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  #1961  
Old Posted Nov 20, 2024, 11:11 PM
Dominion301 Dominion301 is offline
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On the flip side, AC are cutting the following stations for good: BWI (previously known), MCI and BDL. The latter two were reduced to summer seasonal but have now been cut outright. BDL is the victim of the retirement of the 50 seaters as DH1s, DH3s and CRJs were the mainstay of YYZ-BDL for decades (and the BEH on YUL-BDL). MCI is the surprising one.

However, some YYZ routes will get a daily 223 (STL, CLT, PHL & RDU) on them and YYZ-ORD is increasing to 6x using a mix of mainline and Jazz.

https://ishrionaviation.com/news/air-canada-exit-hartford-kansas-city-baltimore
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  #1962  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2024, 12:04 AM
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Looks like CX are increasing YYZ to 18x's weekly, and YVR to 17x's weekly, for peak travel times next summer.

Hong Kong – Toronto eff 31MAR25 Increase from 14 to 18 weekly. New service departs Hong Kong in overnight hours, Toronto in mid-morning hours

CX820 HKG0240 – 0545YYZ 359 x257
CX828 HKG1045 – 1355YYZ 359 D
CX826 HKG1755 – 2105YYZ 359 D

CX829 YYZ0140 – 0500+1HKG 359 D
CX821 YYZ1035 – 1405+1HKG 359 x257
CX825 YYZ1535 – 1900+1HKG 359 D

Hong Kong – Vancouver eff 31MAR25 Increase from 14 to 17 weekly. Mid-morning CX814/815 service resumes since 2020

CX888 HKG0045 – 2150-1YVR 359 D
CX814 HKG1045 – 0750YVR 359 135
CX810 HKG1605 – 1325YVR 359 D

CX865 YVR0125 – 0535+1HKG 359 D
CX815 YVR0955 – 1420+1HKG 359 135
CX819 YVR1455 – 1920+1HKG 359 D

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/241119-cxns25ca
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  #1963  
Old Posted Nov 21, 2024, 7:21 PM
thenoflyzone thenoflyzone is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominion301 View Post
AC will be resuming YYZ-PRG in summer 2025 - seasonal 3x/week on the 788: https://www.paxnews.com/news/airline/air-canada-operate-toronto-prague-flights-summer-2025
This was officially announced along with YUL-NAP/OPO earlier this month. It was loaded in the schedules way before that, as AC is usually late to announce these additions.

https://www.newswire.ca/news-releases/ai...ts-to-europe-and-the-u-s--881877774.html

Aeroroutes picked it up in August.

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/240827-acns25prg

Last edited by thenoflyzone; Nov 21, 2024 at 7:44 PM.
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  #1964  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2024, 2:30 AM
Dominion301 Dominion301 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thenoflyzone View Post
This was officially announced along with YUL-NAP/OPO earlier this month. It was loaded in the schedules way before that, as AC is usually late to announce these additions.

https://www.newswire.ca/news-releases/ai...ts-to-europe-and-the-u-s--881877774.html

Aeroroutes picked it up in August.

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/240827-acns25prg
Ah ok thanks. I missed that one!

Here’s two new ones though: UA have loaded that they’re resuming YEG-IAH with a 4x weekly 319 and are retaliating to WS and are also adding YEG-ORD 3x weekly. A clear retaliation as it’s mirroring WS and not on opposite days.

Last edited by Dominion301; Nov 22, 2024 at 2:44 AM.
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  #1965  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2024, 6:52 AM
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It looks like UA has loaded YEG-ORD 3x weekly and YEG-IAH 4x weekly starting in Spring 2025.

Edmonton - Chicago eff 23MAY25
UA2004 YEG0805 – 1245ORD 319 367
UA0455 ORD1330 – 1645YEG 319 367

Edmonton - Houston eff 24MAY25
UA2399 YEG0805 – 1329IAH 319 1245
UA1964 IAH1630 – 2008YEG 319 1245

Source: United.com
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  #1966  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2024, 5:34 PM
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With the new YYT-CDG flight, will Air Saint-Pierre renew their partnership with ASL to provide FSP-CDG flight next summer?
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  #1967  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2024, 8:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LO 044 View Post
It looks like UA has loaded YEG-ORD 3x weekly and YEG-IAH 4x weekly starting in Spring 2025.

