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  #161  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 2:49 AM
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Have you heard anything about that North Dakota is the only state that has a bank (its not commercial) that slipped throught the cracks when it became illegal to have a bank owned by the state. Since North Dakota owned the bank before the law was passed so it's the only one. Because we have the bank we can have legalized internet gambling. So with all these internet gambling companies that want their headquarters near their families in the U.S. instead of them in Belize or Aruba or something like that. I think it's a bill right now but I'm not sure. If it gets passed then all of these companies would be moving to North Dakota. I'm sure they would chose Fargo as their first choice to build their headquarters (because it's the biggest and is doing the best). I think that the population would sky rocket!! But, is this the kind of population we want????????????????? Comments...
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  #162  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 2:51 AM
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Hey this is the first time we have all (NanoBison, SmileyBoy, & myself) been on at the same time! Pretty cool.
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  #163  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 2:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F-Misthebest
Have you heard anything about that North Dakota is the only state that has a bank (its not commercial) that slipped throught the cracks when it became illegal to have a bank owned by the state. Since North Dakota owned the bank before the law was passed so it's the only one. Because we have the bank we can have legalized internet gambling. So with all these internet gambling companies that want their headquarters near their families in the U.S. instead of them in Belize or Aruba or something like that. I think it's a bill right now but I'm not sure. If it gets passed then all of these companies would be moving to North Dakota. I'm sure they would chose Fargo as their first choice to build their headquarters (because it's the biggest and is doing the best). I think that the population would sky rocket!! But, is this the kind of population we want????????????????? Comments...
The question is how many jobs would those businesses create, and what would be the pay of those jobs?? If we're talking about $10/hour credit card jobs like in Sioux Falls, then I'd say no thank you. Wee need more of the kind of stuff that Bobcat, Alien, Microsoft and Echelon are creating. Jobs that pay $40,000-50,000 per year that can attract young people to move to Fargo, and students from NDSU to STAY in Fargo. If this is the type of thing that would create some of those jobs, then let's go nuts!!!
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  #164  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 2:58 AM
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Remember the list of franchises I listed on the top of this page (about 30 minutes ago)?? Well, EVERY ONE of those kind of places can be created, and EVERY SINGLE job in those places can be created out of the creation of the kinds of high-paying nanotech and biotech and manufacturing jobs that I mentioned before (stuff coming from Alien, Bobcat, Microsoft, etc.). People want to move to cities, because they can find jobs that pay VERY WELL in their field. If a few young 20's couples looking to start a family come to Fargo because they got jobs at Microsoft and Alien paying $40,000 and $50,000, that gives more momentum for a situation where places like P.F. Chang's and Borders Books can open up.

Here's an easy way to remember:

Alien - Microsoft - Bobcat - Echelon - Phoenix International

CREATES

P.F. Chang's - Borders Books - California Pizza Kitchen - Dick's Sporting Goods

It all starts with the kind of jobs at the NDSU Technology Park and the 45th Street Business Centre. It all starts from there.
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  #165  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 3:02 AM
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Totally agree with that. I think they pay any where from $35,000 to $60,000. Well I have to go so I will probably post some new stuff when I get to Lincoln tomorrow. Buh Bye.
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  #166  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 3:07 AM
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Since your on the topic of "fun". I think what the downtown core could really use (away from the residential developments) is sort of like a dinkytown/redlight district for all the College Students. Fill it with Clubs, Sports Bars, College themed resaraunts, etc... I think a good place for that type of atmosphere would be on that plot of land that was proposed as the "Cityscapes Plaza" plan. I could see though, how that might piss off people in the Gardner (one of my absolute favorite buildings downtown) and other residential areas. Actually I can't think of a spot anywhere downtown that would be good for that kind of development, other than if we were to start moving downtown farther west and start redeveloping the area west of University Drive. Alot of smaller older homes, many of tem neglected.

Last edited by NanoBison; May 30, 2006 at 3:22 AM.
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  #167  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 3:12 AM
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I think it would be awesome to get EVERY internet gambling site into Fargo. Do you know what kind of Web Hosting facility that would require? The only things in the way of getting that passed, is the ultra conservatives in the state who ironically were also against the powerball, and the fact that the Feds seem to think even if it does get passed Internet Gambling is STILL illegal no matter what. Could you imagine the windfall in the hundreds of millions of dollars that would goto the state if a majority of those sites decided to setup shop in Fargo?

