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  #1741  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2017, 5:52 PM
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rocketphish rocketphish is offline
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Originally Posted by McC View Post
The Councillor's high-level expectations for a redeveloped LeBreton Flats
http://catherinemckenney.ca/en/2017/...ebreton-flats/
Is she listing a bunch of expectations that are already in the Rendezvous LeBreton plan so that she can then claim to have fought for, and won, those concessions later for her constituents? Hmm
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  #1742  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2017, 7:16 PM
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nothing wrong with holding people to their word, I suppose.
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  #1743  
Old Posted Nov 22, 2017, 11:38 PM
Marshsparrow Marshsparrow is offline
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Yeah... good luck with all of that - when will the NCC listen to a local councillor?!?!?
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  #1744  
Old Posted Nov 23, 2017, 2:32 PM
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@NCC_CCN

#LeBretonFlats: The formal negotiations have advanced. We're continuing our consultation process with Indigenous groups. #ottawa #lebreton
they said that a bigger update expected in January.
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  #1745  
Old Posted Dec 4, 2017, 5:56 PM
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A new downtown NHL arena: What Ottawa can learn from Edmonton
Keynote speaker at Ottawa’s Economic Outlook says public subsidies for pro sports can be controversial

By: David Sali
Published: Dec 4, 2017 7:16am EST


Even news that a major condo project near Edmonton’s new NHL rink is being scrapped isn’t enough to dampen the spirits of the arena’s point man at the city.

“Ten years ago, that would have been devastating news, a condo project being cancelled,” Rick Daviss told OBJ on Friday, a day after Lamb Development Corp. confirmed that slow sales had led it to ditch plans to build a 36-storey luxury condo complex just blocks from the Edmonton Oilers’ new home, Rogers Place.

“But now, it’s like, ‘Oh well, there’s another six that are about to go in the ground and another six under construction.’”

Mr. Daviss, the bureaucrat who shepherded the $600-million Rogers Place project through Edmonton city hall, is a believer in the power of developments such as major sports arenas to breathe new life into a local economy.

“This set the city on fire,” he said of the massive building project that opened in the fall of 2016 and also includes a community rink attached to the main arena and a connection to Edmonton’s light-rail transit system.

“It’s a showpiece. For anybody who comes to town, that’s what you go and look at. It’s a true source of pride for many Edmontonians.”

But more than pride, Mr. Daviss said, the new arena has spurred economic growth in the city’s downtown core.

A spate of new condos and commercial office developments near the arena has Edmonton city hall projecting the building boom will generate up to a billion dollars in new property tax revenue over the next two decades.

That’s more than enough, Mr. Daviss said, to offset the drop in value of Class-B and C buildings nearby after tenants fled to developments near the Oilers’ new ice palace.

“All of the naysayers who were saying it’s a white elephant … everybody wants to have a piece of Rogers Place,” he said.

With Ottawa in the midst of its own conversation about the merits of a downtown arena, Mr. Daviss will be at the Shaw Centre on Thursday morning to share his insights and a few lessons learned when it comes to rink-building. He’ll be joined by Bob Black, Oilers owner Darryl Katz’s top man on the arena file, for a keynote address at Ottawa’s Economic Outlook, an annual event sponsored by OBJ and the Ottawa Chamber of Commerce.

Dubbed “Edmonton’s Odd Couple” by a newspaper columnist in the Alberta capital, Mr. Daviss and Mr. Black worked together on one of the largest public-private partnerships in Canadian real-estate history.

Edmonton taxpayers are footing the bill for roughly half of the arena project’s cost. Much of that is coming from a so-called community revitalization levy, which will see a portion of downtown property taxes funnelled to the project.

The team is paying about a quarter of the cost, with the rest funded through ticket surcharges. The city owns the arena and is leasing it back to the Oilers and Mr. Katz.

Mr. Daviss conceded it wasn’t easy to sell taxpayers on the merits of funding such a hefty chunk of the Oilers’ new home.