Edmonton - Chicago eff 23MAY25
UA2004 YEG0805 – 1245ORD 319 367
UA0455 ORD1330 – 1645YEG 319 367

Edmonton - Houston eff 24MAY25
UA2399 YEG0805 – 1329IAH 319 1245
UA1964 IAH1630 – 2008YEG 319 1245

Source: United.com

Great to see United and IAH back.
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  #1968  
Old Posted Nov 23, 2024, 9:27 AM
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Good for YEG to start seeing these new additions, it was ridiculous the gutting of the last few years, and totally uncalled for. These additions are proof the routes are viable.

I'm glad I spent the time to do a thorough WS flights listing in summer 2024, it is proving to be a great resource and I have been updating it for subsequent periods since. I know some of my data and/or calculations could be erroneous, but I was pretty careful when I did the list in July. And although the general ranking and trends in my numbers were similar to Aeroroutes breakdown, there were several pair combinations where my comparisons were quite different from their analysis.

A couple main takeaways from the WS Summer 2025 releases (I have not yet done YYC, so no analysis of their numbers). First off, kudos to their media team for really taking the time to publish releases on most schedule changes, and in greater depth and with more personalization (ie. their separate releases for each jurisdiction discussed). Most airlines don't even publicize route changes, but WS really works at communicating detail, and really plugging the locations like a salesperson. It might be kind of hokey, but as an airline/airport enthusiast, I love their detailed news releases.

Second, some general network observations:
-Encore seems to be really struggling based on my data comparison. I know Link was a bust, but at least they were just partnering with Pac Coastal and using their planes. But Encore is fully WS. I thought Link ending would boost Encore, but they seem to be bleeding capacity (I used week of July 15, 2024 compared to week of July 15, 2025). The loss of Link plus slower growth at Encore is the only reason why YVR capacity is up but not by the same % as places like YEG. WS moved quite a bit of capacity from Encore to mainline at YEG, for example. Their transborder offerings have never taken off (was way...). Their sole offering from YVR, YEG, YYZ, YWG, and YHZ is 4 weekly YEG-SEA flights lol, that's bleak to not even have daily to SEA. I wonder if they are possibly migrating back to mainline only.. Just a musing, I have no more info than anyone, just seems like they are retreating.

The top route pairs (one way) are:
YYC-YVR - 119 flights
YYC-YYZ - 76 flights
YYC-YEG - 63 flights
YYZ-YVR - 55 flights
YYC-YWG - 54 flights
YEG-YVR - 53 flights
(after this is drops down below 50).

Summary of the top 3 (non YYC) airports:

Total Flights
YVR – 506
YEG – 404
YYZ – 370

Total Destinations for summer
YYZ – 35 (reclaims #1)
YVR – 33
YEG – 32

Total Seats
YVR – 69,627
YYZ – 58,072
YEG – 57,645

Mainline Flights
YVR – 382
YYZ – 370
YEG – 331

Domestic Flights
YVR – 404
YEG – 348
YYZ – 262


Here is a more discussion based on my comparison July-July, definitely some differences from AeroRoutes:

YVR
-Maintains role as 2nd largest WS airport, with 506 weekly flights (382 mainline, 124 Encore). This works out to approx. 69,627 seats.
-Mainline flights up 18% from July 2024
-Encore up 4%
-Link down 100%
-Growth y/y to YYC, YEG, YYZ, YLW, YWG, YOW, YQR, YXE, BOS, BNA, ATL, TPA, LAS, SAN, ORL, PHX, SJD, PVR (18 destinations)
-Same frequency y/y to YXS, DTW, LAX, SFO, HNL, PSP, CUN (7)
-Reduced frequency y/y to YYJ, YXJ, YXT, YUL, YOW, YQQ, YXC, YCD, OGG
-Route cancellations to YHZ (loss of 3) and SNA (loss of 4)
-2/3 of the frequency reductions were on Encore (and mainly because they replaced Link's tiny Saab planes with a 78-seater, so capacity is probably up but frequencies go down. Only YUL, YOW, and OGG had reductions on mainline. So not doom and gloom, just more showing the weakness West<>East
-If airport nerds had an awards show for flight routes, I would certainly give special recognition to ATL. The uptake in capacity has been wild, 15x weekly flights now?! They went from zero to being the largest transborder destination from YVR in such a short time is insane. I always knew the market was there, it was frustrating to see Delta in and out like it was hanging on by a thread. And then to stop entirely, it was so backwards to me. So to see WS keep increasing is great to see! Combined with adds to BNA, ORL, DTW, and BOS, they have a strong Eastern presence, and are certainly expanding from their former reliance on California and Hawaii ex-YVR. NYC is the obvious hole, it is the only DL hub not served by either DL or WS from YVR. Cathay gone, AC and UA only at EWR, and then JetBlue to JFK? Definitely room for DL or WS to to JFK I'd think.