I could care less about any job potential these places would bring, more so I care about the Tax Coffers for the state. It would be nice to have a solid extra hundred million dollars every year. Now the cost of regulating that industry...oooooph. I don't know. Maybe it's a double edged sword???
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  #168  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 3:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NanoBison
I think it would be awesome to get EVERY internet gambling site into Fargo. Do you know what kind of Web Hosting facility that would require? The only things in the way of getting that passed, is the ultra conservatives in the state who ironically were also against the powerball, and the fact that the Feds seem to think even if it does get passed Internet Gambling is STILL illegal no matter what. Could you imagine the windfall in the hundreds of millions of dollars that would goto the state if a majority of those sites decided to setup shop in Fargo?
Maybe we could even start a whole new kind of place: The online-based casino casino!!!

Hear me out: We create a kind of casino where there are nothing in the building but PCs and laptops that connect to casino sites instead of the actual Roulette, Craps, Slots, etc. People could log on to every single site on any computer from a single booth in the building like a cashier's booth (there would be 1000's of sites already logged on the computers ready to go), and people could pay by sliding their credit card or bank card into a special machine attached to the PC/laptop, and their card would be automatically credited and debited according to the real-time score on the computer!! There would probably also be a buffet and maybe a hotel, and also a regular internet cafe in there too!! This thing would be like a combination of a casino and an internet cafe!! My God, this is a GREAT idea, this is just coming to me now as I type!! Think about how much people would GO for this!! It would be like the casino of the future!! I think people would go for this rather than just staying home and playing, because there would be instant payout and debit to your card, instead of the waiting you have to endure to get your money from a casino site at home. The trick would be all in the credit/debit machines. And then you could also exchange at the cashier for cold, hard cash.

Think about how many jobs this could create if this whole idea got off the ground in Fargo...
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  #169  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 3:29 AM
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We'd turn into like a small electronic Las Vegas. I don't know. I've been to Vegas. It isn't exactly a family orientated town...

But the idea of the state hosting and regulating the industry I'd still be interested in....

I got to get back to work. I'll post more as I hear it or read it....
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  #170  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 5:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmileyBoy
Maybe we could even start a whole new kind of place: The online-based casino casino!!!

Hear me out: We create a kind of casino where there are nothing in the building but PCs and laptops that connect to casino sites instead of the actual Roulette, Craps, Slots, etc. People could log on to every single site on any computer from a single booth in the building like a cashier's booth (there would be 1000's of sites already logged on the computers ready to go), and people could pay by sliding their credit card or bank card into a special machine attached to the PC/laptop, and their card would be automatically credited and debited according to the real-time score on the computer!! There would probably also be a buffet and maybe a hotel, and also a regular internet cafe in there too!! This thing would be like a combination of a casino and an internet cafe!! My God, this is a GREAT idea, this is just coming to me now as I type!! Think about how much people would GO for this!! It would be like the casino of the future!! I think people would go for this rather than just staying home and playing, because there would be instant payout and debit to your card, instead of the waiting you have to endure to get your money from a casino site at home. The trick would be all in the credit/debit machines. And then you could also exchange at the cashier for cold, hard cash.

Think about how many jobs this could create if this whole idea got off the ground in Fargo...
That's actually a pretty good idea. I would get that patented if I were you. There is a website that you can do that. That is a really good idea the more I think of it. Wow. You should take this idea to the next step and patent it. Then maybe when your rich and famous you could remember the F-M forumers and give me and NanoBison and whoever else lives here lots of money! Anyways, go to the next step. If you really apply yourself to this idea you could totally be a millionare if not a billionare. That's way in the future but it could happen. Good Luck!!!!!!!
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  #171  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 9:18 AM
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Fargo is just as suburban as any city (including the largest one in our neighboring state). Fargo is the most suburban place I have ever been actually. People have large families here, that means big demand for large homes and big-box retailers. Its quite obvious where the growth is in Fargo its west where people can have a wood framed 5 bedroom house close to the "chains" and big box retailers. People with large families in most cities do not live in the urban core of cities of the midwest, they mainly live in suburbs with large yards and McMansion style homes. Fargo likes to tout its family-friendly image, which means suburbs here always will have priority over downtown.

