New Downtown Calgary Arena

[CorporateWhore]

Originally Posted by hulkrogan

I really want it on the east end, but I know for a fact some work has been done with arena/stadium footprints on the west end. I don't know how much that means, as I'm sure they've done work like that for a couple locations.

Have you ever walked from your house to the Dome? Curious how long it takes. I'm thinking it wouldn't be a terribly long walk, but probably a lot less enjoyable in the winter (especially over the river).

One of the good things about it being in the West End, is that it would be relatively easy to get there from the Bridgeland station.

[bt04ku]

Originally Posted by Spring2008

I'd rather the Railtown, but wouldn't be disappointed with West Village either.

With Railtown, you'd have massive build up of Vic Park, East Village, and East Vic Park at once.

West Village is a good location, but still the second best location (IMO).

While WV is next to Sunalta station, that still means the people who use the busiest line need to transfer because the walk from any downtown stations across the wall known as 14th St. isn't great. It has a lot of road access but they'd require a lot of upgrades etc.

To me Railtown is just so much better. Close walk from a downtown station (which means no need to transfer for either line and would be right on an eventual Green Line station). Easy to walk, no less driving infrastructure than we have now and as mentioned, can build on and feed off of the stuff already happening on the East side, helping tie a lot of areas together.



That said, as big as the Railtown is I don't think there's as much potential for Flames owned developments beyond a stadium and arena. A West Village site could create far more potential for a much more lucrative 'sports and entertainment district.' This could also play to the idea that they are accepting they aren't getting public money and need to maximize their earning potential and diversify.

When you consider that the East Village is developing anyway and will drag as much of the East Beltline along with it as it can, not having the key entertainment complex in the city in their backyard it might actually force the Stampede to join in and develop the area and make up for their loss in parking revenue. The West Village getting developed would fix a blight that doesn't seem poised to be fixed otherwise and the other side of downtown would develop anyway and (hopefully) not carry any stigma of city money coming along with it.

I still prefer Railtown simply because it would help carry East Village, Inglewood and East Beltline to the next level, and be easier to get to. Seriously, never mind Crowchild, how do you fix the 14th St/BowTr/9St mess to integrate the WV with pedestrian traffic coming from the West Beltline and West Downtown so that a potential district isn't just an island accessible by one transit station (as nice as it is).

[Chadillaccc]

Also, let's not forget that the east option would be served by all three LRT lines, two of which will have large subway sections within walking distance of Railtown.

[craner]

Oh man just thinking of the possibilities is getting me so energized.
This would become my most anticipated project in this city probably ever.
God I hope they get it right and go all the way.
This too exciting - I might just spontaneously combust.

[milomilo]

I guess this project and the 'West Village Area Redevelopment Plan' are incompatible?

http://wpmedia.blogs.calgaryherald.com/2010/04/west_village_arp.pdf

Which seems a shame, as that seemed like a great project.

[Full Mountain]

Originally Posted by milomilo

I guess this project and the 'West Village Area Redevelopment Plan' are incompatible?

http://wpmedia.blogs.calgaryherald.com/2010/04/west_village_arp.pdf

Which seems a shame, as that seemed like a great project.

I would highly doubt that a revision to that ARP wouldn't be approved if a private party was able to consolidate land and came forward with a plan to redevelop much of the area.

[Spring2008]

Ken King mentioned a field house in the vid. Wouldn't be surprised if that big field house proposal gets tied into a new stadium with a retractable roof.

He also mentioned a very big owner equity contribution as well as unique funding model, so some positive signs there.

[Tills13]

Originally Posted by Spring2008

Ken King mentioned a field house in the vid. Wouldn't be surprised if that big field house proposal gets tied into a new stadium with a retractable roof.

He also mentioned a very big owner equity contribution as well as unique funding model, so some positive signs there.

Someone posted a bunch of renders in the general thread, not sure how recent they are but they look pretty slick.