“(Edmontonians) love their hockey and they would love to have a new arena, but they didn’t want their hard-earned dollars going to the billionaire owner and the millionaire hockey players,” he said.

“What we had to convince the general public and the paying public was that this is not giving money to a billionaire. This is investing into a product that is going to generate revenues which are going to keep your taxes lower and bring new infrastructure and vitality to the city. There was a lot of skepticism. It was a long haul, but people finally embraced that.”

Mr. Daviss admitted he’s not well-versed on Ottawa’s situation, and stressed that a new arena is not a sure-fire cure-all for every city’s economic woes. He points to Edmonton’s biggest provincial rival a couple of hours south, noting the current economic climate in Calgary – where the Flames are pushing for a new arena of their own – is much different than it was in Edmonton when the Rogers Place plan was hatched.

“They’ve got a whole bunch of new development that’s sitting vacant right now,” he said of southern Alberta city, which has been hit hard by the downturn in the oil and gas sector.

“It’s much riskier in Calgary right now than it was in Edmonton when we had our kick at the cat. Going in with your eyes open is the advice I would give. If you think this is going to add vibrancy and vitality and has development potential, I would say jump at it.”

Mr. Black and Mr. Daviss were invited to speak at Thursday’s event by local entrepreneur Doug McLarty, a partner in MNP’s Ottawa office and chair of the Ottawa Chamber of Commerce’s new city-building task force.

Calling a redeveloped LeBreton Flats with an NHL arena “a transformative opportunity for the city,” Mr. McLarty said he wants to kickstart a conversation about the project and its merits.

“It’s all about education,” he said. “It’s about showing the positive impact that something of this nature can have on a city. The financial success (of Rogers Place) is beyond what anybody’s expectations were.”

He said he thinks a few critics of the Rendezvous LeBreton plan might change their minds after learning about Edmonton’s experience.

“I know there are a lot of naysayers,” he said. “I want people in the city to have an opportunity to hear both sides of the (argument). We want to get a dialogue going.”

While Edmonton city taxpayers ultimately funded a significant portion of their new arena, whether that will happen in Ottawa is still unclear. Mayor Jim Watson said earlier this year the city hasn’t been asked to help pay for a new downtown home for the Senators, and he refused to speculate on such a proposal.

Mr. McLarty said his two children are young adults who’ve chosen to live in Toronto because they see it as a more vibrant city with better career prospects than their hometown. He wants that perception to change, and believes a revived LeBreton Flats with an NHL arena at its core could be a key part of the solution.

“It’s not just about the arena,” he said. “It’s about all of the other aspects surrounding the arena in LeBreton Flats. It’s a much bigger picture than just the facility itself.”

Mr. Daviss knows as well as anyone how talk of public subsidies for arenas can cause emotions to flare.

“That’s all everybody talked about here for three years,” he said. “By the end of the conversation, I didn’t have anybody that wasn’t a supporter, and half the people were skeptical at the start.”

Quote:
Ottawa's Economic Outlook

Date: Thursday, Dec. 7
Time: 11 a.m.
Speakers:
Ottawa Mayor Jim Watson
Douglas Porter, Chief Economist at BMO Financial Group
Robert Black, Executive Vice President of The Katz Group
Rick Daviss, Executive Director, Downtown Arena Project, City of Edmonton
Ticket information: Click here
http://www.obj.ca/article/new-downto...learn-edmonton
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  #1746  
Old Posted Dec 13, 2017, 2:41 AM
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I just noticed something with RVL's renderings of the buried Confederation Line.

On the renderings showing Pimisi Station from a higher perspective, they show it pretty much as it is, with the centre platform, while the cross-section shows a station with side platforms further west.



Last edited by J.OT13; Dec 13, 2017 at 3:06 AM.
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  #1747  
Old Posted Dec 13, 2017, 6:18 AM
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
I just noticed something with RVL's renderings of the buried Confederation Line.

