Confederation Line East LRT Extension (Stage 2) [Blair to Trim] | U/C

[eternallyme]

Of those stations, it is the stations beyond Place d'Orleans that are excessive. However, that is in a future phase anyway, so they might as well just protect the corridor in case they are warranted in the future.

Between Blair and Place d'Orleans, the first recommendation is to add a station accessible from Jasmine Crescent to serve the Beacon Hill South community. The station for Montreal Road should be a little farther east as well, to be easily accessible from Canotek Road. Jeanne d'Arc is exactly where it should be (maximize access from all sides) and Orleans Boulevard, if built (debatable), is also where it should be to access from both sides.

Since the Champlain Street overpass will require replacement anyway if the rail stays in the median, it might be best to shift to the south side for Place d'Orleans and build under or on what is now the bus station (or somewhere more central to the site)?

In this section, all stations should have centre-loading platforms.

[waterloowarrior]

http://ottawa.ca/en/city-hall/public...21-and-23-2015

Open Houses - April 20, 21 and 23, 2015
Monday, April 20, 2015
Community Pentecostal Church
1825 St. Joseph Boulevard, Orléans

Tuesday, April 21, 2015
R. J. Kennedy Community Centre
Hall A & B, 1115 Dunning Road, Cumberland

Thursday, April 23, 2015
Clarence Creek Community Hall
418 Lemay Street, Clarence Creek

6 to 9 p.m., presentation at 7 p.m.

You are invited to the final Open Houses to review and provide feedback on the recommendations for these two environmental assessment (EA) studies. The Confederation Line East LRT Extension study is following the Transit Projects Assessment Process and the OR174 and Prescott-Russell County Road 17 (CR17) corridor is under the Municipal Class EA process for a Schedule 'C' project.

Open House presentation and displays will include:

• Functional design of the preferred integrated LRT and OR174 widening west of Trim Road
• Functional design of the widening of OR 174 and CR 17 east of Trim Road
• Summary of comments and responses from the February 2015 consultation
• Next steps

[waterloowarrior]

April 2015 display boards
http://ottawa.ca/en/city-hall/public...21-and-23-2015

[1overcosc]

It appears they've gotten some sense for the station spacing.

While not being built right away, the design will protect for a future infill station at Jasmine.

One of the excessively closely spaced stations in Orleans will be eliminated. The 4 planned stations east of Place D'Orleans have been consolidated down to 3 (the Taylor Creek & Tenth Line stations consolidated into a single station in between the two).

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

It appears they've gotten some sense for the station spacing.

While not being built right away, the design will protect for a future infill station at Jasmine.

Jasmine-Later rather than Jasmine-Now goes to show, yet again, how LRT is not being designed with inside-the-greenbelt residents' needs in mind, at all.

It's all about the burbs, bout the burbs, bout the burbs.

One of the excessively closely spaced stations in Orleans will be eliminated. The 4 planned stations east of Place D'Orleans have been consolidated down to 3 (the Taylor Creek & Tenth Line stations consolidated into a single station in between the two).

Ugh. I'd rather a single station at Tenth Line than an "in between" one. We're finally fixing some of the problems with transit stations that aren't actually at major cross-streets, which allow for better local-RT transfers; why would we build new errors into the system?

[MountainView]

What I find super disappointing is that there is no station at Jasmine Crescent. There is already numerous highrises there and the 12 (I believe) already circles that neighbourhood and has high ridership. Yes, it would be close to Blair Station but it can't be any closer than Orleans Blvd and Place d'Orleans Stations. Also...I know its far out but they can't name those stations 'Orleans Blvd' and 'Place d'Orleans'. They sound too similar to me (or maybe it's just me).

[1overcosc]

They'll figure out something for naming eventually. All the names are placeholders at this point. Remember how originally Lyon & Parliament were called 'Downtown West' and 'Downtown East' during the planning process?

My vote would be to keep Place D'Orleans as is, and name the Orleans Boulevard station either:
1) "Bilberry" after nearby Bilberry Park & Bilberry Creek
2) "Convent Glen" after the area

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by MountainView

What I find super disappointing is that there is no station at Jasmine Crescent. There is already numerous highrises there and the 12 (I believe) already circles that neighbourhood and has high ridership. Yes, it would be close to Blair Station but it can't be any closer than Orleans Blvd and Place d'Orleans Stations.

At least they're protecting for a Jasmine station. That's very new, it's only just become apparent that they're doing this.

Someone probably pointed out the need, the city realized "Oh, ya, it's a good idea!" but didn't want to raise the budget to build it now.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by MountainView

What I find super disappointing is that there is no station at Jasmine Crescent. There is already numerous highrises there and the 12 (I believe) already circles that neighbourhood and has high ridership. Yes, it would be close to Blair Station but it can't be any closer than Orleans Blvd and Place d'Orleans Stations. Also...I know its far out but they can't name those stations 'Orleans Blvd' and 'Place d'Orleans'. They sound too similar to me (or maybe it's just me).

Yeah, I think they are going to have to re-think the names, which are probably just provisional at this point anyway.

[MoreTrains]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

Jasmine-Later rather than Jasmine-Now goes to show, yet again, how LRT is not being designed with inside-the-greenbelt residents' needs in mind, at all.