Eastern Canada
-I found it interesting their relatively equal spread of Europe between YYZ, YYT, and YHZ. A nice way to spread the love, just interesting that their Europe capacity is still fairly small, but they are not funneling everything through one point. Hey, they must have some strong reason to do it this way, they have experience on the routes, and the expected payoff must be there.
-Still surprises me to have YYC from LHR only, and then YYT and YHZ from LGW only. It's like the 737 service from the Maritimes and 787 service from YYC are different airlines . Again, lots of reasons for this, just odd initially to have a relatively smaller international carrier not use the same airport for their routes
-The WS migration from GLA to EDI is all done (they used to do GLA from several stations). I initially found it surprising that they chose EDI over GLA; at YVR at least, any time we have had Scotland service, it's been to GLA (Air Transat, Zoom, I think Thomas Cook at some point?). So being ignorant about Scotland, I always assumed GLA was their biggest airport. But then I looked it up, and EDI is way bigger for pax traffic, close to double! I never would've thought, based on flights I always heard GLA before EDI from Canada. But then I find out GLA and EDI are only 80 KM apart!!! WTF lol I never knew the cities were that close, that's wild, I always imagined them to be way further apart. They are under an hours drive from each other haha, I couldn't believe it! They are basically like YYZ and YHM, so you're basically flying into the same place.
-It's interesting that WS is doing these routes, because they have been pretty lean on the domestic side for Eastern Canada. YYZ is gaining a bit again, although mostly thanks to boosts to YYC, YEG, and YVR and not with its former hub network. YUL is hilarious, I actually love the fact they don't give a *&% about WS lol, they don't blink or even entertain the idea of courting them. All the other places in the East are hustling to get some love, and YUL is totally unbothered. WS is almost trying to be shady back by putting such pitiful frequencies on most routes and only having 5 destinations lol. Sub daily service to YVR, YEG, and YWG lol, it's like why even bother.

YEG
-Maintains role as 2nd largest WS airport in terms of flights (but 3rd place for seats). Flight frequency continues to outpace 4th place YYZ, but with YYZ only having mainline, their seat count is boosted. With 404 weekly flights (331 mainline, 73 Encore). This works out to approx. 57,645 seats.
-Mainline flights up 53% from July 2024 (!)
-Encore down 49%
-Growth y/y to YVR, YYZ, YXX, YYJ, YWG, YUL, YOW, YMM, YQU, ORD, MSP, SLC, LAX, PHX, CUN, PVR (16 destinations)
-Same frequency y/y to YQM, YXE, YZF, YCD, BNA, ATL and LAS (7)
-Reduced frequency y/y to YYC, YHZ, YYG, YLW, YYT, SEA and SFO (7). But in some of these cases (YYC, YLW) the # of flights decreased, but switch to mainline was a capacity boots).
-Route cancellations to YYF (loss of 2 Encore). YYF has really been battered, airlines shifting to YLW more than ever 

Incidentally, the Edmonton Journal called YEG the largest outside YYC in their presser this week:

Even before the recent announcement, WestJet has given the Edmonton market increasingly more attention, which — based on passenger’s use of the airline — seems to resonate with the Edmonton customers. Shortly before the pandemic, the airline opened a base of operations in Edmonton, more than doubling its employees in the city and making it the largest of the airline’s bases outside of its headquarters in Calgary.
(https://edmontonjournal.com/business/edm...more-westjet-flights-than-ever-next-year)