On the renderings showing Pimisi Station from a higher perspective, they show it pretty much as it is, with the centre platform, while the cross-section shows a station with side platforms further west.
I think that's a combination of a couple of things. First is that it looks like the Citizen did the actual labeling of the map. Second is that there are no underground stations with center platforms, so there are not easy renderings to borrow from as they did.

I'm not reading into it much.
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  #1748  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 4:42 AM
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https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/senators...025835239.html

Senators owner Eugene Melnyk dangles relocation on eve of outdoor game

Justin CuthbertPuck DaddyDec 15, 2017, 9:58 PM

Nothing – not the unforgivably cold weather or the similarly frigid reality that faces a franchise with the second-worst record in the conference – could take from this weekend for the Ottawa Senators, who finally have an outdoor game to call their own.

Or so they thought.

Moments before legends of the franchise played pick-up on Parliament Hill – the outdoor appetizer ahead of Saturday’s NHL 100 Classic at TD Place Stadium between the Senators and Montreal Canadiens – owner Eugene Melnyk dangled the idea of moving the team, telling local and national reporters in town for the event that he didn’t get rich just to prop up a floundering franchise.

Via Sportsnet’s Luke Fox:

I’m not going to blow a lifetime of working hard to support a hockey team. It’s not gonna happen. The bigger question is whether I’m prepared to blow all that money I made over many years in a different industry in a different country. How long can you underwrite a team?

Ill-timed and yet totally deliberate, Melnyk blamed the fans with his veiled threat. This, while die-hards lined an outdoor rink in arctic conditions to see Alexandre Daigle school other alumni at half speed.

Though not committed to Ottawa, Melnyk, despite his discontent, intends to continue running his business, his way.

He compared his plight to owning a McDonald’s, saying the simple decision would be to move the burger chain to a more profitable location, not giving up on its potential profitability, because the hard part is acquiring the business in the first place.

“It’s just too much fun,” Melnyk said. “What else are you going to do? I’m a Canadian. I’m a hockey fan.”

The best-of-both-worlds scenario for Melnyk and fans of the Senators is believed to be a move downtown to the Lebreton Flat development. But it appears he’s souring on the prospects of that as well.

“I’m not sure downtown is necessary,” he explained. “All those Kanata people, are they going to come downtown? Are you just moving an arena closer to people who can’t get tickets?”

Melnyk’s media meltdown has been the culmination of some awful PR this season for the Senators, who, from an on-ice perspective, have fallen off a cliff since their improbable run to Game 7 of the Eastern Conference Final last spring.

He made the decision to throw a tarp on more than 1,000 seats in the upper bowl in a failed effort to increase ticket demand. More recently, after Erik Karlsson ruffled feathers in the Senators boardroom when insisting that he will receive his true value when he signs his next contract, there were reports that the superstar captain was (inexplicably) asked to provide his no-trade list. Then this week, former Senators centre Kyle Turris (and his wife) blamed Melnyk for his departure, telling members of the Ottawa media that management wanted to sign him long term.

Though operations is comparably threadbare, Melnyk’s player payroll is currently just outside the top 10 in the NHL, which he used to defend his comments Friday.

But he insisted that slashing cost will soon trickle down to the roster – a situation Karlsson will keep tightly fitted under the microscope as he moves closer and closer to unrestricted free agency in two summers.
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  #1749  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 1:04 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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There has been a lot of relocation talk in the last few weeks (including Don Cherry a few weeks ago). I wondering if this is posturing for a better deal from the NCC/city or the numbers don't add up.
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  #1750  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 2:48 PM
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I wonder how many people actually care whether they stay or go?
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  #1751  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 2:53 PM
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Realistically, where is he going to take this team?

Quebec? That market is smaller and carries the same long term risk.

Seattle? Possibly but I think they’ll either get an expansion franchise or one of the floundering southern teams.

The only market where this team would thrive is as a second team in Toronto sadly.

His comments turn me right off the team. He doesn’t mean to be insulting but that’s how fans are taking it and his off the cuff blunt talk is hurting the teams position in the community and perception of the product regardless of his intended meaning.

