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  #1401  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 5:08 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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It is far easier for the vast majority of Chicago metro area residents to get to downtown Chicago than to Downers Grove.
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  #1402  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 5:08 PM
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Originally Posted by F1 Tommy View Post
Also Downers Grove has very good train service.
downers grove: 1 metra line

downtown chicago: 12 metra lines and 9 el lines.
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  #1403  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 5:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Steely Dan View Post
downers grove: 1 metra line

downtown chicago: 12 metra lines and 9 el lines.

That is true, but most people working at FTD live closer to Downers Grove than downtown. They are probably all pissed about the move but will just jump on the train and go downtown wich should be easy enough. Or like a lot of morons, they will try to drive for some uknown reason.
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  #1404  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 5:18 PM
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By the way, Sears just signed another deal with Amazon for it's service auto centers. Sounds like Sears is trying to save itself via Amazon.
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  #1405  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 6:47 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Originally Posted by the urban politician View Post
^ I like to read what you’re saying, but in reality it’s all just conjecture.

I’d like to see the evidence that companies actually perform better when located in the heart of cities as opposed to in suburban campuses
I've got an Urban Economics textbook with your name on it, seriously stop by and pick it up, it's a good read. I'll quote more in a separate post from it. I've taken multiple 300 and 400 level real estate and economics courses on this including an entire course just on Urban Economics. The concept of economies of agglomeration is not up for debate, economists don't agree on much, but they all agree on the fundamental economic forces that cause cities to exist.

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Originally Posted by F1 Tommy View Post
Moving 15 miles east does all that.... Do you have the numbers to prove that or are they moving for tax breaks?? Is FTD going to fire it's workforce and hire only people from Chicago??

" It means less waste, better innovation, more growth in services as employees find themselves with more time. It means more and greater specialization in the work force making not only FTD more competitive nationally and globally, but all the other firms proximate to FTD who reap the ancillary benefits of yet more white collar workers nearby. Moving jobs downtown benefits Chicago most of all, it actually puts us in a position where we can leverage the second densest CBD on Earth to make our economy as a whole more competitive. "
15 miles isn't insignificant when you are talking about economics of cities. Do you think Goldman Sachs would do better or worse if they relocated 15 miles into New Jersey from Manhattan? Do you think CME would do better or worse if they moved their operations to Downers Grove?

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Originally Posted by F1 Tommy View Post
My point is this is just a location change that might pick up a few new local employees. The attitude around here is wrong. Moving from point A to point B in the Chicago area is not helping the overall economy as much as some think. When they went the other way from Chicago to the suburbs people just drove to a new location. I do like seeing Chicago do well but all this hate for the suburbs is silly. We need to pull companies from other states and countries, not from the METRO CHICAGO AREA.
Well all you have to do is look at McDonalds. They are shedding large numbers of their workforce who don't want to commute downtown. All you have to do is look at the job openings cropping up all over the place for MCD's. A recruiter was just trying to get me to take a corporate real estate job there yesterday. I'm not interested, but I would have laughed in their face if they called me to ask if I wanted to work in Oakbrook. I told them no, I'm just not interested in working for someone else right now, but to keep me in mind if a higher level position opens up.
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  #1406  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 7:02 PM
the urban politician the urban politician is offline
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Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright View Post
I've got an Urban Economics textbook with your name on it, seriously stop by and pick it up, it's a good read. I'll quote more in a separate post from it. I've taken multiple 300 and 400 level real estate and economics courses on this including an entire course just on Urban Economics. The concept of economies of agglomeration is not up for debate, economists don't agree on much, but they all agree on the fundamental economic forces that cause cities to exist.
Economic theories and principles are one thing. But results are different.

Urban agglomeration in theory makes sense, and I get the argument. And I love that companies are moving downtown--its great for Chicago. It's also great for the region in that it may make the south suburbs more appealing as a place to live as more jobs are accessible to them by being downtown.

But if you take a results-oriented approach, the proof has to be in the pudding. Take change in stock value in publicly traded companies as one example. Compare a large number of companies based out of suburban campuses to a similarly sized cohort (both in a healthy mix of industries) based in urban cores. Does one group, on average, perform better than the other?

I'm just curious if anyone has ever made that comparison
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  #1407  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 7:03 PM
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F1 Tommy F1 Tommy is offline
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Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright View Post
A recruiter was just trying to get me to take a corporate real estate job there yesterday. I'm not interested, but I would have laughed in their face if they called me to ask if I wanted to work in Oakbrook. I told them no, I'm just not interested in working for someone else right now, but to keep me in mind if a higher level position opens up.

