NEW YORK | One Vanderbilt | 1,401 FT | 58 FLOORS - Page 75

NYguy · #**1481** Posted **Aug 19, 2016, 1:52 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by TechTalkGuy

Psst: NYguy, the height is exactly the same in both renders.

I'm not so sure. I wanna see a scaled comparison.

Zapatan · #**1482** Posted **Aug 19, 2016, 5:02 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by TechTalkGuy

Psst: NYguy, the height is exactly the same in both renders.

Compared to Met Life's roof it seems at least 100 feet shorter in that new rendering.

1,300 to roof and 1,400 to spire is still fine though, just get this thing built already...

Update:

According to this new article it's 1,400 feet, probably including the spire but who knows if they didn't just get the figure wrong. Judging by the renders NYguy posted it would make sense though...

http://ny.curbed.com/2016/8/17/12516...truction-photo

...

NYguy · #**1483** Posted **Aug 19, 2016, 5:48 PM**

Lately, all of the articles have put it at 1401 ft, which is closer to the original plan, and fine for the height, but it would give us a stumpier crown - exactly what this tower doesn't need.

Zapatan · #**1484** Posted **Aug 19, 2016, 5:58 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYguy

Lately, all of the articles have put it at 1401 ft, which is closer to the original plan, and fine for the height, but it would give us a stumpier crown - exactly what this tower doesn't need.

Yea, it looks really squat in that picture you posted. While the height cut sucks, it would still be nice to have the same figure/aesthetics. Since it will still be well above the neighboring buildings I'm more worried about the design.

Hudson11 · #**1485** Posted **Aug 19, 2016, 10:13 PM**

there's always been a ~100' spire. 1401' is without the spire, 1501' is the full height.

http://www.kpf.com/projects/one-vanderbilt

chris08876 · #**1486** Posted **Aug 20, 2016, 2:45 AM**

Quote:

Demolition has wrapped up at the site of One Vanderbilt, a future supertall tower to be constructed on a site adjacent to New York's Grand Central Terminal. Designed by KPF, the mixed use tower will rise 1,501 feet into the Midtown skyline. Excavation is now underway with the completion of demolition of the previous occupants of the full block site. TD Bank has already signed on as an office tenant. Construction is slated to complete in 2020.

===================
FC

Hudson11 · #**1487** Posted **Aug 20, 2016, 12:30 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYguy

I'm just hoping the "new" rendering isn't a stumpier version of the old...

the distance to the tower and the viewing angle don't appear to be the same. [note: W.R Grace Building] While design changed are possible, a more scaled comparison is definitely needed.

NYguy · #**1488** Posted **Aug 21, 2016, 7:32 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hudson11

there's always been a ~100' spire. 1401' is without the spire, 1501' is the full height.

http://www.kpf.com/projects/one-vanderbilt

We know that, doesn't mean there hasn't been yet another height revision. It's still listed at 1,501 on the KPF website at least.

http://www.kpf.com/projects/one-vanderbilt

It's going to tower over the Chrysler either way...

NYguy · #**1489** Posted **Aug 22, 2016, 10:26 PM**

https://www.6sqft.com/new-renderings...idtown-east-4/

NYguy · #**1490** Posted **Aug 23, 2016, 12:45 AM**

Just a quick note, the final Midtown East rezoning kicks off next month. Here's a look at the sites under consideration for development. None will be as large as the sites previously rezoned next to Grand Central, but will provide the opportunity for new development and conversions.

With change...

Hudson11 · #**1491** Posted **Aug 23, 2016, 2:22 AM**

looks like it's indeed a height cut. There's a very bright silver lining: a new observation deck in the heart of midtown in 2020. Just imagine the view - looking down on 30 Rock, Billionaire's row, Long Island City and the Empire State Building. Plus, this is still a solid supertall in NYC's 400m+ club.

https://www.hines.com/properties/one...rbilt-new-york

Quote:

Hines is partnering with SL Green Realty Corp. to serve as development manager One Vanderbilt, a 58-story, 1.5 million-square-foot commercial office tower in Midtown Manhattan between Madison and Vanderbilt Avenues and 42nd and 43rd Streets.