YVR is objectively ahead in terms of flights, capacity, and connectivity. I am not sure about # of employees, but I don’t think YEG could be ahead in that regard when it is behind in all others? I have a feeling they took this quote from another article of their’s from October and just misphrased it:

While the airline may feel that western Canadians have been underserved, Edmontonian flyers have shown a marked preference for WestJet, which consists of about half the traffic at the Edmonton International Airport — the strongest connectivity outside of Calgary, where WestJet’s main base is located. Still, von Hoensbroech said that there’s more room for improvement, which he explained while speaking to reporters.
(https://edmontonjournal.com/business/westjet-ceo-chamber-of-commerce)

YYZ
-Maintains role as 3rd largest WS airport in terms of flights (but 2nd place for seats). Flight frequency of 370 weekly flights (all mainline). This works out to approx. 58,072 seats. But my counts are just approximate using averages of aircraft capacity and weighting it, YEG and YYZ could swap places if my math was wrong, they are that close)

-Mainline flights up 19% from July 2024, essentially same as YVR
-Growth y/y to YYC, YVR, YEG, YLW, YYJ, YWG, YUL, YOW, BNA, FLL, TPA, ORL, AUA, GCM, LIR, PUJ, UVF, SXM, VRA, and KIN (20 destinations)
-Same frequency y/y to YQQ, YQR, YXE, PVR, ANU, EDI, and DUB (7)
-Reduced frequency y/y to YYT, RSW, LAS, LAX, CUN, MBJ, and NAS (7)
-Routes not operating to PLS and POP (loss of 9 mainline)
-WS seems to have stopped shrinking here, probably reached equilibrium with their status in relation to the other carriers. I assume when WG is integrated into WS, they will dethrone YVR again
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  #1969  
Old Posted Nov 23, 2024, 5:33 PM
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Has anyone played Microsoft Flight Simulator 2024 yet?
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  #1970  
Old Posted Nov 23, 2024, 8:04 PM
thenoflyzone thenoflyzone is offline
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Interesting hub analysis done by LAXdude1023 over on airliners.net.

https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1496109

I'm going to copy the Canadian hub info he posted, for convenience, but everything I post here is directly from the link above. This info applies to Q4 2024 (October 1 to December 31), unless otherwise listed. There are 92 days in the quarter, so if you want a daily average, you can do the math.

Total departing seats by single Airline hub for the entire quarter - Q4 2024

YYZ - AC: 3,552,545
YUL - AC: 1,819,060
YYC - WS: 1,755,633
YVR - AC: 1,714,823

He didn't do any airline hub with less than 1,000,000 departing seats, hence why no WS at YVR or YYZ.

Number of departing flights by airlines hub - Total Q4 2024

YYZ - AC: 21,956
YYC - WS: 12,227
YUL - AC: 11,910
YVR - AC: 11,725

Total Destinations Serviced by Airline Hub

For this one, he had to pick a day, so he picked thursday, October 16.

YYZ - AC: 95
YUL - AC: 64
YVR - AC: 51
YYC - WS: 50

Number of Destinations Gained or Lost Between Beginning and End of the Quarter by Airline Hub (Seasonality of each hub)

For this one, he picked another thursday, December 12, and compared it with the destination count of October 16.

YVR - AC: +2
YYZ - AC: No Change
YYC - WS: No Change
YUL - AC: -1

Average Aircraft Gauge Q4 2024 (done by another poster, jetblastdubai. YYC info wasn't there, but I added it)

YYZ - AC: 161
YUL - AC: 152
YVR - AC: 146
YYC - WS:143

Seat growth at airline hub as compared between Q4/2023 and Q4/2024

Air Canada
YUL: +23,492
YYZ: -11,453
YVR: -31,332

Westjet
YYC: +89,332

Market share and monthly seats by airline for November 2024.

(Seat count seems to be total seats, both ways.)