Anyway from the Bureau of Economic Analysis, Since it was brought up on previous posts I decided to research it.
Sioux Falls MSA 203,186
Fargo MSA 182,649
Fargo CSA 210,000
Per-Capita Income
Sioux Falls MSA 104% the national average
Fargo MSA 96% the national average
Fargo/Wahpeton EA 92% the national average
Bismarck MSA 94% the national average

If Fargo is to going add Wahpeton to the metropolitan area then Sioux Falls by that same logic could add Sioux City, Iowa to theirs its not that much further.

Downtown Fargo is by no means strong, I believe all the night-life listed (Hooters and Playmakers) are not even in the downtown area. West Acres is the premier part of the city now and by 2010 it will most likely be Osgood. Its all about West and South Fargo.

The only time Downtown Fargo does well is Friday and Saturday nights during the fall and spring semesters when the colleges have classes, for those 6 hours of the week the ten bars or so they have do have fairly large crowds. Other then that its pretty much just the very small downtown white-collar workforce walking a block from the sea of parking lots to their work. Fargo's downtown motto is "plenty of parking and they arent joking. Seems to me a quarter of the downtown is parking lots, another quarter is vacant storefronts and the other half is occupied business which only do decent business in my opinion on Friday and Saturday nights, with very few exceptions.

Downtown Fargo and the area north of Interstate 94 and east of Interstate 29 has major vacancy issues. A majority of blocks has at least one "for sale" or "for lease" sign. The area also has alot of senior citizens in it and I think if these astronomical property taxes continue you will see many more moving out because they cant afford the taxes in the homes they have lived in for decades.

13th street to 25th street in the area around Main is probubly the part of town which is set to really start sliding down-hill if they cant get these property taxes and vacant businesses and homes under control. 1st avenue from 13th to 25th starts out with a couple vacant or for sale signs per block and then ends with trailer parks that were constructed in the 1960s.

I think Fargo is a good place to live if your on the West and South side of town where they have tons of retail choices and its very clean and the roads are first-rate as are the sidewalks. East Fargo though continues its slide down-hill (with the exception of a small area near the river mainly between 4th and 8th street south of Main) and Downtown Fargo which has very little demand for new business, the streets have alot of bird droppings which accumulate for weeks and the litter and cigarette ends are everywhere also accumulating for weeks.

The only time the streets of downtown are clean is when the marathon or a rare festival occurs.

Last edited by Midwesterner19; May 30, 2006 at 9:54 AM.
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  #172  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 9:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SmileyBoy
Remember the list of franchises I listed on the top of this page (about 30 minutes ago)?? Well, EVERY ONE of those kind of places can be created, and EVERY SINGLE job in those places can be created out of the creation of the kinds of high-paying nanotech and biotech and manufacturing jobs that I mentioned before (stuff coming from Alien, Bobcat, Microsoft, etc.). People want to move to cities, because they can find jobs that pay VERY WELL in their field. If a few young 20's couples looking to start a family come to Fargo because they got jobs at Microsoft and Alien paying $40,000 and $50,000, that gives more momentum for a situation where places like P.F. Chang's and Borders Books can open up..
Fargo has been doing well getting a fair good-paying jobs in the area over the last 5 years. Thats why the city has thousands of new homes in fancy named subdivisions. People looking to start a family (as was mentioned before on previous posts) need lots of space and in Fargo wilth no barriers to growth means lots are inexpensive and construction costs are low hence new homes are cheaper here then other metro's. Fargo MSA is only a few percent below the national average on per-capita income, it would be higher if the household sizes werent so large here.

I think in Fargo that these good new jobs though, with the large families people have here dont mean as much as they would in a city with a very low birth rate that doesnt cater to large families like Fargo does.

Pretty much most of any prosperity that comes to Fargo will go to suburban big-box chains. I doubt most people with large household sizes shop at high end botiques like alot of unmarried people do in low-household size metropolitan areas.

The household sizes of people is the main reason why the property taxes are completely out of control.