What he is really saying between the lines is that owning an nhl team is far too valuable for him to consider selling; lebreton is having a hiccup moment and he doesn’t have the cash flow to run this team eternally. It’s how he says it that really gets under people’s skin. He seems to have a habit of lumping a variety of variables into a single thing called Ottawa and for him right now it’s all Ottawa’s fault. Yet somehow 35000 people are going to sit in -20 weather to watch nhl. Hmmm.
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  #1752  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 2:57 PM
eltodesukane eltodesukane is offline
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Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
Why not a station right at the arena?
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  #1753  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 3:32 PM
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Originally Posted by eltodesukane View Post
Why not a station right at the arena?
It's actually better and safer to have it equidistant between two stations which helps disperse the crowd over a space instead of overwhelming one bottleneck. If you look at the distance between Montreal's Olympic stadium and Pie IX / Viau stations, it is about the same distance from the proposed LeBreton arena to Bayview and Pimisi
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  #1754  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 3:44 PM
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Senators' Melnyk not optimistic about LeBreton Flats deal

Bruce Garrioch, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: December 15, 2017 | Last Updated: December 15, 2017 9:32 PM EST


Eugene Melnyk isn’t optimistic about getting a deal done to build a new downtown arena at LeBreton Flats.

Instead, he’s being cautious.

The Ottawa Senators owner indicated on Friday night he’s not completely convinced a deal between the National Capital Commission and RendezVous LeBreton group is going to get completed with negotiations continuing between the two parties to get something in place so a deal can be announced in January.

“I’m all-in, but it wouldn’t be a disaster for us at all if it didn’t happen,” said Melnyk. “We need something to happen at one point. Something’s got to break for us somewhere. I mean in a positive break. We’re just sitting it out, working it through with the NCC. They’ve been cooperative, they’ve been reasonable.

“We’re just going to try and get that completed. I don’t trust anything happening our way necessarily.”

The indications are the Senators have looked at the other options of other places in the city if the LeBreton deal doesn’t come together and Melnyk indicated he’d put up a “yellow” caution light when asked about negotiations.

“I’m not sure downtown is necessarily (the only option) … the league and others seem to think that,” Melnyk said. “A lot of people question whether we need to be downtown. Because until the law changes, where you can’t give tickets to civil servants, that is a disaster for us. Everybody quietly took that.

“Now we see the effects of that. What are you doing? We’re moving from the suburbs, where it’s built its own little base. Don’t forget: Are all those Kanata people going to come downtown? You’re just moving the arena closer to people who can’t get tickets.”

But Melnyk agrees the Senators will need a new rink sooner rather than later because they moved into the Canadian Tire Centre in 1996.

“In time, we need a new arena. It’s as simple as that. It’s 25 years old, almost. That building was built for 35 (years). Today when you build a building, it’s good for 50,” Melnyk said. “But that technology 25 years ago is what’s keeping us alive. If you put some money, like $25-to-$50 million into Kanata, it is more than fine.

“We have a nice rink. It’s not perfect. But at the time it was built, it was perfect. We have options for us, that’s the main thing. A lot of options.”

[email protected]

http://ottawacitizen.com/sports/hock...0-2964e6915847
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  #1755  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 4:06 PM
acottawa acottawa is offline
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Realistically, where is he going to take this team?

Quebec? That market is smaller and carries the same long term risk.

Seattle? Possibly but I think they’ll either get an expansion franchise or one of the floundering southern teams.

The only market where this team would thrive is as a second team in Toronto sadly.
Realistically I couldn't see the league beyond 32, so that leaves one expansion for any interested parties plus potential relocations of Carolina, Ottawa and Calgary.

The advantage Quebec has is an interested broadcaster which could use the team as content for their sports channel. There are no such potential suitors for Ottawa.

I think the problem is a generic NHL franchise is worth significantly more than an NHL franchise in Ottawa. Combined with an owner with no ties to the Ottawa area and the structural problems Ottawa has regardless of where it is located (lack of a hinterland, no large private sector HQs, Phoenix, government phobia about spending money on professional sports) then it is hard for an owner in his twilight years to contemplate a huge gamble on the flats.