Market share at YYZ - Top 5
AC: 53.4% - 2,258,320
WS: 10.4% - 438,704
PD: 6.5% - 276,144
TS: 3.4% - 144,627
UA: 3.2% - 134,682

Market share at YUL - Top 5
AC: 57.3% - 1,103,814
TS: 11.2% - 215,467
PD: 5.2% - 100,404
WG: 4.3% - 82,593
DL: 2.6% - 50,636

Market share at YVR - Top 5
AC: 46.8% - 1,079,478
WS: 21.4% - 493,347
F8: 5.5% - 126,441
UA: 2.6% - 59,586
PD: 2.0% - 47,256

Market share at YYC - Top 5
WS: 67.5% - 1,065,022
AC: 16.7% - 263,849
F8: 4.8% - 75,033
UA: 2.8% - 44,106
PD: 2.1% - 33,792

Last edited by thenoflyzone; Nov 23, 2024 at 8:16 PM.
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  #1971  
Old Posted Nov 24, 2024, 11:16 PM
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St. Pierre et Miquelon already have their own direct flights to Paris, but they're expensive despite heavy subsidies for Saint-Pierrais et Miquelonnais people. So this could genuinely have an impact, especially for French nationals who get no subsidies but wish to visit family/friends in St. Pierre et Miquelon.





Also, just saying, their time zone is 30 minutes ahead of St. John's. We should be 1.5 hours ahead of Atlantic, not just 30 minutes. Our being less was a compromise for Labrador and Western/Central Newfoundland, of which Labrador illegally (in Newfoundland's pre-Confederation constitution AND our Terms of Union with Canada require it to be on Newfoundland Time) is mostly on Atlantic Time.

Also, it's been 9 years (!?) since Ayreonaut and my romantic trip to France.

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  #1972  
Old Posted Nov 25, 2024, 1:18 AM
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Thanks for posting the airport stats noflyzone, I love the copious amounts of data, it is so fascinating to analyze. As someone who tries to do data tracking and comparison myself, it is tedious and time consuming, and a labour of love lol, only AV geeks would get it. I also totally forgot about airliners.net! I had never participated in the forums there, I only used their search tool for aircraft photos probably 20 years ago. It was (is?) the best! Just a basic searchable photo database, but you can find whatever you want to see where you want to see it, way before Instagram or even Google Images I believe, it's been around for a long time! I might have to start browsing forums there, seems like a treasure trove of airport obsessors like me lol...

A couple YVR updates posted:

AIR CANADA NW24 VANCOUVER – WHITEHORSE CAPACITY INCREASES
Air Canada since the launch of Northern winter 2024/25 season expanded capacity on Vancouver – Whitehorse route, which saw the service entry of mainline Airbus A320 aircraft, replacing Air Canada Express CRJ900 aircraft.

The A320 is scheduled to operate until 30APR25. Schedule below focuses on the period of 01JAN25 – 28FEB25.

AC279 YVR1315 – 1650YXY 320 D
AC280 YXY1745 – 1914YVR 320 D


KOREAN AIR NS25 VANCOUVER SERVICE INCREASES
Korean Air yesterday (20NOV24) opened reservations for additional flights on Seoul Incheon – Vancouver route, during Northern summer 2025 season. From 30MAR25, the airline will maintain 14 weekly flights, instead of initially filed 10 weekly flights.

Following schedule focuses on the period of 31MAR25 – 30JUN25.

KE071 ICN1850 – 1240YVR 789 D
KE075 ICN2240 – 1630YVR 789 D

KE076 YVR0100 – 0420+1ICN 789 D
KE072 YVR1430 – 1750+1ICN 789 D


HONG KONG AIRLINES RESUMES VANCOUVER SERVICE FROM MID-JAN 2025
Hong Kong Airlines in January 2025 is resuming service to North America, as the airline filed confirmed Hong Kong – Vancouver schedule (instead of previously mentioned fictitious schedule for system testing), effective 18JAN25. The airline initially will operate this route twice weekly with Airbus A330-300 aircraft.

Reservations as of 0345GMT 21NOV24 is not available, but expected to open soon.

HX080 HKG2210 – 1810YVR 333 2
HX080 HKG2350 – 1950YVR 333 6
HX081 YVR0105 – 0700+1HKG 333 37

Hong Kong Airlines last served this route until 2020.


