WINSTON-SALEM | Development Guide

[DCMetroWinston]

Whataburger’s opening looks imminent

[WSBornNBred]

"The Winston-Salem City Council will address on Sept. 2 a $4 million economic-incentive request from the Atlanta co-developer of The Grounds mixed-use development near Wake Forest University.
A public hearing is set for 6 p.m. on the request from CFS Infrastructure, an affiliate of Carter, according to a legal notice.
The $4 million, if approved, would go toward "helping offset the company's capital outlay for public infrastructure supporting development" for The Grounds."

https://journalnow.com/news/local/busine...f13e7d0-2bc2-4fd9-a3e6-d1d51f697fc5.html

Is this a new request due to cost overruns, or was this always intended to happen? If a new request, I cannot see Winston-Salem approving in the current environment (see: WSFCS) unless they are required since it is public infrastructure related.

Does anyone know if this overrun (?) puts any phase of the project in jeopardy?

[DCMetroWinston]

Originally Posted by smain

I was strolling through Old Salem two days ago and notice that there was a food menu posted on The Tavern. It appears Bread of Heaven Soul Food Restaurant will be taking over the building. I peaked inside and they had "Now Hiring" signs sitting on one of the tables.

https://breadofheavensoulfoodrestaurant.com/

I was surprised by the hours. They will be open for breakfast most days of the week including M-F. The hours for M-F were something like 7am-10pm. Not sure if they're open on Sundays. Also, didn't catch if they will be serving alcoholic beverages.

I always wanted that space to be a German restaurant with an awesome biergarten out back. But regardless it's a shame that space has been closed for so long.

I strolled through Old Salem late afternoon yesterday. I was shocked to see how lively the district was. Lots of foot traffic and cars. I saw someone working in the Tavern building.

[Possum]

Originally Posted by WSBornNBred

"The Winston-Salem City Council will address on Sept. 2 a $4 million economic-incentive request from the Atlanta co-developer of The Grounds mixed-use development near Wake Forest University.
A public hearing is set for 6 p.m. on the request from CFS Infrastructure, an affiliate of Carter, according to a legal notice.
The $4 million, if approved, would go toward "helping offset the company's capital outlay for public infrastructure supporting development" for The Grounds."

https://journalnow.com/news/local/busine...f13e7d0-2bc2-4fd9-a3e6-d1d51f697fc5.html

Is this a new request due to cost overruns, or was this always intended to happen? If a new request, I cannot see Winston-Salem approving in the current environment (see: WSFCS) unless they are required since it is public infrastructure related.

Does anyone know if this overrun (?) puts any phase of the project in jeopardy?

The Grounds were doomed from the start. This will be the equivalent to the recent IQ phase. Loads of dirt...fresh asphalt. Nothing more.

[DCMetroWinston]

A new restaurant is set to open next month in Old Salem at 736 South Main St.

Mark Spell, who ran Bread of Heaven restaurant inside Shekinah Glory Christian Church at 5095 Lansing Drive for several years, is moving into the space.

The previous operators of Salem Tavern closed the restaurant in 2019 and the building has been shuttered since then, mainly because it needed substantial renovations. Old Salem, Inc. sold the building at 736 South Main last year to RJS Properties, based in Charlotte, which agreed to undertake the renovations.

https://journalnow.com/life-entertainmen...2876.html#tracking-source=home-top-story

[WSBornNBred]

Originally Posted by Possum

The Grounds were doomed from the start. This will be the equivalent to the recent IQ phase. Loads of dirt...fresh asphalt. Nothing more.

I think it will happen, because Wake Forest needs the development long-term to compete with its competition (like Vanderbilt) for students, but wouldn't be surprised to see it scaled back. Especially with federal funding cuts - does Wake still need as much office space? The retail village likely depends on pre-leasing. Then again, the student housing doesn't make sense without the retail village.

Reading between the lines, the Developer mentioned that the discovery of the creek was a bit of a surprise. My guess is that surprise has led to cost overruns.

[DCMetroWinston]

Originally Posted by WSBornNBred

I think it will happen, because Wake Forest needs the development long-term to compete with its competition (like Vanderbilt) for students, but wouldn't be surprised to see it scaled back. Especially with federal funding cuts - does Wake still need as much office space? The retail village likely depends on pre-leasing. Then again, the student housing doesn't make sense without the retail village.

Reading between the lines, the Developer mentioned that the discovery of the creek was a bit of a surprise. My guess is that surprise has led to cost overruns.

The residential component already is under construction.

[WSBornNBred]

Originally Posted by DCMetroWinston

The residential component already is under construction.

I drove by yesterday and didn't see anything visible yet, but I know they announced construction. I will feel better once the residential is substantially complete, or at least vertical. I do believe the retail village will follow the student housing, because I don't see the appeal of the housing without the retail.