Last edited by Midwesterner19; May 30, 2006 at 9:54 AM.
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  #173  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 10:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Midwesterner19
Fargo is just as suburban as any city (including the largest one in our neighboring state). Fargo is the most suburban place I have ever been actually. People have large families here, that means big demand for large homes and big-box retailers. Its quite obvious where the growth is in Fargo its west where people can have a wood framed 5 bedroom house close to the "chains" and big box retailers. People with large families in most cities do not live in the urban core of cities of the midwest, they mainly live in suburbs with large yards and McMansion style homes. Fargo likes to tout its family-friendly image, which means suburbs here always will have priority over downtown.

Anyway from the Bureau of Economic Analysis, Since it was brought up on previous posts I decided to research it.
Sioux Falls MSA 203,186
Fargo MSA 182,649
Fargo CSA 210,000
Per-Capita Income
Sioux Falls MSA 104% the national average
Fargo MSA 96% the national average
Fargo/Wahpeton EA 92% the national average
Bismarck MSA 94% the national average

If Fargo is to going add Wahpeton to the metropolitan area then Sioux Falls by that same logic could add Sioux City, Iowa to theirs its not that much further.

Downtown Fargo is by no means strong, I believe all the night-life listed (Hooters and Playmakers) are not even in the downtown area. West Acres is the premier part of the city now and by 2010 it will most likely be Osgood. Its all about West and South Fargo.

The only time Downtown Fargo does well is Friday and Saturday nights during the fall and spring semesters when the colleges have classes, for those 6 hours of the week the ten bars or so they have do have fairly large crowds. Other then that its pretty much just the very small downtown white-collar workforce walking a block from the sea of parking lots to their work. Fargo's downtown motto is "plenty of parking and they arent joking. Seems to me a quarter of the downtown is parking lots, another quarter is vacant storefronts and the other half is occupied business which only do decent business in my opinion on Friday and Saturday nights, with very few exceptions.

Downtown Fargo and the area north of Interstate 94 and east of Interstate 29 has major vacancy issues. A majority of blocks has at least one "for sale" or "for lease" sign. The area also has alot of senior citizens in it and I think if these astronomical property taxes continue you will see many more moving out because they cant afford the taxes in the homes they have lived in for decades.

13th street to 25th street in the area around Main is probubly the part of town which is set to really start sliding down-hill if they cant get these property taxes and vacant businesses and homes under control. 1st avenue from 13th to 25th starts out with a couple vacant or for sale signs per block and then ends with trailer parks that were constructed in the 1960s.

I think Fargo is a good place to live if your on the West and South side of town where they have tons of retail choices and its very clean and the roads are first-rate as are the sidewalks. East Fargo though continues its slide down-hill (with the exception of a small area near the river mainly between 4th and 8th street south of Main) and Downtown Fargo which has very little demand for new business, the streets have alot of bird droppings which accumulate for weeks and the litter and cigarette ends are everywhere also accumulating for weeks.

The only time the streets of downtown are clean is when the marathon or a rare festival occurs.
What is your problem? I don't understand why you hate Fargo-Moorhead So Much!!! If you have been to Sioux Falls you would know that it is way more suburbanized then Fargo-Moorhead. I mean look at it. Fargo just isn't for famlies and college students. Many people are retiring here as well as some 30-55 year old people who are very metropolitan are moving here. How do you think something like the Ho-Do could stay open if we didn't have a good amount of cosmopolitan people? Hmm? In southwest Fargo there are new condos that are more cosmopolitan then you would think would be in Fargo. They have slanted fireplaces with huge modern windows. They have concrete floors and hard rusted wood stairs. They also have surround sound throughout the entire condo. There are two buildings right now which means there are eight condos. They are in the process of building four more condos as we speak. There are also many retirement developments going up as well. The Edgewood Development and the Sheyenne Crossing to name a couple.

