CHICAGO | Waldorf=Astoria | 1,265' Official / 1,200' Roof | 107 FLOORS | NEVER BUILT

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by 10023

I'd hate to burst anyone's bubble, but...

1. This proposal is only good news if it doesn't interfere with Spire sales. Everyone is excited about getting both, but if they're competing for a limited pool of buyers, we could end up with neither.

2. Mandarin Oriental, which is just as prestigious of a hotel brand, can't seem to get off the ground with their tower. Why should this?


Really guys, I wish this hadn't been announced until the Spire was fully financed. It just creates more overhang in the market, and potentially pulls people away from lower-floor units in the Spire (which need to be sold) to higher-floor units in this tower.

replace the two project names with Trump and Waterview and i guarantee you that i can find this exact same post ~4 years ago in the archive, .

it's funny how history has a way of repeating itself.

[BVictor1]

Originally Posted by Kngkyle2

Any other details you got from Rosche yesterday that you could share with us?

I talked to Carley

I will get more details next wednesday.

[honte]

^ You must not be spilling the beans because you were depressed to discover it's a Loewenberg, right?

[10023]

Originally Posted by sentinel

Let me guess, you're from New York?

Born in London, raised in Chicago, currently reside in New York. Parents live in Chicago. I actually pay closer attention to Chicago projects here (and joined the board due to the Spire). For starters, they're better documented and the pictures satisfy my nostalgia for the city. And also, I think I root for Chicago to succeed moreso than New York (which everyone thinks of as one of, if not the, great world city), because it doesn't get the credit it deserves. For instance, no one would doubt that something like the Spire could be built if it were U/C in New York.

However, facts being what they are, and being very hopeful that the Spire is completed, I would rather that this proposal had never existed or came to light (ignorance is bliss) than have the Spire die on the vine or be downsized due to market constraints. If both are completed, then yes, it'll be an amazing vista, but a bird in hand...

[Nowhereman1280]

Guys I still don't think this is actually going to compete with the Spire. The Spire is about 2 years ahead of this project, so we are looking at a completely different delevery period. The Spire is marketing to overseas buyers. The spire is 2.5 times the price point of this building. This building has a hotel. The Spire was designed by Calatrava Bvic says this was designed by Desphano. This is not on the lake or river, the spire is.

We are talking about to completely different situations and markets. These buildings might have some slight cannibalization, but very limited because people who are looking to buy a condo for when they retire in 2010, don't want to wait until 2012 or 2014 to move in. The only cannibalization will be people who don't care when they get to move in, don't mind not having guaranteed lake views, and don't mind lower living with some views cut off by other buildings...

[SNT1]

Hmm methinks it can be higher than 1100'.

The pointy top? 100 floors? Its 'structural' height may very well get past that 1100' number, even if it pisses off the people who believe any added height above roof height is satan's work I'm hoping for 1300ish myself

But, the alarming amount of condos do bother me a little. There's just so many choices, that if I am a wealthy millionaire, I will have a hard time which to get... a place in Waterview, Aqua, Trump, and now this one (if it gets built). Multimillionaires/billionares who can afford the Spire might be daunted by the "Waldorf-Astoria" moniker, but that's about the only bad thing I can think of. Right now, this tower (again, if it gets built) may affect Trump/Waterview/Wolf Point proposal....

[10023]

Agreed. I'd prefer if they did this building like Water Tower Place, with lower-level offices and upper-level hotel, and skipped the condos altogether. And at the top, a Bull & Bear bar like the New York hotel with views of the Spire from 1,300 feet.

And I wonder if they'll give back the clock from the New York hotel's lobby (originally from the Chicago World's Fair in 1893):

[GregBear24]

The article said hilton hotels is behind this project, which is a huge help.

[Via Chicago]

Bear with me, but how can the Chicago market possibly absorb this much luxury condo/hotel space? Is there really that much demand out there?

[10023]

Originally Posted by GregBear24

The article said hilton hotels is behind this project, which is a huge help.

Hilton owns the Waldorf=Astoria brand.

However, Hilton Group is being sold to Blackstone, so it's going to be a highly leveraged company. They don't really add what you'd think to the financial standing of this project.

[BVictor1]

Originally Posted by jpIllInoIs

^^ Now this announcement has morphed into 2 towers.. Let the good times roll.

It was announced seveeral months ago that 2 towers would be build on that property.

[SNT1]

Bear with me, but how can the Chicago market possibly absorb this much luxury condo/hotel space? Is there really that much demand out there?

Chicago2016! >.>

[10023]

Originally Posted by Via Chicago

Bear with me, but how can the Chicago market possibly absorb this much luxury condo/hotel space? Is there really that much demand out there?

I know this is probably rhetorical but you're asking a bunch of people who don't know here. My hesitation on the project is based on a "better safe than sorry" approach with regards to not choking off the Spire's sales. No one knows what demand exist, beyond the fact that it's not limitless and the empirical evidence indicates that it is slowing.

[sentinel]

10023 how big is that clock in the image you posted? I can see a person on the lower left, but I still can't picture the scale.

[djvandrake]

OMG. From what little detail I can see in that rendering I am so excited. (spine tingling for real). I can't wait for more detail, but this looks like an awesome proposal.

It has all the elements I like. Clean form, slender, sleek, with a progressive design that's going to be (let me stress going to be) a good fit for this neighborhood when all that's under construction gets done.

[10023]

It's pretty big but the perspective is a bit weird in that picture... 10 feet maybe?

[DHamp]

This is starting to get ridiculous... in a good way. But also kind of scary.

I was perfectly willing to except that nothing big will even be seriously proposed for a while after the Spire. I was fine with that. I was even fine with letting Park Michigan go. I'll still fight for X/O given the chance. There's a lot of big ones that are sitting un-started already. Now we keep getting teased by developers with more awesome project proposals that are just hard to believe. I don't want it to end but I was liking the idea of taking a breath and watching the Spire go up over the next few years.

Hopefully these others are in the early stages and won't launch until the time is right: i.e., P.S.... Post Spire.

[wrab]

Originally Posted by 10023

Agreed. I'd prefer if they did this building like Water Tower Place, with lower-level offices and upper-level hotel, and skipped the condos altogether. And at the top, a Bull & Bear bar like the New York hotel with views of the Spire from 1,300 feet.

And I wonder if they'll give back the clock from the New York hotel's lobby (originally from the Chicago World's Fair in 1893):

Wow - I've sat under that clock many times and had no idea it was from Chicago!

[Via Chicago]

Originally Posted by SNT1

Chicago2016! >.>

Perhaps. But that is far from a sure thing.

[SNT1]

^Yeah, but it's sure a good way to lazily answer the burning question: "Too much condotels prop/app/UC a bad thing for Chicago?"

Chicago2016! <.<