154 Main St East | 81.75 m | 26 fl | Complete

[Innsertnamehere]

above ground costs about 1/2 to build, as a general rule, than below grade. It can be much more for underground if you have water issues.

Looking at how cheaply they built this garage, it was likely a fraction of the cost. It's all precast assembly which brings costs down even more.

Guelph recently built a 350 space parking garage for $20 million, or about $50k a spot. Underground runs about $80-150k depending on various factors.

It wouldn't surprise me if Vrancor got this garage built in the $40k/spot range, while Liuna is likely paying $100k+ for the parking garage for their project beside Gore Park.

[TheRitsman]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

above ground costs about 1/2 to build, as a general rule, than below grade. It can be much more for underground if you have water issues.

Looking at how cheaply they built this garage, it was likely a fraction of the cost. It's all precast assembly which brings costs down even more.

Guelph recently built a 350 space parking garage for $20 million, or about $50k a spot. Underground runs about $80-150k depending on various factors.

It wouldn't surprise me if Vrancor got this garage built in the $40k/spot range, while Liuna is likely paying $100k+ for the parking garage for their project beside Gore Park.

And this is why parking minimums should go the way of the dodo. We having a housing crisis because housing isn't being built because developers are risk managers. When costs rise, profits decrease, and risk of profit loss increases. Parking may still be built, but it will be built to what the market demands, rather than some arbitrary legal minimum the city sets. Want to buy a condo, and don't need a car? Too bad, the city has made that illegal, and you must pay $100,000 hidden in the price of your condo (unless you buy downtown, where the price of a parking spot is separate sometimes).

[Hawrylyshyn]

Couldn't get a picture but cladding is thankfully going up on the parking garage, so it shouldn't be *as* ugly as it is right now

[craftbeerdad]

Let's hope, went by yesterday and the exhaust fans from the parking garage look so bad on the east side it's not even funny. I'm not sure anyone owns a level working on this project.

[Innsertnamehere]

[TheRitsman]

Thanks for the picture, now it just looks awful instead of the literal spawn of Satan.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by TheRitsman

And this is why parking minimums should go the way of the dodo. We having a housing crisis because housing isn't being built because developers are risk managers. When costs rise, profits decrease, and risk of profit loss increases. Parking may still be built, but it will be built to what the market demands, rather than some arbitrary legal minimum the city sets. Want to buy a condo, and don't need a car? Too bad, the city has made that illegal, and you must pay $100,000 hidden in the price of your condo (unless you buy downtown, where the price of a parking spot is separate sometimes).

Surface parking is way cheaper, like $3-4k a spot, if that. As soon as you need structure it gets expensive quick though.

[TheRitsman]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

Surface parking is way cheaper, like $3-4k a spot, if that. As soon as you need structure it gets expensive quick though.

Higher than that when you include the cost of the land, but yes.

[craftbeerdad]

Here's a photo of what I mentioned above.

These exhaust fan installations look just dreadful .

It's like when a person who has no artistic skills tries to design something artsy.

[aurry]

Yeah its not pretty. I'm also really annoyed that the design does not extend to the 1st storey - its like cause they felt it was in an alleyway/tucked beside Lo Prestis it wouldn't be seen.

[City3]

This building is a stain. So ugly!

Hamilton should demand better since we have to now live with this urban eyesore

[ScreamingViking]

Perhaps it will eventually be surrounded by better buildings. Perhaps.

[Chronamut]

Originally Posted by craftbeerdad

Here's a photo of what I mentioned above.

These exhaust fan installations look just dreadful .

It's like when a person who has no artistic skills tries to design something artsy.

And this is the problem - there is no artistic vision in architecture anymore outside of liuna and core urban - it's just generic uninspired crap. Precast panels, curtain walls, stucco, fake finishes that look weird - back in the day part of the art of the building was also the form and function of it - brick layers also acted as supports for the structure- now with concrete and steel it's just all bare minimum.. if it wasn't for the 2 aforementioned companies I woulda lost faith in architecture altogether in hamilton- slowly turning it into a soulless glass precast concrete jungle..

"modern chic" is just another word for "we are making this cheap and passing it off as trendy and you people are buying it up"

[johnnyhamont]

The speculation I heard about the apartments-to-hotel-to-apartments flip was that hotels pay less than residential in fees related to the development process. Is that true?

[TheRitsman]

Originally Posted by johnnyhamont

The speculation I heard about the apartments-to-hotel-to-apartments flip was that hotels pay less than residential in fees related to the development process. Is that true?

This may be true, and I also heard that it is easier and quicker to get approvals for a hotel than for residential. Vrancor just uses ever trick in the book to save money and time.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by johnnyhamont

The speculation I heard about the apartments-to-hotel-to-apartments flip was that hotels pay less than residential in fees related to the development process. Is that true?

I'm not a lawyer but I doubt it would reduce their development charge burden. Development Charge by-laws usually have very specific details regarding what is defined as "Development" that triggers the charge and even if they non-residential rate worked out to be cheaper, they would likely have to pay the difference now that they are converting back to residential.

Perhaps there is some other incentive it helps with - Community Improvement Plan, etc? I'm not sure.

[craftbeerdad]

Article on the TPR regarding the revenue generation of the new property (and the grant Vranich will receive)

But interesting tidbit at the end that I wasn't aware of:

"In June 2021, Council voted to eliminate the tax incentive program during its next review. The rationale is that approving the B-Line LRT creates the economic conditions for development without the need for HTIGP."

The above is pretty common sense, and one of the benefits of the LRT, so glad to see the elimination of the tax incentive program.


https://www.thepublicrecord.ca/2021/...-property-tax/

[exomesplice]

Originally Posted by craftbeerdad

[I]"In June 2021, Council voted to eliminate the tax incentive program during its next review. The rationale is that approving the B-Line LRT creates the economic conditions for development without the

Does this mean he will be approved for the grant just before it is cancelled?

[craftbeerdad]

More than likely (vote was yesterday) as this development is close to completion and would have received a probable inference on the tax grant previously.

As per the TPR: the new development will generate $403,672.89 more in municipal property tax revenue/year compared to the previous two-storey commercial building on the site

Developers receive 100% rebate in year one, decreasing each year by 20%

• Year one - $403,672.89
• Year two - $322,938.31
• Year three - $242,203.73
• Year four - $161,469.16
• Year five - ~$80,734.58

[Markus83]

Taken this morning on Wednesday, July 7, 2021

Crane coming down today!