Hard Rock Hotel and Casino [form Rideau Carleton Raceway and Casino] | Completed

[J.OT13]

This is not surprising. We're expanding a racetrack in the middle of a rural area. It could never compete with a long established, centrally located casino.

And, we're Ottawa. Ottawa is the centre of mediocrity. Look at our development projects. Look at our rapid transit line, our Convention Centre, the planned Central Library. Look at what certain companies do well in other cities but half-ass in Ottawa: Brookfield and Place de Ville compared to Brookfield Place in Calgary or the Toronto Dominion Centre, Hudson's Bay's impressive renovation of their Toronto and Vancouver flagships compared to the little work they've done with the Rideau store.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by kevinbottawa

I expected more from a big company like Hard Rock.

Like others I have also been to some of their properties elsewhere and they were quite opulent.

But that doesn't mean they go for the same opulence everywhere. If you look at their portfolio some places are a bit more bare-bones, especially when they're in locations similar to Rideau-Carleton.

Similarly, the Toys R Us in Times Square (when it was open) may have been the exact same type of store by the exact same chain as the Toys R Us on Chemin de la Savane in Gatineau, but the feel was just slightly different.

[Kitchissippi]

Meanwhile in Las Vegas, they are demolishing the Hard Rock Cafe and reopening its casino as Virgin.

I'm amazed how an empire has been built around over-hyped mediocre food, and that despite the fact many of the restaurants have closed they are continuing to flog a fading brand.

[kwoldtimer]

Originally Posted by Harley613

I spent almost an entire day exploring the 66 story Hard Rock Megalopolis in Panama City this July. Incredible place. This brand has many levels I guess.

I used to live a few blocks from there. I must admit that I never got around to going inside.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Where is the second suburban/exurban casino in Ottawa?

Lac Leamy. While Ottawa dithered on an urban casino, Quebec moved quickly forward.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

This is not surprising. We're expanding a racetrack in the middle of a rural area. It could never compete with a long established, centrally located casino.

And, we're Ottawa. Ottawa is the centre of mediocrity. Look at our development projects. Look at our rapid transit line, our Convention Centre, the planned Central Library. Look at what certain companies do well in other cities but half-ass in Ottawa: Brookfield and Place de Ville compared to Brookfield Place in Calgary or the Toronto Dominion Centre, Hudson's Bay's impressive renovation of their Toronto and Vancouver flagships compared to the little work they've done with the Rideau store.

I am not sure about that. An urban casino would have a different market, since it would be much more dependent on walk in traffic or people arriving by transit plus downtown based visitors. Rideau-Carleton is for a suburban car-based market.

[daud]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

This is not surprising. We're expanding a racetrack in the middle of a rural area. It could never compete with a long established, centrally located casino.

And, we're Ottawa. Ottawa is the centre of mediocrity. Look at our development projects. Look at our rapid transit line, our Convention Centre, the planned Central Library. Look at what certain companies do well in other cities but half-ass in Ottawa: Brookfield and Place de Ville compared to Brookfield Place in Calgary or the Toronto Dominion Centre, Hudson's Bay's impressive renovation of their Toronto and Vancouver flagships compared to the little work they've done with the Rideau store.

Sadly somewhat true.

But it could have been different-at least with Place de Ville. Way back when Place de ville was proposed, it was approved at 42 storeys by the city. The NCC put a stop to it and we ended up with the 29 storeys (and likely the wider side). Imagine if we had had a 42 storey building downtown since the early 70s. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Place_de_Ville

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Lac Leamy. While Ottawa dithered on an urban casino, Quebec moved quickly forward.

Although it's not within the traditional downtown and wasn't very accessible by transit for many years (it has been served by the RapiBus since 2013, though I don't know how good the service is outside rush hour), it is still very much central. The location is spectacular when factoring in the views Lac Leamy, the fountain, the old quarry and the skylines of Ottawa and Hull.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by daud

Sadly somewhat true.

But it could have been different-at least with Place de Ville. Way back when Place de ville was proposed, it was approved at 42 storeys by the city. The NCC put a stop to it and we ended up with the 29 storeys (and likely the wider side). Imagine if we had had a 42 storey building downtown since the early 70s. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Place_de_Ville

I don't have an issue with PdV as it was built. At the time, it was quite spectacular for Ottawa. Much taller than anything else in the city, a revolving restaurant, a 2 level theater, an underground mall. I'm referring to the lack of investment since Campeau (the original builder) lost the complex in the early 90s. The theater has been abandoned for 25 years, the revolving restaurant is no longer a restaurant, the outdoor fountain has been removed, the underground mall is severely outdated and mostly empty. Even with a direct connection to the O-Train, they've done next to nothing to improve the complex.

[OTSkyline]

Urgh... I hate all these big developments going on in the boonies while we lament of traffic, people driving too much and our downtown or central area being sleepy -__-


And yes, pretty bland design for a Hard Rock Hotel & Casino, I expected slightly better. Also, I believe the plans changed since the original proposal. I recall the addition was supposed to be built on the left side of the existing casino with, half the rooms overlooking the race track. Now, on the right side at its current locations. The overpriced rooms will be facing either the sea of parking OR the roof of the rest of the casino (with exhaust fan and piping)

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by OTSkyline

Also, I believe the plans changed since the original proposal. I recall the addition was supposed to be built on the left side of the existing casino with, half the rooms overlooking the race track. Now, on the right side at its current locations. The overpriced rooms will be facing either the sea of parking OR the roof of the rest of the casino (with exhaust fan and piping)

You are correct. The components moved around from what was proposed in May 2017, with the expansion and hotel now proposed on the south side instead of the north side.

