Cambie Corridor Updates

[seamusmcduff]

Wild that zero commercial is proposed in this massive site.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Guess they figure Oakridge'll suck up all the demand. Still could've used a supermarket though...

[idunno]

AFAIK there will be a decent amount of retail at Pearson next door. 140K sf or something?

Still think there should be at least SOME retail (convenience store?).

[GenWhy?]

Originally Posted by idunno

AFAIK there will be a decent amount of retail at Pearson next door. 140K sf or something?

Still think there should be at least SOME retail (convenience store?).

Like 6,000 or so new residents between the 2 sites (ish?) and a spit of new commercial at Pearson is so sad. We're putting in a retail street on 49 Ave but that's quite the distance. Hope the area doesn't mind car traffic!

[seamusmcduff]

To me, the entire benefit of living in a dense area is the convenience. What's the point if you still have to hop in a car, or walk 15m to the nearest grocery store? The City is adding a lot of density, but completely missing the mark in creating walkable communities.

I just looked it up and it will be 25min walk to the Safeway at Oakridge, and 15min to the TNT at Marine Gateway.

[GenWhy?]

Originally Posted by seamusmcduff

To me, the entire benefit of living in a dense area is the convenience. What's the point if you still have to hop in a car, or walk 15m to the nearest grocery store? The City is adding a lot of density, but completely missing the mark in creating walkable communities.

I just looked it up and it will be 25min walk to the Safeway at Oakridge, and 15min to the TNT at Marine Gateway.

Furthest I've walked consistently to a grocery store locally was 15 minutes in East Van. Had a bit of a hill. Definitely got to be a pain after a while (not to mention the walk back uphill with full groceries is more intense). If I lived here I'd probably drive to Super Store on Marine

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by seamusmcduff

I just looked it up and it will be 25min walk to the Safeway at Oakridge, and 15min to the TNT at Marine Gateway.

I know someone who lives on Cambie near King Edward and regularly walks to the Safeway at King Edward & Oak, and the various supermarkets around Cambie & Broadway (No Frills, Save-on-Foods).

[FarmerHaight]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

Furthest I've walked consistently to a grocery store locally was 15 minutes in East Van. Had a bit of a hill. Definitely got to be a pain after a while (not to mention the walk back uphill with full groceries is more intense). If I lived here I'd probably drive to Super Store on Marine

Even living in Metrotown on Beresford it got annoying that the closest proper grocery store was on Kingsway (or TnT and Walmart in the mall). It certainly felt that a grocery store right on Beresford was warranted to serve the towers on that street and the lowrises behind. The pedestrian environment makes a huge difference as well, as the walk along Willingdon and cutting through the parking lot to SaveOn, or the walk along Central to Walmart / TnT made those treks feel much farther than the walk to Price Smart at Station Square, even though all of the those walks were very similar in distance.

2,600 units plus the surrounding neighbourhood should at least warrant some corner stores with something like what the West End has in Aria or, at a minimum, Barclay grocer. If one of the podiums had space for a coffee shop, pizza place, and corner store with some produce I am sure residents would be grateful.

[giallo]

I think four to five blocks is the maximum one should be expected to walk for groceries in a densely built environment. Anything beyond that is just bad planning.

[phesto]

Don't forget that the existing Langara Gardens buildings have about 21,000 SF of retail in front of the towers on 57th. No grocery store, but there's a liquor store, pharmacy etc.

[teriyaki]

Between the two absolutely massive developments, I feel its a major oversight in planning to not have atleast one grocery store in the mix here. So many other much smaller developments with 1/3 the amount units have had new grocery stores being integrated into their podiums.

[vanman]

There's a 40,000 sqft grocery store planned next door at Cambie Gardens.

Once completed, Cambie Gardens residents will enjoy the conveniences of a master-planned community with amenities such as a two-and-a-half-acre park, owned and maintained by the city of Vancouver, a central plaza and a one-acre urban farm in addition to 100 000 square feet of retail space. The retail space is expected to accommodate a large grocery store of about 40,000 square feet, and other convenience stores such as a coffee shop, drugstore and a bank. Most of the retail space will front on to Cambie, Jensen says.]

https://vancouversun.com/homes/buying-se...-to-comprise-hundreds-of-vancouver-homes

[GenWhy?]

Gunna be one busy store. Expecting maybe 7,200 people full build-out between the two sites. Plus all the Cambie Plan apartments and townhomes. Excellent planning. Love that by-design top-down commercial scarcity and monopolization of grocery spaces.