Designed by Kohn Pedersen Fox Associates (KPF), the project features a crown that will be visible from across the five boroughs and beyond with a spire that will extend the official height to 1,401 feet above street level. The development will include 1,408,000 square feet of new Class A office space and 32,000 square feet of new retail space. The building will be topped with a 60,000-square-foot observation deck that will occupy floors 57 and 58.

Excavation and foundations work is expected to take place from March 2016 through 2017. Vertical building construction will start in May 2017; the building is scheduled to be complete in August 2020.

gramsjdg · #**1492** Posted **Aug 23, 2016, 3:31 AM**

Wow. They managed to both shrink it by 100 feet and ruin the proportions.

In the name of God WHY?!

Height decreases are becoming the new normal for NYC supertalls, apparently. Tower Verre (down from 1155/1250', CPT (spire removal), 2 WTC (down from 1358'), HY 30 (down from 1335').

...Of course the general supertall "downgrade" theme follows the pattern established by WTC-1's unfinished spire and One57's apparently abandoned crown lighting.

Well, that's my rant and I'm not apologizing for it. What a disappointment.

CHAPINM1 · #**1493** Posted **Aug 23, 2016, 5:13 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by gramsjdg

Wow. They managed to both shrink it by 100 feet and ruin the proportions.

In the name of God WHY?!

Height decreases are becoming the new normal for NYC supertalls, apparently. Tower Verre (down from 1155/1250', CPT (spire removal), 2 WTC (down from 1358'), HY 30 (down from 1335').

...Of course the general supertall "downgrade" theme follows the pattern established by WTC-1's unfinished spire and One57's apparently abandoned crown lighting.

Well, that's my rant and I'm not apologizing for it. What a disappointment.

^^^ Well said... I'll even take it a step further.

Not to sound like a naysayer but at this point I do find an observation deck on this project to be pointless, if not a hindrance to the city acquiring something truly special later down the road in terms of a new observatory. NYC will be over-saturated new observatories bringing nothing new to the table (Hudson Yards) lingering around 1,100 foot mark not pushing any height boundaries of any kind. Also, at roughly the 57/58th floors it would be at the same height of the Empire State Building's deck thereabout.

One could see the logic of a new observatory in the works if it were to have a unique feature or be at a higher elevation than One World Observatory, the current city's highest. Don't get me wrong, it is remarkable to see all the new additions, but just seems there is so much missed opportunity (Nordstrom Tower). Then again, there can never be enough high public space.

Submariner · #**1494** Posted **Aug 23, 2016, 12:14 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by gramsjdg

Wow. They managed to both shrink it by 100 feet and ruin the proportions.

In the name of God WHY?!

Height decreases are becoming the new normal for NYC supertalls, apparently. Tower Verre (down from 1155/1250', CPT (spire removal), 2 WTC (down from 1358'), HY 30 (down from 1335').

...Of course the general supertall "downgrade" theme follows the pattern established by WTC-1's unfinished spire and One57's apparently abandoned crown lighting.

Well, that's my rant and I'm not apologizing for it. What a disappointment.

Economics. They're already building a tower with a roof height of 1300 feet with less square footage than many banal, squat post war office buildings...there is only so much financial latitude that they have to work with. Constructing a 1,600,000 square foot tower at ten stories tall is considerably less expensive than stretching that same footage vertically. Notice how the total square footage has been decreased by 100k feet? The developers likely concluded that it would be difficult to fill the tower with enough tenants to generate acceptable ROI with the old plans.

It's too bad that they're cutting the height. Still, You can't be too disappointed with a solid 1300 footer in the heart of midtown.

NYguy · #**1495** Posted **Aug 23, 2016, 1:46 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by gramsjdg

Height decreases are becoming the new normal for NYC supertalls, apparently. Tower Verre (down from 1155/1250', CPT (spire removal), 2 WTC (down from 1358'), HY 30 (down from 1335').

That's actually not true. While the Tower Verre's height cut is well documented, that was not the fault of the developers who wanted to build to the original planned height. It was a mandated height cut. 2 WTC was intended to be 1,270 ft (with additional height from the crown). 30 Hudson is still taller than it was originally planned, as is 111 W. 57th, the Central Park Tower, and even One Vanderbilt, which gradually increased in height. The height cut here (if there is indeed a cut) has more to do with space allocation, the same as 30 Hudson, which saw more space shifted to the lower floors.