Of the almost 10 million people in Chicagoland only 2.6 million and dropping live in Chicago and very few of those live downtown. I do take your point for downtown. It is a good place for some companies to locate to, but it is not as big a deal as you make it out to be. God forbid Dallas and Atlanta would not exist if it was as they have very small downtowns.
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  #1408  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 7:26 PM
Chi-Sky21 Chi-Sky21 is offline
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I can assure you most employees from FTD do not want to work in the city, most live in the immediate area or right off 355. It is a higher level decision, thinking they will get better web developers there. However, they already hired all the new web developers and they are working in DG already so not sure the reasoning other than the C level guys live in the city and they will be closer to work. FTD is retaining its office in DG since they own the building not much real cost to keep it.
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  #1409  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 7:27 PM
moorhosj moorhosj is offline
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Originally Posted by F1 Tommy View Post
Of the almost 10 million people in Chicagoland only 2.6 million and dropping live in Chicago and very few of those live downtown. I do take your point for downtown. It is a good place for some companies to locate to, but it is not as big a deal as you make it out to be. God forbid Dallas and Atlanta would not exist if it was as they have very small downtowns.
The point is that every form of transportation in the entire region exists to move people to the downtown area (see every "L" and Metra line). This by definition makes it more available to more people, increasing the employee pool. Dallas and Atlanta rely on their huge highway system to move people. They have pretty much maxed that out and are now trying to build the same train infrastructure Chicago already has.

As an example, my company is headquartered in the West Loop, and have a software development office in Naperville. We are having a very hard time finding young developers who want to live in (or commute to) Naperville. Thus, we are moving more developer jobs to our downtown office.
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  #1410  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 7:43 PM
OrdoSeclorum OrdoSeclorum is offline
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Originally Posted by F1 Tommy View Post
Of the almost 10 million people in Chicagoland only 2.6 million and dropping live in Chicago and very few of those live downtown. I do take your point for downtown. It is a good place for some companies to locate to, but it is not as big a deal as you make it out to be. God forbid Dallas and Atlanta would not exist if it was as they have very small downtowns.
I kind of don't understand the point you are trying to make in this series of comments. Are you suggesting that the suburbs and the city are the same? That there aren't significant differences between them related to operations?

If you have an office in Deerfield, you can recruit people within a 45-minute drive from Deerfield, perhaps two million people. If you have an office in the Loop, you can recruit people from the entire metro area. This is self-evident. Is it something you disagree with? If you have an office in Naperville, it's not as easy to recruit young college grads as it is if you have an office in the West Loop. Is this something you disagree with? If you need to meet with your marketing consultant, banker, lawyer or entertain colleagues from out of town, it's easier to do these things if they are within a few miles. This can be deduced from first-priciples. Is it something you disagree with?

These are the reasons why corporations frequently explicitly cite for why they are moving downtown. They are the reasons economists say activities in city centers are typically more productive than auto-oriented edge-cities. Are you suggesting that there is and interesting and counter-intuitive reason for investment in the city and everyone is lying about it for no reason?
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  #1411  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 8:10 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Excerpts from Urban Economics by Arthur Sullivan:


Quote:
THE ROLE OF CITIES IN THE ECONOMY

... Cities facilitate creative thinking and innovation. One of the vital inputs to creativity is personal communication between people sharing common interests. Face to face communication is the most effective means of transmitting the subtle ideas that lead to the development of new products and production
processes. A city provides many opportunities for people to interact with people with common interests, and thus promotes creative thought. In the language of urban economics, the city provides opportunities for knowledge spillovers...
They go on to cite like five studies beginning in the 1860's and going through the 20th century observing correlation between patent productivity and city size and other indicators proving the knowledge spillover effect.

Quote:
LEARNING IN CITIES

... Cities provide more contacts with workers performing similar tasks, facilitating learning that increases productivity...