I don't care what you say about Sioux Falls being bigger, we are. If we include Wahpeton that doesn't give Sioux Falls the right to include Sioux City. Do you know how big Wahpeton is? It is 8,586. I found that out on this website http://www.wahpeton.com/. Sioux City is 83,680. That I found on Emporis. So since Wahpeton is only that big it doesn't really make a difference. 83,680 would. That is probably why we include it in our population. Also, Sioux City is its own metro area by itself with South Sioux City, North Sioux City, and Sioux City itself.
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  #174  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 10:11 PM
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Midwesterner19, with all do respect, Downtown Fargo-Moorhead is doing just fine.
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  #175  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 10:57 PM
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Originally Posted by F-Misthebest
What is your problem? I don't understand why you hate Fargo-Moorhead So Much!!! . I mean look at it. Fargo just isn't for famlies and college students. Many people are retiring here as well as some 30-55 year old people who are very metropolitan are moving here. How do you think something like the Ho-Do could stay open if we didn't have a good amount of cosmopolitan people? Hmm? In southwest Fargo there are new condos that are more cosmopolitan then you would think would be in Fargo. They have slanted fireplaces with huge modern windows. They have concrete floors and hard rusted wood stairs. They also have surround sound throughout the entire condo. There are two buildings right now which means there are eight condos. They are in the process of building four more condos as we speak. There are also many retirement developments going up as well. The Edgewood Development and the Sheyenne Crossing to name a couple.

I don't care what you say about Sioux Falls being bigger, we are. If we include Wahpeton that doesn't give Sioux Falls the right to include Sioux City. Do you know how big Wahpeton is? It is 8,586. I found that out on this website http://www.wahpeton.com/. Sioux City is 83,680. That I found on Emporis. So since Wahpeton is only that big it doesn't really make a difference. 83,680 would. That is probably why we include it in our population. Also, Sioux City is its own metro area by itself with South Sioux City, North Sioux City, and Sioux City itself.
I dont dislike Fargo, I am just stating a fact that its very suburban.

They do have nice condos in the suburban areas of SW Fargo and in Sheyennee Crossing in West Fargo why because people in Fargo value being close to the massive retail corridor along 13th avenue in suburban.

The suburban areas in Fargo are more cosmopolitan are better set-up then in a vast majority of cities. I think 13th avenue from 38th to West Fargo is the most cosmpolitan area of Fargo in-fact in my opinion.

Whats suprising is alot more college students live closer to West Acres then Downtown Fargo. I saw some maps from the census that showed many of the census tracts near downtown median age is over 40 years and those homes are small, too small for people to raise a large family in. They also have a few downtown apartment buildings and the rest is single-family homes with mainly retirees in both of them.

I agree Fargo is a great place to raise a family for 30 to 55 year olds, these suburban sub-divisions are some of the nicest ive seen anywhere in the nation just passing through. Plus construction wages and land is inexpensive so people can get a new house for less then any other metropolitan areas even if property taxes on that McMansion they have are high.

Two or three decent downtown blocks with some bars and even two martini bars (with one overlooking a massive parking) for the software engineers from other states dont make up for the decline, parking lots and vacant storefronts and buildings that surround it.

Last edited by Midwesterner19; May 30, 2006 at 11:11 PM.
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  #176  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 10:59 PM
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Originally Posted by F-Misthebest
What is your problem? I don't understand why you hate Fargo-Moorhead So Much!!! . I mean look at it. Fargo just isn't for famlies and college students. Many people are retiring here as well as some 30-55 year old people who are very metropolitan are moving here. How do you think something like the Ho-Do could stay open if we didn't have a good amount of cosmopolitan people? Hmm? In southwest Fargo there are new condos that are more cosmopolitan then you would think would be in Fargo. They have slanted fireplaces with huge modern windows. They have concrete floors and hard rusted wood stairs. They also have surround sound throughout the entire condo. There are two buildings right now which means there are eight condos. They are in the process of building four more condos as we speak. There are also many retirement developments going up as well. The Edgewood Development and the Sheyenne Crossing to name a couple.

I don't care what you say about Sioux Falls being bigger, we are. If we include Wahpeton that doesn't give Sioux Falls the right to include Sioux City. Do you know how big Wahpeton is? It is 8,586. I found that out on this website http://www.wahpeton.com/. Sioux City is 83,680. That I found on Emporis. So since Wahpeton is only that big it doesn't really make a difference. 83,680 would. That is probably why we include it in our population. Also, Sioux City is its own metro area by itself with South Sioux City, North Sioux City, and Sioux City itself.
I dont dislike Fargo, I am just stating a fact that its very suburban.