At some point I think the city has to decide whether to offer the kind of sweetheart deal the redblacks got or let the team walk.
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  #1756  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 5:05 PM
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https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/senators...025835239.html

Senators owner Eugene Melnyk dangles relocation on eve of outdoor game

Justin CuthbertPuck DaddyDec 15, 2017, 9:58 PM

<snip>

Owner Eugene Melnyk dangled the idea of moving the team, telling local and national reporters in town for the event that he didn’t get rich just to prop up a floundering franchise.

Via Sportsnet’s Luke Fox:

I’m not going to blow a lifetime of working hard to support a hockey team. It’s not gonna happen. The bigger question is whether I’m prepared to blow all that money I made over many years in a different industry in a different country. How long can you underwrite a team?

Ill-timed and yet totally deliberate, Melnyk blamed the fans with his veiled threat.
I wonder how this person feels hearing Melnyk talk this way:

Quote:
(from the Ottawa Citizen) “Before the surgery, I was informed that my donor had told the surgeon to send me one (remarkably Canadian) message: ‘I’d like to remain anonymous, but please tell Eugene I want him to bring a Stanley Cup to Ottawa.’,” Melnyk said. “To whoever saved my life, I just want you know that your kindness has touched me in a way that I feel I can never repay.
A fan relocated their liver for you, Eugene. Want us to throw in some fava beans and a nice Chianti with that?
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  #1757  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 6:31 PM
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#melnykout now number one trending on twitter in Ottawa what a sad state of affairs and a PR disaster.
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  #1758  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 7:04 PM
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Originally Posted by kwoldtimer View Post
I wonder how many people actually care whether they stay or go?
Um, hundreds of thousands?

For some reason, (Phoenix, packed Canada 150 schedule, dislike for the owner etc.) people aren't buying as many tickets as in previous years. But make no mistake, Ottawa is a huge hockey city, and the Sens are especially big with the younger fans who grew up with them. Just look at the throngs that turned up last night for the alumni game on the Hill.

If the Sens were to move, it would be a very sad day.
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  #1759  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 7:10 PM
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Originally Posted by acottawa View Post
I think the problem is a generic NHL franchise is worth significantly more than an NHL franchise in Ottawa. Combined with an owner with no ties to the Ottawa area and the structural problems Ottawa has regardless of where it is located (lack of a hinterland, no large private sector HQs, Phoenix, government phobia about spending money on professional sports) then it is hard for an owner in his twilight years to contemplate a huge gamble on the flats.
At least according to Forbes, the Sens value is right in the middle of the pack, and that is without a new arena that has a big impact on franchise value. Regardless of ownership, the Sens would be less valuable in Quebec.

I watched the video of his comments. While he does say some alarming things (like being downtown isn't critical), the overall tone of his comments wasn't really consistent with what is being reported. He did make the comments about attendance and not being able to spend high without matching revenue, he also said that the team was okay at the moment and that people should not be alarmed. If find that the reports cherry pick his comments to a certain extent.
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  #1760  
Old Posted Dec 16, 2017, 10:38 PM
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Originally Posted by phil235 View Post
At least according to Forbes, the Sens value is right in the middle of the pack, and that is without a new arena that has a big impact on franchise value. Regardless of ownership, the Sens would be less valuable in Quebec.

I watched the video of his comments. While he does say some alarming things (like being downtown isn't critical), the overall tone of his comments wasn't really consistent with what is being reported. He did make the comments about attendance and not being able to spend high without matching revenue, he also said that the team was okay at the moment and that people should not be alarmed. If find that the reports cherry pick his comments to a certain extent.
I agree, he was actually quite rational while the papers were doom and gllom. Though the comments about being downtown are dead wrong.

He should know however, that the Ottawa media is looking for any nugget to spin this annoying story by now. Its really on them, but at the end of the day, its Melnyk's team and he needs to know how to manage this PR stuff. As it stands, he has half the twitterverse screaming bloody murder.
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