Some evidence for learning in cities comes from data on wages for migrants (Glaeser, 1999). The average wage in cities exceeds the average wage outside of cities, reflecting the higher productivity for city workers. However, when a worker migrates from a rural area to a city, her wage does not jump immediately to the higher city wage, but instead increases over time. This observation is consistent with the idea that a city worker learns over time, increasing her productivity and her wage. In addition, when a worker leaves a city, her wage doesn't drop to the rural wage rate. This means that learning in cities causes a permanent increase in productivity...
This is literally a study of exactly what we are talking about here. People moving into the city experience exponentially more rapid productivity growth (which is the main driver of economic growth mind you) than those in less dense areas. This is again due to interactions with increasingly more specialized peers. This same effect occurs both for workers wages, but also for their consumption:

Quote:
CONSUMPTION IN CITIES

Cities also provide consumers with a wide variety of goods and services. Consider a product with a low per capita demand (e.g. live theater). Suppose that 2 out of every 100 people attend a live theater performance in any given year. In addition, suppose that to break even, the theater must sell 20,000 tickets per year. To survive, the city surrounding the theater must have a population of at least one million people (1,000,000 times 0.02= 20,000). In general, the larger the city, the larger the number of products it can support. In larger cities, you can buy all of the goods that are available in smaller cities, as well as other goods that have a relatively low per capita demand.

Does the greater consumer variety available in cities matter? There is some evidence that the value consumers place on variety has been increasing. In the last few decades, cities with the greatest variety of certain consumer goods have grown most rapidly. In the United States, the most rapidly growing metropolitan areas were the ones with relatively large numbers of restaurants and live performances per capita...
Here's my favorite chapter:

Quote:
WHY DO CITIES EXIST?

Cities exist because it is efficiant to produce some goods on a large scale. An activity is subject to economies of scale if the average cost of production decreases when we scale up the operation and produce more output. The way to exploit economies of scale is to concentrate population in a small number of sites. Because workers can economize on travel time, cities develop around these production sites...

To fully exploit scale economies in transporatation, a trading firm must collect and distribute a large volume of output. A trading firm will locate at a place convenient for the collection and distribution of goods (COUGH COUGH CHICAGO COUGH), causing the development of marketplaces at crossroads, ports, river junctions, and other transshipment points.

The location decisions of traders cause the development of market cities. People employed by the trading firms will live near the marketplace to economize on commuting costs, and will bid up the price of land near the marketplace.
As the price of land increases, residents will economize by occupying relatively small lots. In other words, the population density around the marketplace will be higher than in the rest of the region. A city is defined as a place with a relatively high population density, so the combination of comparative advantage and scale economies in transportation causes the development of a market city.

The market city develops because three conditions are satisfied. First, productivity is high enough that people outside the city produce enough bread and shirts for themselves and the urban traders. The agricultural surplus feeds and clothes the urban workers. Second, the differences in productivity that generate comparative advantage are large enough to offset transportation costs, so trade occurs. Third, there are scale economies in transportation (THINK TRAINS), meaning that intermediaries are more efficient at transporting and marketing goods, generating central marketplaces.
This touches on why Chicago is my favorite city. It's entire built environment was created during the era of industrialization, but before much in the way of regulation. It is also built on a totally flat plain with only one natural obstacle to distort growth patterns (the lake). As a result you can almost perfectly see the patterns of growth described above. Density (lot size) falls exponentially as you leave the city center. The only exception to this rule is along the lake which perfectly demonstrates what happens when a city does encounter a natural barrier and attraction. Our skyline is literally a bar graph of land values, that's why it's so perfectly peaked, land values spike near the central hub (Michigan and the river), near the commuter stations in the near West Loop (Sears et al), and where the main retail district meets the wealthiest residential district (Water Tower).

Finally, agglomeration economies:

Quote:
LOCALIZATION ECONOMIES AND INDUSTRY CLUSTERS

One puzzling feature of an urban economy is the tendency of firms producing the same product to locate close to one another. The clustering is puzzling because dispersing into separate territories would reduce competition for workers and perhaps bring the firms closer to their dispersed customers. There are some subtle benefits from clustering, and for many industries these benefits dominate the more obvious costs. We'll explore three types of benefits: sharing the suppliers of intermediate inputs, sharing a pool of labor, and sharing information. In all three cases, the production cost of an individual firm decreases as the total output of the industry cluster increases...

Some industry clusters occur because firms in a particular industry buy and intermediate input from the same supplier. Firms will cluster around a common input supplier if two conditions are satisfied:

1. The input demand of an individual firm is not large enough to exploit the scale economies in the production of the intermediate input.

2. Transportation costs are relatively high. If demanders and supplier interact in the design or fabircation of the intermediate input, face to face contact between buyer and seller is necessary, and proximity to the input supplier is important...

There are many other examples of clusters that result from scale economies in the provision of intermediate inputs.