Is that in Parcel "C" or "D"?

[jollyburger]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

Gunna be one busy store. Expecting maybe 7,200 people full build-out between the two sites. Plus all the Cambie Plan apartments and townhomes. Excellent planning. Love that by-design top-down commercial scarcity and monopolization of grocery spaces.

Is that in Parcel "C" or "D"?

But it's still mostly surrounded by single family homes and who are more than likely to drive 15 minutes in either direction to go shopping. Oakridge Park is getting a 42,000 sq feet grocery store as well so...

[osirisboy]

Fsr of 3.1 seems way too low especially considering they want a future Canada line station

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by osirisboy

Fsr of 3.1 seems way too low especially considering they want a future Canada line station

It's a higher density than Cambie Gardens next door. It's also a gross figure - including open space and internal streets (although not Cambie Park or the track).

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

Gunna be one busy store. Expecting maybe 7,200 people full build-out between the two sites. Plus all the Cambie Plan apartments and townhomes. Excellent planning. Love that by-design top-down commercial scarcity and monopolization of grocery spaces.

If you compare to the Downtown peninsula, there are 12 supermarkets (once City Market opens in The Post) for 120,000 residents (and all those office workers, tourists etc.). It seems unlikely any of the supermarket operators would want to locate so close to Cambie Gardens store (whatever it turns out to be).

Strand included a proposed grocery store in their Prior Street project next to the new St Paul's at rezoning, and removed it at DP, even though there's nothing close. New residents in the Strand rental towers will have a 20 minute walk to get to T&T and Rexall in Chinatown and a bit more to get to Urban Fare and London Drugs in the Olympic Village. Presumably no grocery store was willing to commit to a space there either, despite no obvious local competition, and all those underserved residents in Strathcona, Citygate and the New St Paul's staff. (There should be something in the next phase of St Paul's - obviously a drug store is a likely tenant).

[Migrant_Coconut]

So the rule of thumb is one supermarket for every 10k residents? That sounds reasonable... but I'm guessing the ratio is much higher for coffee or sushi, and there's absolutely none of that anywhere in the Gardens.

[officedweller]

Remember that there is a wide spectrum of supermarkets with varying price and quality.
People will travel (by whatever means) to shop at different stores.

Unless you are a shut-in, most people find themselves out and about and will link trips and do grocery shopping piecemeal when they are near their preferred grocery stores.
I live a 5 minute walk from Urban Fare Yaletown and never shop there, and walk past IGA Robson almost every day, but don't shop there either (due to high prices).
I also walk past the H-Mart on Robson almost every day too, but generally just forget it's there - I should stop in there for produce.

I shop No Frills, Safeway (which has improved on sale prices a lot) and occasionally Save-on-Foods, either around the 4th Ave. node (No Frills 4th & Pine, Safeway 4th & Vine) or the Cambie Broadway node (No Frills Broadway & Yukon, Safeway a bit farther at Oak & King Ed, and Save-on-Foods either at Cambie & 7th or Main & 13th), depending on where I'm travelling to/from. I don't generally visit Sungiven or Whole Foods.

[giallo]

Interesting list, OD.

I shop at No Frills on Yukon/Broadway, Safeway at Commercial/Broadway, and Whole Foods and Save On on Cambie.

Every now and then, I'll grab stuff from PriceSmart if I'm in Metrotown (far prefer it to T&T), Sungiven near City Hall, and Kim's Mart on Broadway.

Originally Posted by officedweller

Remember that there is a wide spectrum of supermarkets with varying price and quality.
People will travel (by whatever means) to shop at different stores.

Unless you are a shut-in, most people find themselves out and about and will link trips and do grocery shopping piecemeal when they are near their preferred grocery stores.
I live a 5 minute walk from Urban Fare Yaletown and never shop there, and walk past IGA Robson almost every day, but don't shop there either (due to high prices).
I also walk past the H-Mart on Robson almost every day too, but generally just forget it's there - I should stop in there for produce.

I shop No Frills, Safeway (which has improved on sale prices a lot) and occasionally Save-on-Foods, either around the 4th Ave. node (No Frills 4th & Pine, Safeway 4th & Vine) or the Cambie Broadway node (No Frills Broadway & Yukon, Safeway a bit farther at Oak & King Ed, and Save-on-Foods either at Cambie & 7th or Main & 13th), depending on where I'm travelling to/from. I don't generally visit Sungiven or Whole Foods.