The Official Saint John, NB Project Thread

[bingun]

I hope the city preemptively anticipated First Nations getting dragged into this, hence the slide below, which was included in their presentation, pointing out that it is a provincial responsibility. Hopefully, it will be a non-issue as it relates to rezoning.

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by KnoxfordGuy

Happy 240th birthday to Canada's oldest incorporated city, Saint John! Founded on May 18th, 1785.

[bingun]

Minister accused of being in conflict of interest on development

https://tj.news/new-brunswick/minister-accused-of-being-in-conflict-of-interest-on-development

Coon said in an interview with Brunswick News that Environment Minister Gilles LePage should recuse himself from the file because he is representing opposite interests.

Not only is LePage responsible for protecting a wetland that would be drained and largely destroyed by the City of Saint John’s development, he is also the minister responsible for the Regional Development Corporation.

“I walked out of there, thinking, this is crazy,” Coon said. “I had before me the proponents, and the proponent’s minister, and the regulators, who are supposed to safeguard the environment, and their minister. It was the same person in the room!”

[darkharbour]

Originally Posted by bingun

Minister accused of being in conflict of interest on development

https://tj.news/new-brunswick/minister-accused-of-being-in-conflict-of-interest-on-development

wetland that would be drained and largely destroyed by the City of Saint John’s development

This isn't a very accurate portrayal, the city isn't "draining" a wetland. Not to mention that you can't exactly do that, a wetland is basically where the water table meets the surface elevation of the land which then provides the conditions for unique and important ecosystems.

Glad someone is pointing out potential conflicts though, in a world where those seem to be overlooked in politics more and more, I appreciate those that ask questions even if they turn out to be accepted.

[adamuptownsj]

Holding two cabinet positions being a conflict of interest is a... novel legal theory.

[Ottawa]

Originally Posted by darkharbour

This isn't a very accurate portrayal, the city isn't "draining" a wetland. Not to mention that you can't exactly do that, a wetland is basically where the water table meets the surface elevation of the land which then provides the conditions for unique and important ecosystems.

Glad someone is pointing out potential conflicts though, in a world where those seem to be overlooked in politics more and more, I appreciate those that ask questions even if they turn out to be accepted.

Would I be considered impolite if I simply wanted to know what the specifics of "unique and important ecosystems" refers to?

I feel quite confident in stating there is virtually no place on this planet that does not have "unique and important ecosystems". So using that terminology is just generalized vagueness. It does however leave the average person to assume that there is something that needs to coddled and protected at the expense of everybody who will not be able to benefit from the greater potential that exists.

The news organization will have benefitted by promoting what it has no connection to. It gets quoted/promoted here and I assume many other places.

Spruce Lake is not just the ideal location for this kind of development. It is the only place in the region where this could excel. These developments need the water from Spruce Lake. They need the electrical power from Coleson Cove and/or Lepreau, along with the green creds from the windmills. They need the deep water to bring in the most efficient ships, which are also the largest ships plying the trade routes today and in the future.

If this is not allowed, and promoted, others will follow my personal path and leave the area. It would be truly a shame and a forfeiture of what is the prospect of a better future.

[Ottawa]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

Holding two cabinet positions being a conflict of interest is a... novel legal theory.

Is it possible this person knows how to balance priorities instead of just a peddle to the metal attitude disregarding the realities/consequences for the bigger population?

I don't think there are many that could pull that off without encountering questions of ethical standards from all sides. I would not think it would be a recipe for political success.

It's likely not the first time something like this has been attempted, but I think it is likely going to end in failure because of the reality of politics.

[bingun]

That didn't take long...

N.B. minister recuses himself from assessment of Saint John industrial park expansion

https://www.ctvnews.ca/atlantic/new-brun...of-saint-john-industrial-park-expansion/

[bingun]

It seems the Green zones have finally arrived! From what is being described, this is a partnership with 12 Neighbours in Fredericton and won't be a tent village.

[DyAm00394]

An interesting Committee of The Whole item this evening. Purchase and Sale agreement with NB Housing Corporation for 21 Troop Street, (PID 55055230 and PID 00424283).

[bingun]

Originally Posted by bingun

It seems the Green zones have finally arrived! From what is being described, this is a partnership with 12 Neighbours in Fredericton and won't be a tent village.

The city updated its Shape Your City page for 'Housing For All' following tonight's announcement on green zones.

https://shapeyourcitysaintjohn.ca/housing-for-all

There is a handy 'Green Zone FAQ'.

https://shapeyourcitysaintjohn.ca/housing-for-all/widgets/194687/faqs#41758

[adamuptownsj]

No word on the 'yellow zones,' which are presumably going to (continue to) be every non-park piece of public land in the city. There's no mechanism to make someone move to a 'green zone' if they'd rather camp on an off-ramp.

And, wasn't this announcement supposed to have been in November 2024? Now, we've got 'construction starting this summer'?

[bridgeoftea]

Originally Posted by bingun

The city updated its Shape Your City page for 'Housing For All' following tonight's announcement on green zones.

https://shapeyourcitysaintjohn.ca/housing-for-all

There is a handy 'Green Zone FAQ'.

https://shapeyourcitysaintjohn.ca/housing-for-all/widgets/194687/faqs#41758

The numbers they shared is more interesting to me.
When I moved to Saint John in 2019 there was maybe 5 visible homeless people? Never saw tents, shelters etc.
But every year it has definitely got worse and the numbers clearly suggest that. 633 at the moment and it's doubled from last year. Other interesting facts is that a lot of those homeless people have had run ins with the police multiple times. It feels like the numbers are trying to paint a hard luck story but to me, if these were cases of hard luck stories, there shouldn't be that many run ins with the police?