1. Corporate headquarters produce a wide variety of outputs. An executive may supervise the development of a new advertising campaign one week, pick a location for a new plant the next week, and develop a strategy to fend off a lawsuit the following week. Most corporations hire advertising firms because the scale economies in producing advertising campaigns are large relative to the advertising demand of an individual corporation. Corporate executives need to be close to the advertising firm because the executives assist in the design of the advertising campaign; face to face time is required. In general, the clustering of corporate headquarters allows corporations to exploit scale economies in the production of intermediate goods (advertising, economic consultants, legal services, etc) for which face time is an important part of the production process.
This is literally what we see with McDonalds who actually is such a large firm that it's suppliers followed it to Oakbrook and set up around just McDonalds because they were a big enough customer that the costs of disbursed sales centers catering just to MCD was worth it to the suppliers. Now all those vendors are following them to the West Loop where they very well might pick up new customers other than MCD.

Then there is the labor pool, why is McDonalds moving downtown again? Oh yeah, because they can't get fresh labor in Oakbrook:

Quote:
SHARING A LABOR POOL: VARYING DEMAND FOR LABOR

If a firm is uncertain about the quantity of workers it will hire or the skills of its workforce, it will have an incentive to cluster around other firms and draw from a common labor pool...

Workers in the cluster have relatively low job search costs because (1) information about job openings is spread through informal channels (casual conversation at restaurants, bowling alleys, and baseball games) and (2) prospective employers are nearby, making formal job searches relatively easy. Second, because of physical proximity of employers, moving costs are relatively low; workers can easily switch to a different firm in the same city...

SHARING A LABOR POOL: MATCHING

... The firm doesn't know what type of worker will be most appropriate for next year's production, but must pick a location now and then hire workers that provide the best match of labor skills. The firm must choose now between and isolated site and the industry cluster. The difference is that the cluster has more workers and thus a greater variety of skills...

SHARING INFORMATION: KNOWLEDGE SPILLOVERS

A third type of localization economy arises from the sharing of information among firms in the same industry. As we saw in Chapter 1, a disproportionate amount of innovation occurs in cities, especially the largest cities. A city provides opportunities for interactions among people with common interests and thus promotes creative thought.

A cluster of firms in the same industry promotes innovation by bringing together people producing similar goods with similar production technology. In the words of Alfred Marshall (1920):

"When an industry has chosen a locality for itself, it is likely to stay there long; so great are the advantages which people following the same skilled trade get from near neighborhood to one another. The mysteries of the trade become no mysteries; but are as it were in the air, and children learn many of them unconsciously. Good work is appreciated, inventions and improvements in machinery, in processes and in the general organization of the business have their merits promptly discussed; if one man starts a new idea, it is taken up by others and combined with suggestion of their own; and thus it becomes the source of new ideas"

The opportunity to exchange ideas occurs in both formal and informal settings. A cluster of computer makers produces a large concentration of computer scientists and engineers who can exchange ideas while they work and play...
Again, sound familiar? A bunch of people working at Google in the West Loop makes Chicago more attractive for Amazon because those workers might encounter their workers at Au Cheval and come up with new ideas. This is also why MCD wants its workers lounging at Lone Wolf after work soaking up ideas from some guy they just met who works at Publican.

Finally, to drive the point on density home, there's Urbanization (i.e. agglomeration) economies:

Quote:
URBANIZATION ECONOMIES

A second type of external scale economy occurs if the production cost of an individual firm decreases as the total output of the urban area increases. Urbanization economies differ from localization economies in two ways. First, urbanization economies result from the scale of the entire urban economy, not simply the scale of a particular industry. Second, urbanization economies generate benefits for firms throughout the city, not just firms in a particular industry.

There is a large volume of economics literature examining the extent of external economies, both localization and urbanization economies. In searching for evidence of localization economies, researchers focus on the effects of industry concentration on (1) worker productivity (2) the number of new production plants (plant births) and (3) growth in industry employment. If there are localization economies, we expect industry clusters to generate higher productivity, more births, and more rapid employment growth. In contrast, if there are urbanization economies, what matters is the size of the urban economy, not the size of a particular industry, so expect larger cities to generate higher productivity, more plant births, and faster employment growth...

How local are localization economies? The Rosenthal and Strange study (2000b) shows that the benefits associated with localization economies (sharing input suppliers, a labor pool, and information) fall rapidly with distance. They compute the percentage drop-off of the localization effect for a one-mile move away from a cluster. ON AVERAGE THE LOCALIZATION EFFECT PETERS OUT AT A RATE OF ABOUT 50 PERCENT PER MILE.
(emphasis mine). The rapid attenuation of the localization economies explains the local in "localization economies".
50% less benefits gained from locating near other firms for every mile away from the cluster. That means that the benefits to firms and to Chicago in general disappear logarithmically towards zero as you move away from the city core. This is not indicative of a "zero sum game" when it comes to locating in the suburbs vs the core.

