Ontario Highways

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Meanwhile, MTO officers have been conducting speed traps on the 407 between Hamilton and Peel Region.
It’s been a year since the trend began, but I wonder what got them targeting passenger vehicles too. They’re usually only after commercial vehicles.
Like here: https://twitter.com/handell_cve/stat...YrgET1MNQTjqUQ

Ps: They stopped people for doing 130+ kph too whereas O.P.P. wouldn’t even have batted an eye for anything < 140 kph on the 407.

The thing with the 407 is that most times it is freeflowing. That is a good reason that people will go faster. The fact most of it has been built like an autobahn is also part of the problem.

[Djeffery]

Why can't the owners of the ETR arbitrarily set a higher speed limit? Setting it to 120 would be a hell of a sales pitch. They could also run their own enforcement to line their own pockets. Maybe even based on the times they enter and exit. If you get on in Milton and exit in Markham in a time that you should still be at Yonge St, tack on a speed fine to the toll. It is private after all

[sonysnob]

The speed limit of the 407 ETR is set by Ontario law, the operators of the ETR can't arbitrarily change it.

Specifically Regulation 619 made under the Highway traffic act deals with speed limits for provincial highways.

[Djeffery]

Originally Posted by sonysnob

The speed limit of the 407 ETR is set by Ontario law, the operators of the ETR can't arbitrarily change it.

Specifically Regulation 619 made under the Highway traffic act deals with speed limits for provincial highways.

It's not a provincial highway though, it's a private highway. If I own a big chunk of land, can the province tell me I can't drive as fast as I want on it?

[sonysnob]

yeah, so I'm not sure how to say this, but the laws of Ontario still apply to private lands.

The Highway 407 Act does indicate that the 407 is a private toll highway and is not a part of the King's Highway, but then the same Act subsequently indicates that for the purpose of the application of the Highway Traffic Act, that Highway 407 shall be considered part of the King's Highway.

Schedule 264 of Regulation 619 made under the Highway Traffic Act then includes the following text:

SCHEDULE 264
HIGHWAY 407

Part 1
Regional Municipality of Halton — City of Burlington
Regional Municipality of Durham — City of Pickering
1. That part of the private toll highway known as Highway 407 lying between a point situate at its intersection with the King’s Highway known as No. 403 and the Queen Elizabeth Way in the City of Burlington in The Regional Municipality of Halton and a point situate at the centre line of the underpass structure of the roadway known as Brock Road in the City of Pickering in The Regional Municipality of Durham.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Djeffery

It's not a provincial highway though, it's a private highway. If I own a big chunk of land, can the province tell me I can't drive as fast as I want on it?

Short answer - provincial law applies to private lands.

[Dengler Avenue]

Anyway, now we know why 407ETR owners can’t increase the speed limit to 110 kph on a whim.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Meanwhile, MTO officers have been conducting speed traps on the 407 between Hamilton and Peel Region.
It’s been a year since the trend began, but I wonder what got them targeting passenger vehicles too. They’re usually only after commercial vehicles.
Like here: https://twitter.com/handell_cve/stat...YrgET1MNQTjqUQ

Ps: They stopped people for doing 130+ kph too whereas O.P.P. wouldn’t even have batted an eye for anything < 140 kph on the 407.

I’ve noticed people driving significantly slower on that stretch of the 407 lately and wondered why. Everyone’s doing 120 like a normal 400 series highway but once you get out to York Region and 140 seems like the minimum speed.

[ScreamingViking]

It's a good stretch to monitor. Some of those curves, while relatively gentle, offer hiding places for enforcement that drivers don't see until it's too late. Similar for that dip under the rail bridge near the inspection stations between Appleby and Bronte. Plus the traffic is usually fairly light on this portion of the highway. It's very tempting to go over 120... and easy to find oneself cruising around 140.

I rarely use it, but the last few times there has been an OPP cruiser on the road doing close to the limit and many dare not pass it. I imagine the odd fool blows by them without realizing, and gets lighter in the bank account for it.

[sonysnob]

Nothing like having to pay a toll, when you are already paying a toll.

[Dengler Avenue]

In other words, watch out for big American cars (i.e. Ford, Chevy) with a bull bar.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by sonysnob

Nothing like having to pay a toll, when you are already paying a toll.

It's for this reason that my understanding was why cops tended not to do too much speed enforcement on the 407 beyond the craziest outliers.

I know someone who has driven on the 407 daily for work since the day it opened, and being no speed slouch, has never once been pulled over for speeding. They've been pulled over 3-4 times for issues with his license plate though (snow covering it, trailer plate which fell off due to rust, etc.). Which shows you what cops are usually looking for (people dodging tolls). That said, they use the eastern part of the highway and basically never drives on the Halton Region part.

[Dengler Avenue]

There are only 2 portions of 407 that have only 6 lanes: Halton, and Durham. My impression is that the former tends to be busier than the latter (though I may be out to lunch on this one.)
If that’s the case, i wonder whether that’s why MTO officers patrol it more and have lower tolerance for 130+ km/h.
It also helps that the Halton stretch has a truck inspection station as that gives them a reason to roam around.

[sonysnob]

Shield for Highway 418 South:


http://www.asphaltplanet.ca/ON/hwy_4...an23_24x16.jpg

[swimmer_spe]

With the announcement of the Ontario budget being bigger with more spending on infrastructure, could we expect announcements for twinning of any highways not already in progress?

[Djeffery]

Probably not, the biggest chunk of the increase is probably previously announced stuff like Bradford Bypass and the 413.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Djeffery

Probably not, the biggest chunk of the increase is probably previously announced stuff like Bradford Bypass and the 413.

So, he is pushing the Bradford Bypass through?

No love for 17/69....

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

With the announcement of the Ontario budget being bigger with more spending on infrastructure, could we expect announcements for twinning of any highways not already in progress?

In some sense, you can count 17 between Arnprior and Renfrew?
So far, other than the interchange at Calabogie Road, absolutely nothing else is happening (other than redoing culvert and repaving).

I want to see 17/69 redone as well, but right now, it’s just too much commitment. It pretty much requires redoing 69 between 17 and Estaire Road as well, and this is the textbook definition of scope creep. (Remember, there’s a realignment that requires cutting 25 m ~ 30 m of igneous rocks in depth.)

[Innsertnamehere]

there will probably be a few new projects which trickle out in the next month or so, and we'll know more when they update the highways program website.

I would be seriously surprised if it was more twinning in Northern Ontario beyond more detailed timelines for already announced widenings though.

[Djeffery]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

No love for 17/69....

I mean, Ontario ends at the next side road north of his cottage, doesn't it?