[J-D]

Originally Posted by Tills13

Someone posted a bunch of renders in the general thread, not sure how recent they are but they look pretty slick.

http://www.calgaryfieldhouse.ca/

[The Urbanist]

I've heard the leases for the dealerships surrounding the Greyhound station are up in the next few years and the City of Calgary is the landowner. I also heard from one of the major stakeholders of the Cowboys Casino that they were 'guaranteed' the Flames would build the new Stadium near the Stampede grounds.

[tomthumb2]

Wow - finally! Of course we've waited so long that expectations are going to be sky high. Lets hope this promise of it being "unlike anything we've ever seen" is more than a sales pitch. Would love to see one building like VTB in Moscow - anyone else agree that would be less expensive than 2 separate buildings? (super huge footprint though) Love the idea of West Village (with Crowchild and Bow trail cluster f**k being fixed) but East might be good too - especially with both LRT lines serving it. As long as its in/near the dt core!

[RyLucky]

Originally Posted by Chadillaccc

Also, let's not forget that the east option would be served by all three LRT lines, two of which will have large subway sections within walking distance of Railtown.

This is key.

[MalcolmTucker]

Note: this is entirely speculation and does not reflect any inside knowledge from my role at the university, as I have no knowledge on this file. I would also prefer if this post is not quoted in replies.

In theory, build a football stadium, field house, and hockey arena on the combined University of Calgary and City parcel at McMahon Stadium.

Any money donated to the university is matched by the provincial Access to the Future fund.

Donate a good chunk of the capital cost of the arena, and get a huge tax break, and double the money. The university uses the combined funds to build the infrastructure, and owns the assets. The city captures additional spin off tax revenue through a CRL from a TOD built on surplus land, and development spurred in motel village. The city also contributes whatever it had been planning to contribute to redevelop the atheletic park. The Flames lease their part of the facility at the cost of maintaining the assets in day 1 condition and/or build up a replacement value over the life of the asset in exchange for full control and full revenue.

Benefits:

• The province contributes funds indirectly, but it really isn't a loss as the province owns the asset, though at arms length.
• The university benefits from a big infusion into the endowment.
• The Flames have to put up less capital and get a huge tax write off.
• The City gets a shiny TOD/arena district.
• The district would be on the LRT, two BRT/alternative rapid transit lines, and two major roads
• Facilities may enable the scope of the redevelopment of the recreation complex at the university to be significantly reduced

Negatives:

• Outside the core
• Limited parking should TOD develop (thought the university has plans to build more structured parking and could change the plans to along 24th Ave)
• Uncertainty over legality of the arrangement
• May require significant political capital to negate opposition from spend thrifts, neighbours, and overcome the Noah's Ark problem

[Surrealplaces]

Originally Posted by You Need A Thneed

Insiders in the thread at Calgarypuck say that West Village it where it will be, likely a football stadium and a hockey arena, as part of an entertainment district.

Not too surprised. That seems to be where all the rumors are pointing to.

I would have preferred something right down around the grounds if just an arena, but if a Stadium is involved then West Village makes more sense.... I'm not surprised if a stadium is in the planning. Soon Calgary will be the only CFL city with a crappy stadium.

[Surrealplaces]

14th is ugly, and right now is a major block to the pedestrian realm, but I think it can be overcome. If that clusterfuck intersection beside Hyatt Auto got blown out and realigned which it supposedly will in the longterm plan, you could make a nice wide pedestrian corridor that led right into downtown. The WV plan shows a promenade going along the river for a stretch, but not all the way into downtown. It might be better to have the promenade along the 8th ave/6th ave corridor....even though that will be a busy corridor.

Originally Posted by bt04ku

West Village is a good location, but still the second best location (IMO).

While WV is next to Sunalta station, that still means the people who use the busiest line need to transfer because the walk from any downtown stations across the wall known as 14th St. isn't great. It has a lot of road access but they'd require a lot of upgrades etc.

To me Railtown is just so much better. Close walk from a downtown station (which means no need to transfer for either line and would be right on an eventual Green Line station). Easy to walk, no less driving infrastructure than we have now and as mentioned, can build on and feed off of the stuff already happening on the East side, helping tie a lot of areas together.

