Winnipeg | Downtown | True North Square | U/C - Page 75

bomberjet · #**1481** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 5:56 PM**

Yeah they would be. I noticed they had rebar cages laying around which are now gone. Assume those went into the tube. I'm not an expert, but they would be the same used for the actual foundation. They would be testing the design capacity or something like that.

They may have sent cameras down the hole to check the bottom out. Not an expert on that either. Or maybe they sent a guy down there but you missed it. On the construction cam, I've seen many a people standing around the tube looking down.

cllew · #**1482** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 6:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Yeah they would be. I noticed they had rebar cages laying around which are now gone. Assume those went into the tube. I'm not an expert, but they would be the same used for the actual foundation. They would be testing the design capacity or something like that.

They may have sent cameras down the hole to check the bottom out. Not an expert on that either. Or maybe they sent a guy down there but you missed it. On the construction cam, I've seen many a people standing around the tube looking down.

On afternoons this week so there is a good chance I am not seeing all the action such as it is.

I guess cameras are small and rugged enough now that they don't have to send somebody down the hole anymore to check on the bedrock face visually.

esquire · #**1483** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 6:27 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cllew

I haven't seen anybody being lowered down one of them in a body harness to check out the bottom. that was a common sight when the MTS center was being built. Its sure not a job for somebody that's claustrophobic.

They really did that? Yikes, I couldn't think of a worse job.

Biff · #**1484** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 6:37 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

They really did that? Yikes, I couldn't think of a worse job.

....each to his own.

drew · #**1485** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 6:45 PM**

^ check mate.

cllew · #**1486** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 6:59 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire

They really did that? Yikes, I couldn't think of a worse job.

Rain slicker, chest wader and hard hat with a miners light on it. Put a body harness on over that, and be lowered down by a cable from an electric winch on a tripod.

the ones one I saw from the office being done were in the area of Graham and Donald. No idea how many times it was done but I saw around 3 when the MTS foundation was being built by Subterranean (same foundation company doing the TNS work).

I also vaguely recall reading about the same thing being done when the Richardson building was being constructed.

drew · #**1487** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 7:13 PM**

^ and CMHR

bomberjet · #**1488** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 7:37 PM**

AT CMHR they put some wreath or ceremonial items at the bottom of at least one caisson. As an homage to the people who once lived on the site.

drew · #**1489** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 7:44 PM**

^ the way I understood it was they sent someone down to the base of each caisson for ceremonial purposes.

bomberjet · #**1490** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 9:05 PM**

Oh okay.

Maybe, Drew, you can help me (us) understand the test caisson thing. What are they "testing" exactly.

That they assumptions about bedrock depth are accurate? Do they actually load up the caisson to design loading? And are the test caissons used in the final structure or just kind of there and are wasted?

drew · #**1491** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 9:12 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Oh okay.

Maybe, Drew, you can help me (us) understand the test caisson thing. What are they "testing" exactly.

That they assumptions about bedrock depth are accurate? Do they actually load up the caisson to design loading? And are the test caissons used in the final structure or just kind of there and are wasted?

I have personally never worked on a project of that scale - but from my experience, geotechnical Engineers like to specify on their reports that they are to visually confirm bearing surfaces prior to pouring foundation elements. Usually this is just a formality, but for large, tall buildings, you want to be absolutely sure you are getting what you your random test holes showed originally. So yes, they are confirming bearing surfaces, water seepage, etc. etc.

Also, to get higher resistance numbers, they can specify that the base of the caissons is "hand cleaned" not "mechanically cleaned" which means exactly what it sounds like.

pegcityfan · #**1492** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 10:04 PM**

Chipman just said on 1290 he sold Carlton Hotel property to Northlands. Also said that True North will have nothing to do with that property & hotel.

Wonder if the city have any recourse if a hotel doesn't get built. I like to believe it will happen but like so many sure things in this city and especially the shit show known as the Convention Centre expansion....

lilwayne · #**1493** Posted **Apr 14, 2016, 11:20 PM**

clearly they partnered together on the project

comeon man use your common sense..

the main component of the project is connecting all 4 buildings to wcc via sky walk.. and they wouldnt put the hotel as part of the phases of the true north project if they had nothing to do with it..

what a joke

next
by nothing to do with it they meant they wont manage or run it but they fricking put money into helping bring it here.. and develop is as part of the true north square project.. so don't worry its getting built true north just wont have any stakes in the hotel.. northlands will

Bluenote · #**1494** Posted **Apr 15, 2016, 2:33 AM**

I wasn't set in believing a hotel was getting built anyway. So IF one ever gets built it will just be a bonus at this point.

As for those caissons , how deep are they down before they hit bedrock in the downtown?

optimusREIM · #**1495** Posted **Apr 15, 2016, 2:54 AM**

Why would northland properties buy the Carlton site if they had no interest in developing it. I don't think we can rule out the hotel component just yet but it may not look like what we've seen in renderings.
Considering that these guys own the hotel chain and the sites strategic location Id be inclined to believe that this will happen eventually. Who knows with the boom we're experiencing.

cllew · #**1496** Posted **Apr 15, 2016, 4:15 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluenote

I wasn't set in believing a hotel was getting built anyway. So IF one ever gets built it will just be a bonus at this point.

As for those caissons , how deep are they down before they hit bedrock in the downtown?

I have heard the average depth for bedrock in downtown Winnipeg is 17 meters.

Apparently for the CMHR a Free Press report on how it was built said they had to go 38 meters to get solid rock.

Bluenote · #**1497** Posted **Apr 15, 2016, 1:09 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by cllew

I have heard the average depth for bedrock in downtown Winnipeg is 17 meters.

Apparently for the CMHR a Free Press report on how it was built said they had to go 38 meters to get solid rock.

Oh right. I remember that the first layer was to course and wouldn't hold the weight so they went down to where it wasn't fractured

bomberjet · #**1498** Posted **Apr 15, 2016, 2:10 PM**

That sounds about right. 17m might be down to limestone, with the 38m depth being down to granite? I mentioned earlier I had heard there was a cobble layer down there. But maybe they were referring to the fractured layer.

bomberjet · #**1499** Posted **Apr 15, 2016, 2:13 PM**

https://www.gov.mb.ca/conservation/waterstewardship/reports/groundwater/resources2/geohydrology.pdf

There's a report from 1969 on groundwater, but talks a lot about geology in Winnipeg. No time to read int thoroughly, but they have some diagrams and talk about rock types and various layers.

drew · #**1500** Posted **Apr 15, 2016, 2:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bomberjet

https://www.gov.mb.ca/conservation/waterstewardship/reports/groundwater/resources2/geohydrology.pdf

There's a report from 1969 on groundwater, but talks a lot about geology in Winnipeg. No time to read int thoroughly, but they have some diagrams and talk about rock types and various layers.

Page 252 has a diagram indicating the ranges of depths to bedrock in Winnipeg.

Before you posted that, I was going to say that bedrock is generally 40 to 60 feet below grade in Winnipeg - and some areas in the extreme west of Winnipeg including Headingley, the bedrock can be as close as 20-feet below grade. We have designed a couple houses in Headingley that are supported on bedrock...always get your geotechnical investigation!

The diagram you provided seems to back me up.