Those green zones are nice that they are away from most residential neighborhoods. Seems like the old Bumper to Bumper / Benjamin Moore building is some type of shelter thing these days? Saw a girl visibly inebriated outside this morning at 7:30am. Notably 2 police cars drove past and didn't pull over or stop. I also saw two people have an extremely loud argument over a pile of stuff near what I call the Marco Polo bridge close to that building the other day.

It is a shame that they'll be close to that graveyard which has some wonderful stories and gravestones. My favourite stone there is the one talking about the assassination on Market Slip.

My other thoughts on this, which is clearly not PC, as they'd say these days. I'm surprised they haven't tried tempting/bribing the homeless to move out of Saint John. Living out in BC there was tons of stories of smaller cities putting their homeless on busses and sending them to Vancouver / Victoria with a tent and some money.

Feels like the homeless problem is an endless cycle that might never be broken and the worst part is, it's not just a Saint John or Canada problem. It's a world wide problem. It's tough to see and it must be way tougher to live like that. Forever grateful I had a positive upbringing that kept me away from some bad decisions that might take me down that path. In 10 years since my graduation there's been 5 people I went to school with that have passed away from choosing the drug/homeless lifestyle.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by bridgeoftea

The numbers they shared is more interesting to me.
When I moved to Saint John in 2019 there was maybe 5 visible homeless people? Never saw tents, shelters etc.
But every year it has definitely got worse and the numbers clearly suggest that. 633 at the moment and it's doubled from last year. Other interesting facts is that a lot of those homeless people have had run ins with the police multiple times. It feels like the numbers are trying to paint a hard luck story but to me, if these were cases of hard luck stories, there shouldn't be that many run ins with the police?

Homeless people tend to turn to drugs to cope which leads to other issues. Doesn't mean they didn't start out as hard luck stories.

[bingun]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

No word on the 'yellow zones,' which are presumably going to (continue to) be every non-park piece of public land in the city. There's no mechanism to make someone move to a 'green zone' if they'd rather camp on an off-ramp.

And, wasn't this announcement supposed to have been in November 2024? Now, we've got 'construction starting this summer'?

I was only half listening, but I don't think they mentioned 'yellow zones', however, they did mention the 'red zones' and that they still plan to implement them later this year. I imagine this will be the high-visibility areas (Kings Square, Queens Square, Burial Ground, etc.). I have heard some say that Tin Can Beach is currently bad, but I haven't been down there in a while.

As for the location, I think this is probably the best the city could do, especially as it comes to avoiding residential neighbourhoods. However, for the local businesses in close proximity, I would be less than pleased.

[bingun]

Originally Posted by DyAm00394

An interesting Committee of The Whole item this evening. Purchase and Sale agreement with NB Housing Corporation for 21 Troop Street, (PID 55055230 and PID 00424283).

https://pub-saintjohn.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=22174

At its meeting held January 22, 2024, Council resolved to deem the property at 21 Troop Street, comprised of PIDs 424283 and 55055230, as surplus to its needs. Following this decision of Council a Request for Expressions of Interest was issued by staff to seek interest for affordable housing on the said lands.

The New Brunswick Housing Corporation (NBHC) expressed interest in the lands for the development of a 20-unit building. A good number of these units are expected to be 3 and 4-bedroom units, which would improve the housing options for currently underserved populations seeking larger units. Staff negotiated an Agreement of Purchase and Sale with NBHC. The purpose of this report is to get authority for the City to enter into an Agreement of Purchase and Sale with NBHC for this purpose.

[bingun]

As for last night's rezoning public meeting, no progress was made other than additional speakers against, who are increasingly not from Lorneville. Some coverage below.

https://tj.news/saint-john-south/industrial-park-rezoning-decision-pushed-back-again

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-bruns...ncil-lorneville-public-hearing-1.7539633

Marathon runner Brenda Guitard told council although she lives on the east side, while training she runs from Lorneville all the way across the city to her home, and said Lorneville offers a clean, safe area, free of traffic, in which she can focus on her workout without her “head on swivel.”

Lorneville resident Cecil McCavour called for the buffer zone to be increased, and said he had questions about property values.
“What about the investments of our properties, will our properties go down?” he asked. “We have Airbnbs operating successfully, and we have the only lobster pound in the area, what will happen to all those endeavours … what will happen to the community if this all goes south?”

"I know residents who have spent the majority of their maternity leaves fighting this, a time that should have been sacred, filled with quiet mornings and baby snuggles and those first smiles," she said.

[CharlotteCountyLogan]

A concern being property values is classic NIMBYism. If the current industry park/Coleson Cove/The wind turbines haven't decreased their property values then the chances this does is minimum. I can maybe understand some arguments against the industrial park but these people are just being NIMBYs.

[bingun]

During tonight's PAC meeting, the applicant for 228 Germain presented his plans for the building. This presentation included floor plans and renders showing the building being fully converted to residential units, except for one small office space.

The floor plans are quite unique, including a unit that will have the existing skylight as part of its space.

https://www.youtube.com/live/ceAo4_lXQGs?si=P9PusBXsOXOUGKnN&t=660









For the 421 Woodward proposal, there was some local opposition, including one community member who produced a detailed slide deck with several points, one focus of which was an explanation that jackhammering on site or adjacent projects could cause local seniors to experience an increased risk of heart attacks.

[sailor734]

So, did PAC recommend approval of both applications?

Those floor plans for Germain are unique....... although I'm not sure I'd want to live in a pie shaped trailer with no windows in the living areas.
I think this shows some of the challenges in converting buildings that were not originally designed as residential.