--

The YXY announcement is so insignificant to me, didn't even really deserve a post lol... They switch all the time from Jazz to mainline, season to season, year to year, nobody keeps track. The only reason I even posted it is because I have a personal history with the route, I worked for Air North in 2006/08 and seeing their growth and domination on this route is so satisfying. I'm pretty sure there was a season that AC operated a single daily A320 even back then, it's totally flat, while 4N has exploded! They used to have one daily 11:30ish departure, and maybe 2-3 days with an evening flight in peak periods only. Looking at W25 (just chose a random week), and 4N is 23x weekly to YXY!! That's unreal to me, and their fleet now has several larger capacity planes too.

In those days, we would put cargo on the passenger rows in the plane, filling whatever any empty seats with bags of mail or courier packages (Canada, Post, Fedex, UPS, and Purolator would consolidate their YXY bound cargo in bags and deliver to 4N, our cargo didn't sort anything, we just weighed and counted the bags, and decided where to load it. Mail or courier boxes were the perfect cargo to put in "seat packs", what we called it. Transport Canada obviously had/have rules regarding what can be in the pax cabin, so there were no dangerous goods, or perishables, or machinery cargo put there. But mail and courier packaged boxes were no problem. If flight loads were full, obviously there was no opportunity to do this, but sometimes the afternoon flights would be light pax loads (ie. 50/120 seats) so we'd seat all pax at the front, and load cargo in the back rows. So even a small pax count wasn't a disaster, the cargo business was so important, it was an eye opener for me to see the freight levels and demand. YXY is not easily accessible by road from anywhere really, so air freight is king!

AC was never strong on YXY, they deployed CRAs on a route that is cargo heavy, and those things can't carry anything. Even then, 4N was the boss, with 7 or 10 flights total a week. But now it's another level, I can't believe they were able to stimulate that much demand, it's remarkable for a relatively small and limited route airline. Then they operate 7x weekly YLW, and 2x weekly YYJ (these were not in the schedule when I was there, just for charters). And these are not continuing on to YXY from YYJ or YLW, they are just to feed into YVR. That's a lot of seats for being just a feeder though, it's remarkable how they have grown on a market that most people wouldn't think twice about, and then some! Love to see it, having worked there for years I still feel personally connected and root for them always, and seems like they're crushing it.

The Korean Air article is much more juicy haha, we were all hoping they would extend the winter gains into summer, but it was far from certain. With AC and the Chinese airlines starting to come back, combined with HKG, TPE, and Tokyo being back to capacity, plus SIN and BKK new additions compared to pre-Covid, they could have decided it was too much capacity. They obviously were taking advantage of China being non existent when they increased frequency twice in the winter (from 10x weekly to 14x weekly), and then also added the 787-10. There's always a risk China reopening cuts back other carriers, so to see them go into summer 2x daily is encouraging (it doesn't specify which 787, but I assume both -9).

The Hong Kong Airlines add was leaked on SSP already, someone spotted their job postings (these are always the earliest solid indicator, even before any airline announcement). We are back to being spoiled on HKG with 17x weekly, and then AC's daily and 2x on HX. I still don't consider HX solid, they pulled out even before Covid, so that's real weakness. They abandoned their overseas network entirely, so while it's good to see a carrier return, I like seeing CX beef up even more.

I just noticed YVR-BNE is 5x weekly in summer season, was this always the case? I thought it stayed daily all year?
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  #1973  
Old Posted Nov 25, 2024, 3:25 AM
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Originally Posted by zahav View Post
I just noticed YVR-BNE is 5x weekly in summer season, was this always the case? I thought it stayed daily all year?
No, it was pretty much ever daily year-round, even pre-pandemic.

The route is always daily during winter months, and daily during peak summer except last year where it ran 6x weekly. Then it was always reduced to as low as 5x weekly for the months of April, May, Oct, and Nov.
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  #1974  
Old Posted Nov 25, 2024, 3:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thenoflyzone View Post
Market share and monthly seats by airline for November 2024.

(Seat count seems to be total seats, both ways.)