Originally Posted by rocketphish

City needs more input before Rock-sino begins taking bets

Jon Willing, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: August 24, 2017 | Last Updated: August 24, 2017 5:45 PM EDT


Hard Rock Casino Ottawa is taking over the Rideau Carleton Raceway starting in mid-September.
This drawing illustrates Hard Rock's vision for the casino and entertainment complex.

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-...ns-taking-bets

Originally Posted by rocketphish

The Hard Rock Ottawa Raceway and Casino (formerly Rideau Carleton Raceway and Slots) is proposing the construction of an addition to the existing casino, a hotel, and redesigned surface parking areas. The addition to the casino will add approximately 7,019 m2 gross floor area to the casino floor, 106 m2 gross floor area for a retail store, 4,692 m2 gross floor area for restaurants, and 2,587 m2 gross floor area for a 1,600-seat theatre. The proposed hotel is accessed through the casino floor. The 178-room hotel has an approximate gross floor area of 9,283 m2.

Development application:
http://app01.ottawa.ca/postingplans/...appId=__BPJ8AX
Renderings:

[J.OT13]

I can't imagine that hotel will be very popular. Very few tourists would come to Ottawa specifically for the casino experience, and the few that do would go to Lac Leamy. The Hilton at Lac Leamy also has the advantage of amazing views and being close to downtown (for those who drive), though very likely more expensive. Hard Rock does not have any such advantage. Tourists and business travelers who want to stay close to the airport will likely stay close to the airport, not go to the party atmosphere of a casino hotel.

Other than a few out-of-towners who go see a show along with the performers and their surroundings, I can't see who the target audience would be for this hotel.

[YOWflier]

I'm told by some in gambling circles that there's a lot of gaming tourists in upstate New York and the northeast in general and this new facility will target them among others.

Surely they've got their business case figured out and aren't just doing this on a prayer.

[daud]

Originally Posted by ac888yow

I'm told by some in gambling circles that there's a lot of gaming tourists in upstate New York and the northeast in general and this new facility will target them among others.

Surely they've got their business case figured out and aren't just doing this on a prayer.

Pull in a decent country act to the theatre and you've filled the hotel and casino floor with upstate new yorkers and the ottawa valley.

I do know first hand that the theatre was a big piece of their initial business model and assume it still is.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by ac888yow

I'm told by some in gambling circles that there's a lot of gaming tourists in upstate New York and the northeast in general and this new facility will target them among others.

Surely they've got their business case figured out and aren't just doing this on a prayer.

Makes sense. It's closer to the U.S. than Lac Leamy. But why not go to Gananoque?

Having a business case doesn't always guarantee success.

[lrt's friend]

There is already a market for Rideau Carleton as it is. Once LRT opens, the south end will explode, and a quick shuttle will be able to run every 12 minutes from Earl Armstrong station making the Casino quite accessible for a good portion of the city and also will allow tourists to stay there and still be able to get to downtown attractions quite easily. It may seem remote today but Line 2 is a game changer. It won't be remote anymore.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Although it's not within the traditional downtown and wasn't very accessible by transit for many years (it has been served by the RapiBus since 2013, though I don't know how good the service is outside rush hour), it is still very much central. The location is spectacular when factoring in the views Lac Leamy, the fountain, the old quarry and the skylines of Ottawa and Hull.

Yeah, it's definitely not a suburban location, even if it's not in downtown Ottawa or even downtown Hull.

It had direct STO service from downtown Ottawa via route 20 or 21(?) in the years before the Rapibus, and has Rapibus service now that's on 10-minute frequencies during weekdays, and 12-15 minute frequencies on evenings and weekends until midnight or 1 am.

Taking the Rapibus from downtown Ottawa to there is similar to taking the 95 on the old Transitway to St Laurent. (Though not as sardine-can crowded.)

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Kitchissippi

Meanwhile in Las Vegas, they are demolishing the Hard Rock Cafe and reopening its casino as Virgin.

I'm amazed how an empire has been built around over-hyped mediocre food, and that despite the fact many of the restaurants have closed they are continuing to flog a fading brand.

This was true of the Hard Rock Café restaurant chain, but I definitely did not have Hard Rock Café-style food in the Hard Rock properties I've been in.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Makes sense. It's closer to the U.S. than Lac Leamy. .

I suppose though if you're gonna drive from Watertown or Syracuse to this area, 20 minutes more isn't going to prevent you from going all the way to Hull.

By far the number one place where I see NY plates in Gatineau is at the casino. Especially on weekends there are always a bunch.

Originally Posted by J.OT13

But why not go to Gananoque?
.

I suppose that short border-hoppers might go there, but if Rideau-Carleton offers more stuff (as in shows - which Gananoque does not) you could draw American weekenders.

Gananoque and Rideau-Carleton are completely different operators I gather.

[YOWflier]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Makes sense. It's closer to the U.S. than Lac Leamy. But why not go to Gananoque?

Having a business case doesn't always guarantee success.

Touring around means going to different places. The existence of one doesn't preclude visiting the other.

Plus here you have all the amenities of an actual city to supplement one's gaming. Also plus is that Hard Rock is a brand with a following and a proper loyalty program that will help to draw.