They do have nice condos in the suburban areas of SW Fargo and in Sheyennee Crossing in West Fargo why because people in Fargo value being close to the massive retail corridor along 13th avenue in suburban.

The suburban areas in Fargo are more cosmopolitan are better set-up then in a vast majority of cities.

Whats suprising is alot more college students live closer to West Acres then Downtown Fargo. I saw some maps from the census that showed many of the census tracts near downtown median age is over 40 years and those homes are small.

I agree Fargo is a great place to raise a family for 30 to 55 year olds, these suburban sub-divisions are some of the nicest ive seen anywhere in the nation just passing through. Plus construction wages and land is inexpensive so people cant get a new house for less then any other metropolitan areas even if property taxes on that McMansion they have are high.

Two or three decent downtown blocks with some bars and even two martini bars for the software engineers from other states dont make up for the decline, parking lots and vacant storefronts and buildings that surround it.
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  #177  
Old Posted May 30, 2006, 11:53 PM
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I'm glad you loosened up a bit on the area. I do agree with you that downtown has way too many parking lots. I think we need more parking garages like the Island Park Ramp. That one is actually nice. I don't know if you have been downtown recently but next to the NDSU Downtown building they tore up a parking lot. I hope they build another building there like the Vogel Law Firm in downtown instead of making a better parking lot. At least build a parking garage.

There aren't too many empty buildings empty downtown, just a few. I know of three on Main and just a coupe on Broadway but not too many. There is an Atomic Coffee going in where the old Interiors by France thing was so that's good. The brick building connected to the Main Ave Theatre is now Mr. Print. They moved from the main floor of the Fargoan because (as I hope you know ) the Fargoan is being converted into condos. I'm glad to see many new condo projects being built downtown but I would like to see some more affordable ones. Right now if you want a new condo they're between $400,000 to $1,000,000. If you are a college student and want to be an architect and live downtown the only thing you're going to get is some small crappy house or apartment on the outskirts. That's why I personnaly think turning the Union Storage Building into low income apartments is a great idea. I personally own my own house in Horace so it won't really effect me, but I'm sure they would sell like crazy. Some rich snow birds have already bought some condos in the Kay's Printing Building (love that building). I think four of them have already been sold if not yet more.

But you have to agree that Sioux Falls is more suburbanized then Fargo. It's a really nice city but I'm afraid that it is going to kill itself because it's getting to suburban. Do any of you have comments on this?
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  #178  
Old Posted May 31, 2006, 2:38 AM
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I guess I better give my two cents about the discussions taking place here..

Right now I think downtown Fargo is doing great and with more construction going on it won't be declining for a while. I don't know what makes Midwest think GF is doing better because I was just in GF in April and the downtown was an absolute ghost town. I still think downtown needs some kind of destination type of place to lure more people in but in my opinion that is all it's missing.

As for Fargo metro's growth I think 1-2% a year is about right, my part time job during college is hauling sheetrock so I see a lot of the growth first hand and construction of homes seems to be picking up not decreasing this year. With areas in Dilworth and Moorhead getting a fair amount of new homes. I also live right by Merticare and there are some homes for sale/rent but it's not as bad as Midwest is making it out to be I do wish the city would do what Moorhead did and give the people who live up here an incentive to fix up their houses. As to luring people/company's to Fargo I did see in the paper that Microsoft put in a big business center in Fargo that will lure thousands of business people to town each year. Hopefully they like what they see and think about expanding into Fargo. Fargo also needs to do a better job of selling how great the communtiy it is and how the winters aren't so bad. Sell the lakes, great hunting and fishing, safe living, nice people, great schools. When people think Fargo they think flat and cold, show them a few pictures of DL lakes area, Redhawks games, and area golf courses/parks and they will quickly think otherwise.