Market share at YYZ - Top 5
AC: 53.4% - 2,258,320
WS: 10.4% - 438,704
PD: 6.5% - 276,144
TS: 3.4% - 144,627
UA: 3.2% - 134,682

Market share at YUL - Top 5
AC: 57.3% - 1,103,814
TS: 11.2% - 215,467
PD: 5.2% - 100,404
WG: 4.3% - 82,593
DL: 2.6% - 50,636

Market share at YVR - Top 5
AC: 46.8% - 1,079,478
WS: 21.4% - 493,347
F8: 5.5% - 126,441
UA: 2.6% - 59,586
PD: 2.0% - 47,256

Market share at YYC - Top 5
WS: 67.5% - 1,065,022
AC: 16.7% - 263,849
F8: 4.8% - 75,033
UA: 2.8% - 44,106
PD: 2.1% - 33,792
This just show what I said earlier.. If F8 ever fail, YVR will hurt the most. The number of seats provided by F8 is insignificant from all major airports except YVR and YYC. For YYC, WS will quickly fill that 5% capacity. But for YVR, AC have no plane to fill the void, and WS will most like add more flights to YYC and feed into their hub there. PD have no interest setting up a hub at YVR yet, even though they managed to sneak into the top 5.

For YYZ, looks like F8 should be at the #6 spot as it always have slightly more seats compared to YVR. So my guess is around 130-132k seats.

Since Nov was always the month where F8 operates with a bare-bone schedule, not sure what the stat looks like for any other months. My guess would be around 8% for YVR.
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  #1975  
Old Posted Nov 25, 2024, 8:06 PM
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WS extended its schedule into Winter 2025/2026 this weekend.

YYC-ORD is extended to year-round, 3x weekly in winter months.

Also a few flight number changes were made: (All effective Oct. 27/25)
YYC-FCO becomes WS24/25
YYC-BCN becomes WS28/29
YYC-LHR becomes WS01/02 (officially taking it over from the former LGW service)
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  #1976  
Old Posted Nov 26, 2024, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nname View Post
PD have no interest setting up a hub at YVR yet, even though they managed to sneak into the top 5.
They have opened up a base in Vancouver for both pilots and flight attendants. That comes first.

I think they need to get that base fully staffed before we see flights from Vancouver to non-hub destinations. That is coming along now.
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  #1977  
Old Posted Nov 26, 2024, 12:14 PM
nname nname is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by casper View Post
They have opened up a base in Vancouver for both pilots and flight attendants. That comes first.

I think they need to get that base fully staffed before we see flights from Vancouver to non-hub destinations. That is coming along now.
They only opened 17 CA and 17 FO position for internal transfer, and ended up getting 19/15 here. That's probably good to for a couple of daily flights to YYZ/YUL/YOW and maybe deadhead to YYC/YEG to operate from there whenever its needed. This is the plan until they run out of places to fly to from their current bases and start to hire more here.

If they are really interested in expanding in the west right now, they would've been flying between YVR/YYC/YEG already. I'm sure they have plenty of aircrafts available to fly those routes.

Last edited by nname; Nov 26, 2024 at 12:27 PM.
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  #1978  
Old Posted Nov 27, 2024, 5:11 AM
Dominion301 Dominion301 is offline
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An Airbus Beluga originally scheduled to stopover at YYT had to divert to YQY due to weather: https://conair.ca/recent-news/convair-fl...s%20of%20aerial%20firefighting%20service.

Must have been quite the sight for that small airport.
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  #1979  
Old Posted Nov 27, 2024, 6:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nname View Post
They only opened 17 CA and 17 FO position for internal transfer, and ended up getting 19/15 here. That's probably good to for a couple of daily flights to YYZ/YUL/YOW and maybe deadhead to YYC/YEG to operate from there whenever its needed. This is the plan until they run out of places to fly to from their current bases and start to hire more here.

