing in shorts, they make money selling their ideas to subscribers and clients. But SeekingAlpha is a free site so when they broadcast an idea for free on that site, you have to be at least a little skeptical of their motives.

Maybe they are right about Oceanwide but that certainly doesn't mean Oceanwide would abandon a project into which they've already poured millions (not just what has been spent on progress made but also they've likely ordered the steel and spent lots on other materials not yet delivered to the site as well as contract with the construction companies). At some point, it's a serious question whether the best way to get their money out is to stop or to proceed and I think they are probably near the tipping point if not beyond it.

Also, what Hindenburg is saying about Oceanwide can be said about most similar companies in China. China in general--companies as well as municipalities--is wallowing in mountains of debt. At some point it's likely to come unglued but there's no evidence that point is close.

[Pedestrian]

Originally Posted by SFBuildings888

I saw somewhere that it might not be finished till 2023 now? Hope that is not true.

The SF Business Times included its Commercial Real Estate Quarterly supplement with its latest issue which catalogues the city's 75 largest construction projects. Regarding Oceanwide it says "Tower 1 is estimated for completion in March 2023. Tower 2 is September 2022."

[patriotizzy]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

China in general--companies as well as municipalities--is wallowing in mountains of debt. At some point it's likely to come unglued but there's no evidence that point is close.

Thanks. This right here is all that is really needed to be said about this scare.

[coyotetrickster]

Originally Posted by Pedestrian

I would point out re this article by Hindenburg Research (even the name should tell you something) that "Hindenburg Investment Research specializes in forensic research and activist short-selling".

I am a regular user of SeekingAlpha which means I know the site is a stew of short sellers pitching their latest ideas to drive down stock prices. Like all research firms specializing in shorts, they make money selling their ideas to subscribers and clients. But SeekingAlpha is a free site so when they broadcast an idea for free on that site, you have to be at least a little skeptical of their motives.

Maybe they are right about Oceanwide but that certainly doesn't mean Oceanwide would abandon a project into which they've already poured millions (not just what has been spent on progress made but also they've likely ordered the steel and spent lots on other materials not yet delivered to the site as well as contract with the construction companies). At some point, it's a serious question whether the best way to get their money out is to stop or to proceed and I think they are probably near the tipping point if not beyond it.

Also, what Hindenburg is saying about Oceanwide can be said about most similar companies in China. China in general--companies as well as municipalities--is wallowing in mountains of debt. At some point it's likely to come unglued but there's no evidence that point is close.

To echo Pedestrian, the short-seller alarm is specific to an acquisition of Genworthy. Genworthy is already in deep financial stress due to terrible actuarial projections for its long-term care insurance product. The concern is will the company have sufficient reserves to pay out due to the parent company's debt, not the debt of the development component.
Oceanwide put capital into the LLC created to construct the project, but the LLC took out a construction loan secured against the finished project. Big projects are never paid for out of a company's cash flow. After the building is completed, the LLC will pay off the construction loan with a mortgage loan. This project is most certainly going forward as it will be the only Class A commercial space coming online in the next few years.