This article really explains why I love living in Fargo and don't mind bearing the cold winter months...
http://www.in-forum.com/articles/index.cfm?id=128323

I also don't see the decline of 13th ave happening soon, Osgood/Eagle Run is no threat to it since it is all pretty much strip malls and residential out there no big malls from what I have seen besides the Crossing. Having the extra 10 thousand people out in Eagle Run/Osgood is more a benefit for 13th ave. and should help in ensuring it's future. (Also the Shoppes at Osgood is nothing more then a strip mall and it is no threat to West Acres at all).
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  #179  
Old Posted May 31, 2006, 3:04 AM
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NanoBison NanoBison is offline
FargoMoorhead comin at ya
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Fargo-Moorhead, ND-MN
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Hello again midwesterner,

I'm going to have to respectfully disagree with your views, once again, on the downtown area. You have some valid points with the Property Value problems. The cause of that isn't simply the size of families in the FM area. It has to do with many things. Many people built large houses (up to the max they could afford) and then when property assesments were done after a few years of not being done, people's houses were worth more, and in turn they needed to pay additional property taxes. It's a similar situation in Valley City. The city didn't do any property assessments for 25 years (something outrageous like that) and then all of the sudden peoples houses were worth almost twice as much as originally assessed. Not a good situation to be in. There is also obviously a demand for housing nationwide. This too lead prices up, including in the valley. There's many issues that cause this. Family size, would be a smaller cause behind the others.

There may be a lower cost to building a home in West Fargo, but that city does't even come close to providing the services that the city of Fargo does. West Fargo does't even have a fulltime Fire Dept. Almost 20,000 people and no fulltime Fire Dept? A majority of the force is volunteer. West Fargo can't even come up with the cash or federal funds to build the I94 overpass at 9th, until 2008(big if) most likely 2009. They also talk about the many millions of dollars it's going to cost each year just to maintain new sewer/water service to all of the new homes being built. Another issue is Sheyenne Street. Once you go south of I94, that road should be 4 laned, with a center lane, at least. The traffic counts out there are ridiculous and driving during the morning or evening rush is something to make you . Why, because they don't have the money. The only thing they are doing right is the schools and they get that money off of the businesses in Fargo.

I don't hate West Fargo, but if you ask me, that city is simply leeching off of Fargo. That's why no one in West Fargo would ever want the two cities to combine into one super city. They state their taxes and other costs would go up? Why? Probably becuase someone else (citizens of Fargo) is footing the bill so West Fargo people can have it on the cheap.

I'm not impressed either with their Mayor. Anytime all of the cities try to work together and help each other out, West Fargo always backs out (like the central emergency call center), stating it was not worth the money, or their share of the costs are too high and the Mayor always has a stupid smirk on his face. The most important issue for the next 50 years is the source of water for the RRV. We should get it from the Missouri, but once again, the Mayor of West Fargo and it's council members are stating the costs outweigh the benefits. Fargo, Moorhead, Dilworth, all seem to understand it takes money, but not West Fargo.

I see West Fargo's population eventually toppling off around probably 30,000-40,000. Once they have to increase taxes and mill levies to fund the additional needed services of a growing city, some other people will start another city to the west of West Fargo, and feed off of them. At that time Fargo will truely be the Core of the Metropolitan Area, probably hovering around 150,000 people in just Fargo. The city at that point will be more commercial than it was previously. West Fargo will continue to grow as a bedroom community with some commercial, but never on the level of Fargo.
Fargo's downtown will continue to grow and highrise buildings will start popping up downtown with higher-density growth (commercially and residentially) from larger homegrown businesses and businesses that have been lured to the city. It will be the place for those people that don't want to make the ever growing morning and evening commutes and have the urge to live a different flavor of life, other than the typical big-box retailers, chain stores and other types of businesses that have made the outerurban areas of EVERY American city look exactly alike.

These businesses are of course needed for growth and provide services to countless citizens and tax money to the city coffers. So I don't hate them either.

Pretty soon cities will be identified by : "no, that's the one with 3 Walmarts, 2 Home Depots and a Cabela's..."



Finally, in closing midwesterner, I know what downtown FargoMoorhead used to look like in 1997. You can't possibly tell me that it hasn't made a decent 180 degree from then and is only continuing to get better.
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  #180  
Old Posted May 31, 2006, 3:08 AM
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NanoBison NanoBison is offline
FargoMoorhead comin at ya
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Fargo-Moorhead, ND-MN
Posts: 547
p.s. Midwesterner, neither we, nor the City of Fargo, made the CMSA area definitions. The United State Census Bureau did. If you have problems with that, you should probably take it up with them.

Last edited by NanoBison; May 31, 2006 at 3:18 AM.
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