My problem here would be not so much with the loss of 100 ft, but the impact on the crown.

We would be basically back to this...

I prefer the more slender profile a height boost would give...

http://www.kpf.com/projects/one-vanderbilt

NYguy · #**1496** Posted **Aug 23, 2016, 2:19 PM**

I still wonder who has the accurate height info, KPF (the architects) or Hines, which isn't the lead developer here. They have been shifting the numbers in the media for a while though...

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/29/ny...ghts.html?_r=1

Quote:

SEPT. 28, 2015

Mr. Penson filed a $1.1 billion lawsuit in United States District Court in Manhattan that argued that the administration of Mayor Bill de Blasio, a Democrat, the City Council and the developer, SL Green Realty Corporation, had deprived him of his property rights when the city gave SL Green permission to build a 1,501-foot tall office tower, without having to buy any air rights from him.

http://therealdeal.com/2015/09/04/sl...derbilt-plans/

Quote:

September 04, 2015

The developer filed plans today for its deluxe Midtown East office tower, nearly two years after it first revealed details of its proposal.

As anticipated, the Kohn Pedersen Fox-designed 1.3 million-square-foot One Vanderbilt is slated to stand 67 stories and top out at 1,404 feet, according to the filings.

The first floor of the tower will include retail space and a bank. The second, third and 61st through 64th floors will have retail as well.

DOB filing, which doesn't include spires...

http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/Jo...ssdocnumber=01

Quote:

Building Height (ft.): 1,404
Building Stories: 67

Of course, everything changes, including DOB filings.

http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/Jo...ssdocnumber=01

Quote:

Building Height (ft.): 1401
Building Stories: 67

A good breakdown of the floors shown here...
http://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/JB...allbin=1035350

Zapatan · #**1497** Posted **Aug 23, 2016, 3:43 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by gramsjdg

Wow. They managed to both shrink it by 100 feet and ruin the proportions.

In the name of God WHY?!

Height decreases are becoming the new normal for NYC supertalls, apparently. Tower Verre (down from 1155/1250', CPT (spire removal), 2 WTC (down from 1358'), HY 30 (down from 1335').

...Of course the general supertall "downgrade" theme follows the pattern established by WTC-1's unfinished spire and One57's apparently abandoned crown lighting.

Well, that's my rant and I'm not apologizing for it. What a disappointment.

100% agree, it's annoying but on the bright side we're still spoiled.

I think different proportions would bother me more than a 100 foot height cut, since a 1300/1400 foot building right next to grand central is still amazing for the area.

I just hope future NY supertalls stop being sucked in to this trend.

NYguy · #**1498** Posted **Aug 23, 2016, 4:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zapatan

I just hope future NY supertalls stop being sucked in to this trend.

As I stated above, your premise on height cuts is wrong. It's foolish to keep repeating it. If this towers ends up being shorter than it's 1,500 ft (not looking like it now),
they'll have to sort out the crown.

The four faces of the tower...

One thing to stay excited about is this towers connection to transit. I'm big on transit projects, and this is one of the big ones.

Here's a little more from the One Vanderbilt website...

http://onevanderbilt.com/

Zapatan · #**1499** Posted **Aug 23, 2016, 8:15 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYguy

As I stated above, your premise on height cuts is wrong. It's foolish to keep repeating it. If this towers ends up being shorter than it's 1,500 ft (not looking like it now),
they'll have to sort out the crown.

Read the Hines article Hudson11 posted yesterday. That rendering also makes it look a bit shorter too and looks new.

Perhaps they're wrong or perhaps the DOB is outdated (EDIT: it says 8/22), we'll find out soon either way.

Just because the building could end up shorter doesn't mean they'd have to do much with the crown, but rather eliminate 100 feet of the building's main shaft. It's not a huge deal either way, the renderings you posted look amazing.

artspook · #**1500** Posted **Aug 24, 2016, 9:28 PM**

the squatter the shaft . .
and the stubbier the crown, proportionally . .
the more hideous the juxtaposition . .
with the Empire & Chrysler . .
Developers give us perfectly designed crowns . .
& then moronically f*ck 'em up . .