Mic drop. I've got another 500 pages of economic whoopass if you want to continue this debate, but I think I've thoroughly demonstrated that this isn't made up mumbo jumbo, but accepted fact in the world of economics.
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  #1412  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 8:20 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Originally Posted by the urban politician View Post
Economic theories and principles are one thing. But results are different.

Urban agglomeration in theory makes sense, and I get the argument. And I love that companies are moving downtown--its great for Chicago. It's also great for the region in that it may make the south suburbs more appealing as a place to live as more jobs are accessible to them by being downtown.

But if you take a results-oriented approach, the proof has to be in the pudding. Take change in stock value in publicly traded companies as one example. Compare a large number of companies based out of suburban campuses to a similarly sized cohort (both in a healthy mix of industries) based in urban cores. Does one group, on average, perform better than the other?

I'm just curious if anyone has ever made that comparison
All of the textbook quotes above precede multiple paragraphs of extremely dry discussion of various economics studies supporting his summary. Many of the pertain to hard stats about what firms grow faster, what ones produce more patents, what ones see faster employment growth, which workers see higher wage growth, etc etc etc. I'm not about to write a bibliography for my little research paper here, but if you really want the names of all the studies, PM me and I'll send you a screen shot.

Also, all the proof in the pudding you need is that cities exist and they get denser and denser with size. Do you not think there is a reason that every financial firm on earth is HQ'd or located in Manhattan? Is it just coincidence that practically the entire futures and options industry in anchored in Chicago? Is it just chance that virtually the entire Des Moines metro is one giant backoffice for insurance firms? These forces are very very real and while there are always exceptions, the general trend is glaringly obvious if only because cities exist and seem to thrive with density.

If we take the 50% loss of agglomeration benefits per mile from the study above as hard fact, that means we can quantify exactly the effect that those 13 miles FTD is moving will have. If we assume that you get 100% of the effect if you locate within a 1 mile radius of State and Madison, that means you halve those benefits 12 times on your way out to Downers Grove. If you do the math on that you end up with FTD recieving .0122% (just over one tenth of one percent) of the localization benefits in Downers Grove and it will see in the loop. And that's only talking benefits to the firm, not benefits to workers or to other firms or residents in the city or to the city government itself.

Also, I don't care if the workers like it or not, they can all find new jobs or relocated downtown. That's the whole point of density, if you live by lots of people, you live by lots of jobs and should have no trouble finding a new one without having to sell your house. If you live in the suburbs, you signed yourself up for fewer employment options without having to commute, that's your problem, not the city's or your employers.
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  #1413  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 8:31 PM
marothisu marothisu is offline
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Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright View Post

15 miles isn't insignificant when you are talking about economics of cities. Do you think Goldman Sachs would do better or worse if they relocated 15 miles into New Jersey from Manhattan?
Not to nitpick because I agree with some of your points..but Goldman and many other financial institutions actually have very sizable offices in NJ. Not 15 miles in, but yeah..
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  #1414  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 8:38 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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Originally Posted by moorhosj View Post
The point is that every form of transportation in the entire region exists to move people to the downtown area (see every "L" and Metra line). This by definition makes it more available to more people, increasing the employee pool. Dallas and Atlanta rely on their huge highway system to move people. They have pretty much maxed that out and are now trying to build the same train infrastructure Chicago already has.

As an example, my company is headquartered in the West Loop, and have a software development office in Naperville. We are having a very hard time finding young developers who want to live in (or commute to) Naperville. Thus, we are moving more developer jobs to our downtown office.
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Originally Posted by OrdoSeclorum View Post
I kind of don't understand the point you are trying to make in this series of comments. Are you suggesting that the suburbs and the city are the same? That there aren't significant differences between them related to operations?

If you have an office in Deerfield, you can recruit people within a 45-minute drive from Deerfield, perhaps two million people. If you have an office in the Loop, you can recruit people from the entire metro area. This is self-evident. Is it something you disagree with? If you have an office in Naperville, it's not as easy to recruit young college grads as it is if you have an office in the West Loop. Is this something you disagree with? If you need to meet with your marketing consultant, banker, lawyer or entertain colleagues from out of town, it's easier to do these things if they are within a few miles. This can be deduced from first-priciples. Is it something you disagree with?