All that to say, I wouldn't be surprised if the development is scaled down. There are certainly headwinds facing the project - the reduction of federal funding for Wake, the growing difficulty facing retailers/restaurants (tariffs, labor, reduced consumer discretionary spending, etc.), and this apparent infrastructure shortfall. I'm not as bearish as Possum. I think the Development will happen, but the Developers aren't asking for money from the City unless there are some funding issues to sort through. And if the City refuses - what then?

[Winston-Camel]

I disagree with the bearish sentiment, though I understand the impulse and agree more broadly that city officials are totally missing the mark these days. It's basically guaranteed that the city officials will see this request as another opportunity to virtue signal to their constituents and vote against the request by the developer.

From my perspective, the first thing that would be scaled back due to cost overruns would be the creek/walkway improvements. Something more akin to what happened with the Salem Parkway project and the 5 year delay in completing the multi-use path. Next would be phasing of some of the non-anchor-tenant spaces.

I think the retail village at The Grounds will be an instant success as long as the developer/owner is selective with the tenant profile for any of the new retail spaces. You obviously need to capitalize on the WFU student clientele, but there is also a nice opportunity to bring in folks from the inner suburbs (27106 and 27104) which are within 5-15 min drive and have been some of the hottest zip codes in the Triad housing market.

My biggest concern is with Downtown, specifically 4th St. Things have been stagnant for a couple of years now. All of the newer retail areas have taken away foot traffic, and the Grounds and Salem Bottleworks will add to that pressure. In my opinion, DT won't really pick up there until we have the rest of the office towers fully leased. To my knowledge, the only tower that is fully leased is 500 W 5th.

[yadkin]

Many have indicated that the football stadium cannot be expanded because it would embarass Wake Forest to show much of it empty even though the MSA is 700,000 and the CSA is almost 2 million. There must be something I do not undersatnd about the smallest stadium in the ACC not being able to fill even when Wake is a contender (oh wait, I forgot than when Wake is hot they play their games in Charlotte). So, how can The Grounds be a full success when Wake is only around 9,000 students and the stadium (smallest in the ACC is not full)?

[WSBornNBred]

Originally Posted by yadkin

Many have indicated that the football stadium cannot be expanded because it would embarass Wake Forest to show much of it empty even though the MSA is 700,000 and the CSA is almost 2 million. There must be something I do not undersatnd about the smallest stadium in the ACC not being able to fill even when Wake is a contender (oh wait, I forgot than when Wake is hot they play their games in Charlotte). So, how can The Grounds be a full success when Wake is only around 9,000 students and the stadium (smallest in the ACC is not full)?

Two things can be true at once.

1. Wake is the smallest school in the major conferences, likely has the smallest fan base in the major conferences, and certainly would be a fiscally irresponsible decision, if not a head scratching one, to expand their stadium when they do not routinely fill their current one.

Yet,

2. A retail development can still be successful outside the stadium. Six home football games per year doesn’t fuel a retail development.

[Native Camel]

I have long given up on trying to post photographs on this forum without them being blurry. Sorry.

[DCMetroWinston]

Originally Posted by yadkin

Many have indicated that the football stadium cannot be expanded because it would embarass Wake Forest to show much of it empty even though the MSA is 700,000 and the CSA is almost 2 million. There must be something I do not undersatnd about the smallest stadium in the ACC not being able to fill even when Wake is a contender (oh wait, I forgot than when Wake is hot they play their games in Charlotte). So, how can The Grounds be a full success when Wake is only around 9,000 students and the stadium (smallest in the ACC is not full)?

While Wake is developing and will benefit from/utilize The Grounds, the region at large will patronize and frequent it.

[DCMetroWinston]

New Creekside video
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DNyzRZm3hf8/?igsh=MTdqNG5xcnlhMmRvdA==

[lareng]

In the video he says "given the proximity to WFU, they can walk on the multi-use trail over the new pedestrian crossing and into the heart of campus".

Does anyone know where will the bridge be located?

[smain]

Originally Posted by lareng

In the video he says "given the proximity to WFU, they can walk on the multi-use trail over the new pedestrian crossing and into the heart of campus".

Does anyone know where will the bridge be located?

I don't think it's a bridge. I know they are reworking the intersection of University and Reynolds.

[DCMetroWinston]

[DCMetroWinston]

From traffic concerns to noise concerns, people who live in the West End neighborhood of Winston-Salem packed this community meeting on Tuesday night to find out more about the proposed amphitheater not too far from where they live.

https://myfox8.com/news/north-carolina/w...ood-weighs-in-on-potential-amphitheater/

[DCMetroWinston]

Salem Bottleworks update
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DN31YISD4DD/?igsh=aW1wbzI4bzc1MGl3

[DCMetroWinston]

Twin City Trail ribbon-cutting

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DN551G2DrqS/?igsh=ZG9xbzZrYWRkMzF3