[eggbert]

GSL is currently doing renos to the dealership. Hard to imagine they go ahead with that now if an announcement was iminent.

[bt04ku]

Originally Posted by Surrealplaces

14th is ugly, and right now is a major block to the pedestrian realm, but I think it can be overcome. If that clusterfuck intersection beside Hyatt Auto got blown out and realigned which it supposedly will in the longterm plan, you could make a nice wide pedestrian corridor that led right into downtown. The WV plan shows a promenade going along the river for a stretch, but not all the way into downtown. It might be better to have the promenade along the 8th ave/6th ave corridor....even though that will be a busy corridor.

I'd imagine the people coming from the NW would be SOL with all the southern folks hopping on those westbound "Blue Line" trains at City Hall in order to stay out of the cold on game days. The 1km+ walk from 8th St Station is farther from the West Village site than either City Hall or Vic Park stations are from the Railtown site.

Then after the game it will be a nightmare for everybody wanting to go NW, NE and South on the train wanting to wait on the same platform (unlike Vic Park where is at least a split of the north and south platforms). If there isn't good pedestrian infrastructure then I don't think the station could possibly handle it.

[Surrealplaces]

Originally Posted by bt04ku

I'd imagine the people coming from the NW would be SOL with all the southern folks hopping on those westbound "Blue Line" trains at City Hall in order to stay out of the cold on game days. The 1km+ walk from 8th St Station is farther from the West Village site than either City Hall or Vic Park stations are from the Railtown site.

Then after the game it will be a nightmare for everybody wanting to go NW, NE and South on the train wanting to wait on the same platform (unlike Vic Park where is at least a split of the north and south platforms). If there isn't good pedestrian infrastructure then I don't think the station could possibly handle it.

Ultimately Railtown area would be the best location IMO, but if they did decide to go with WV, I think WV can still be quite viable. Of course the pedestrian realm would need to be beefed up immensely.

Good point about the cold weather days. It is a fair distance from the core of downtown.

[Trans Canada]

Does anyone have that WV redevelopment concept pdf that has been floating around for a while (might be a couple years old)?

Any idea how much leeway will there be to realign roads etc? Ideally the entire network of roads, particularly the ramps on/off 14th, would be redesigned - certainly it can be done better than how it is now (though the time in limbo between old and new would be a major traffic nightmare).

Also, I have the impression that stadia/arenas generally kill vibrancy of a neighbourhood rather than enhance it. A big single-use structure that is only used a couple times per week. Two in the same neighbourhood would pose a big challenge to developing WV into a vibrant mixed-use (mainly residential) neighbourhood. I think these would be better placed beside a vibrant neighbourhood (say Railtown next to EV) rather than right in the middle.

[milomilo]

Originally Posted by Trans Canada

Does anyone have that WV redevelopment concept pdf that has been floating around for a while (might be a couple years old)?

Any idea how much leeway will there be to realign roads etc? Ideally the entire network of roads, particularly the ramps on/off 14th, would be redesigned - certainly it can be done better than how it is now (though the time in limbo between old and new would be a major traffic nightmare).

Also, I have the impression that stadia/arenas generally kill vibrancy of a neighbourhood rather than enhance it. A big single-use structure that is only used a couple times per week. Two in the same neighbourhood would pose a big challenge to developing WV into a vibrant mixed-use (mainly residential) neighbourhood. I think these would be better placed beside a vibrant neighbourhood (say Railtown next to EV) rather than right in the middle.

I actually asked this a few posts ago - http://wpmedia.blogs.calgaryherald.com/2010/04/west_village_arp.pdf . Unfortunately completely incompatible.

I agree - I don't want something so massive and single purpose in such a prime location. It wouldn't be so bad if the site was wider, but a stadium will dominate the area and create a wall on the western edge of downtown.

Surely any sort of arena will have a ton of parking lots - anathema to the majority of posters here?