These are the reasons why corporations frequently explicitly cite for why they are moving downtown. They are the reasons economists say activities in city centers are typically more productive than auto-oriented edge-cities. Are you suggesting that there is and interesting and counter-intuitive reason for investment in the city and everyone is lying about it for no reason?
My head hurts now. How can anyone not understand the concept you both have laid out?
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  #1415  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 11:00 PM
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F1 Tommy F1 Tommy is offline
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Jesus, my main point is moving FTD 15 miles east will make little difference to the company or it's bottom line or the local metro Chicago economy. They already have employees living near Downers Grove, so commute times will not be cut and the employees they have will be pissed off. 2 pages of "opinions" do not change that fact. Chicago needs to stop doing what the suburbs did during the great exodus from the city, poaching local companies. Chicago needs to look outside the state and country for prospects.
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  #1416  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 11:02 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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do you work for FTD? do you recruit for them?

As far as I can tell FTD made this decision, so the company apparently thinks this makes sense.
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  #1417  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 11:35 PM
Kngkyle Kngkyle is offline
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Originally Posted by F1 Tommy View Post
Chicago needs to stop doing what the suburbs did during the great exodus from the city, poaching local companies. Chicago needs to look outside the state and country for prospects.
Chicago isn't doing anything. Companies are voting with their own feet.
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  #1418  
Old Posted May 10, 2018, 11:56 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is offline
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Originally Posted by F1 Tommy View Post
Jesus, my main point is moving FTD 15 miles east will make little difference to the company or it's bottom line or the local metro Chicago economy. They already have employees living near Downers Grove, so commute times will not be cut and the employees they have will be pissed off. 2 pages of "opinions" do not change that fact. Chicago needs to stop doing what the suburbs did during the great exodus from the city, poaching local companies. Chicago needs to look outside the state and country for prospects.
Lol, because you aren't reading what others are saying. If you look at the study from the economics textbook I posted it clearly states that the benefits gained from locating in industry clusters halves with every mile out of the core you locate. That means that FTD only receives 0.012% of the benefits of being located in an urban area by locating 13 miles from the core. In other words if locating downtown adds $100 to their business plan, they only get $0.012 boost for locating in Downers Grove instead.

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Originally Posted by marothisu View Post
Not to nitpick because I agree with some of your points..but Goldman and many other financial institutions actually have very sizable offices in NJ. Not 15 miles in, but yeah..
I know that, but it's still centrally located, in fact, their backoffice is located right next to many other back offices for financial firms that don't need to be in Manhattan. So in that sense, it actually makes more sense to locate that Goldman office in Jersey because it's more central to an industry cluster for financial firm back offices. But move their actual HQ deep into Jersey? They would immediately fall apart as talent just chooses to go to other companies still in Manhattan.
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  #1419  
Old Posted May 11, 2018, 12:27 AM
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F1 Tommy F1 Tommy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LouisVanDerWright View Post
Lol, because you aren't reading what others are saying. If you look at the study from the economics textbook I posted it clearly states that the benefits gained from locating in industry clusters halves with every mile out of the core you locate. That means that FTD only receives 0.012% of the benefits of being located in an urban area by locating 13 miles from the core. In other words if locating downtown adds $100 to their business plan, they only get $0.012 boost for locating in Downers Grove instead.

Well with that kind of thinking United Airlines should vacate Willis tower and go back to Elk Grove as the local aviation industry is mainly located around O'Hare.(I do not want that but just pointing out why that theory is partly flawed).

Look I get you want as many headquarters to locate downtown as possible, and I also like that idea. But Chicago needs to put most of it's attention into getting companies from other states and countries. The city is encouraging and trying very hard to get companies to move from the suburbs. Since we are in a free market that is fine, but it is not a net gain for the Chicago area when they move.
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Old Posted May 11, 2018, 12:38 AM
ChiMIchael ChiMIchael is offline
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Join Date: May 2009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F1 Tommy View Post
Well with that kind of thinking United Airlines should vacate Willis tower and go back to Elk Grove as the local aviation industry is mainly located around O'Hare.(I do not want that but just pointing out why that theory is partly flawed).

Look I get you want as many headquarters to locate downtown as possible, and I also like that idea. But Chicago needs to put most of it's attention into getting companies from other states and countries. The city is encouraging and trying very hard to get companies to move from the suburbs. Since we are in a free market that is fine, but it is not a net gain for the Chicago area when they move.

I think Chicago has to build more fast-growing innovative companies from the ground up if the city every want to achieve real economic expansion.
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