If they are really interested in expanding in the west right now, they would've been flying between YVR/YYC/YEG already. I'm sure they have plenty of aircrafts available to fly those routes.
The YVR-YYZ/YUL/YOW can be operated from either end. Having a few pilots and cabin staff based in Vancouver means they can add routes from Vancouver to the US at the drop a hat. Now they need to be convinced there is more money to be made out of Vancouver than Toronto.
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  #1980  
Old Posted Nov 27, 2024, 7:43 AM
zahav zahav is offline
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I don't want PD to hurt WS or AC at YVR, I am not against competition so obviously let the free market decide success, but my personal wish would be to ensure both AC and WS stay strong and grow ahead of PD or F8 or whoever.

This came out of nowhere:

Yeehaw! WestJet announces service between Vancouver and Austin beginning this summer

VANCOUVER, BC, Nov. 26, 2024 /CNW/ - Today, WestJet announced plans to launch new threetimes-weekly nonstop service connecting Vancouver and Austin, Texas. Beginning May 11, 2025, the new route will unlock significant tourism and economic opportunities in both destinations, bridging businesses, tourists and cultural exchange between the vibrant city of Vancouver and the dynamic, rapidly growing market of Austin.

"As we continue to strengthen our service across Western Canada, we are proud to add new WestJet service between Vancouver and Austin as part of our expanded summer schedule," said Daniel Fajardo, WestJet Vice-President of Network and Schedule Planning. "This service will provide a valuable connection between the Greater Vancouver Area and Southern U.S., offering guests a convenient and affordable way to explore Austin's thriving music scene and renowned culinary culture, while also providing U.S.-based guests access to one of Canada's most iconic metropolises."

Vancouver-Austin
3x weekly
Starts May 11, 2025
6:00 p.m.
12:17 a.m.
Austin-Vancouver
3x weekly
Starts May 12, 2025
8:00 a.m.
10:38 a.m.

"We are pleased to see WestJet's network into key U.S. destinations from YVR continue to grow, with the addition of service into Austin, Texas," said Russ Atkinson, Director, Air Service Development at Vancouver International Airport (YVR). "Recognized as one of the best cities in the world for live music, this route to Austin builds on our existing linkages and is a welcome addition to WestJet's expanded summer service, which includes additional new non-stop flights from YVR to Boston, MA and Tampa, FL."

Earlier this week, WestJet revealed its 2025 summer schedule, outlining significant growth across the country, including significant enhances to transborder offerings from Vancouver. This summer, WestJet will serve a total of 15 U.S.-based destinations from Vancouver with up to 93 weekly departures out of the region during peak summer travel.


Interesting that this news release came just 7 days after WS did their bonanza releases across the country. Had their not secured the rights yet or something? I thought transborder services were unlimited and regulatory approvals are just a formality? Unlike many foreign countries where the approvals are essential and sometimes uncertain. Would've thought they knew 7 days ago that this could/would happen? No big deal, love to see the unexpected add, especially after they already seemed to give away their goodies to Canadian airports last week. Just curious why this new add came so soon after the main release, when you'd think they'd have included it. Hence why I said unexpected, just the timing. It makes sense that they are challenging AC on routes where AC isn't fully committed (ie. BNA and AUS, both newer destinations and ones with lower weekly frequencies, so more room for WS). And then BOS where they gave up totally. At least the WS YVR-AUS is timed and scheduled differently enough from AC that it offers something different from AC, they have an evening YVR departure, overnights in AUS, then returns the next morning at 8am. Anyone remember if YYC-AUS was always going to be 3x weekly this summer, or is that a change? Surprised both cities have the same frequency at this point. What WS and UA have YEG-ORD is so petty and annoying for pax. Each operating the exact same 3x days and exactly the same times? Come on, leaving 4x days with no service and no flexibility from early to late departures is frustrating. So at least WS/AC seem to stay out of each other's hair somewhat.

Without redoing all my calcs that I posted last week for WS, and just adding this new service, brings YVR to x509 weekly 385 mainline, and total seats now over 70K, ~70,098. Transborder flights at 93. I am not sure what they robbed to get this flight, so these numbers haven't taken into account a loss on another route to free up this AUS service. I'll try and do a fresh check this weekend. Although I'm relieved in the full WS article, it does match my calculations for this year spot on with their US breakdown and this line:

This summer, WestJet will serve a total of 15 U.S.-based destinations from Vancouver with up to 93 weekly departures out of the region during peak summer travel.
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