It's all about the burbs, bout the burbs, bout the burbs.

Always will be until you become the Mayor. Id vote for you... you gonna run 3 years from now? Its quite dissappointing they havent done anything anywhere else. And its not just the burbs, its Orleans, Orleans is the spoiled child of the city.

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

Ugh. I'd rather a single station at Tenth Line than an "in between" one. We're finally fixing some of the problems with transit stations that aren't actually at major cross-streets, which allow for better local-RT transfers; why would we build new errors into the system?

A single station at 10th line would mean having to climb up that hill though, and we all know how lazy people are (even though they will be taking a bus or driving up it. I believe that the 'in-between' stop gives the perception of not having to climb it.

I am still really dissappointed that they are building out to the spoiled child instead of building to allow for intensification (Main example being twinning the Trillium Line, Secondary being the creation of better transit down bank).

[1overcosc]

Orleans is important to get political support for Phase 2. It's a swing seat in federal & provincial elections, and they're vocal about what they want.

[c_speed3108]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

Orleans is important to get political support for Phase 2. It's a swing seat in federal & provincial elections, and they're vocal about what they want.

This.


Plus, Orleans has had the highest transit ridership in the city so in a certain sense Orleans residents have earned being the first suburb to get connected up to the system.

Furthermore, originally it was planned to build a second transitway out to Orleans south of Innes Rd. Thanks in part to the council member for Cumberland that plan has been traded for LRT sooner with the second route shelved to some date long in the future.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by c_speed3108

This.

Plus, Orleans has had the highest transit ridership in the city so in a certain sense Orleans residents have earned being the first suburb to get connected up to the system.

Furthermore, originally it was planned to build a second transitway out to Orleans south of Innes Rd. Thanks in part to the council member for Cumberland that plan has been traded for LRT sooner with the second route shelved to some date long in the future.

It'll still get built before there are any meaningful improvements to transit for people who actually live in the older parts of the city.

[eternallyme]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

Orleans is important to get political support for Phase 2. It's a swing seat in federal & provincial elections, and they're vocal about what they want.

Agreed the Jasmine Crescent station (call it Beacon Hill Station) should be built immediately.

Right now, Jasmine Crescent is served by Route 12, and ridership is very high there. From about 1999 to 2004, it was removed from Jasmine and a local route ran on it instead which was not popular. Even though the deviation is not desirable from an operational perspective for a core route, it is warranted based on ridership. If the LRT was brought to their steps, Route 12 (or at least most trips on it) would no longer need to operate on Jasmine, since they could walk to the train easily as well, which is also a quicker route downtown.

As for the political makeup, Orleans is the ultimate swing seat in Ottawa at all levels of government. It can also swing wildly as we have seen in recent elections as well. Most of the inner city seats are solidly Liberal (although the NDP is competitive downtown). Redistribution will make Kanata and Barrhaven much more important as they are no longer in safe Conservative seats with the rural areas peeled away...

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by c_speed3108

This.


Plus, Orleans has had the highest transit ridership in the city so in a certain sense Orleans residents have earned being the first suburb to get connected up to the system.

Furthermore, originally it was planned to build a second transitway out to Orleans south of Innes Rd. Thanks in part to the council member for Cumberland that plan has been traded for LRT sooner with the second route shelved to some date long in the future.

The second rapid transit route in Orleans will be needed. That is the direction of new development. The proposed LRT route really only serves the older parts of Orleans well. Also, with the western LRT extension branched, we will need to balance that in the east end as well. This is all about serving the public well.

I must say though that I not that thrilled with the location with the southern rapid transit route. We are developing Innes Road as the main commercial street in Orleans and here we go again, having rapid transit bypass it. Route 94 is developing good ridership but that depends as much on it following Innes Road as anything else. I may be wrong, but my understanding is that the rapid transit route will also bypass Blackburn Hamlet altogether. That seems like a big mistake. There is even room for LRT through Blackburn Hamlet as the Innes Road right of way allows for a wider road that will never be built as a result of opening of the bypass road. Of course, we are determined to build 100% right of way separation and that will never work in Blackburn Hamlet, which demands something more integrated into the community.

I also favour Jasmine station, with good walking connectivity. What is next to the Jasmine high rises, but a high school, public library, swimming pool, arena and seniors centre.

[Dundas]

Maybe they are avoiding jasmine so that the train remains clean and free of graffiti

[1overcosc]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

The second rapid transit route in Orleans will be needed. That is the direction of new development. The proposed LRT route really only serves the older parts of Orleans well. Also, with the western LRT extension branched, we will need to balance that in the east end as well. This is all about serving the public well.

Agreed. The northern route is already well served by the Highway 174 BRT. Converting it will only cut down travel times by one or two minutes and for 90% of riders it won't even remove a transfer.. just relocate it.

The branching issue is probably going to be dealt with by having one of the two western branches short-turn at Tremblay, knowing the way the city works.

If I were in charge, I would have transferred that money to double track the Trillium Line which is the most glaringly obvious improvement required.

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

I must say though that I not that thrilled with the location with the southern rapid transit route. We are developing Innes Road as the main commercial street in Orleans and here we go again, having rapid transit bypass it. Route 94 is developing good ridership but that depends as much on it following Innes Road as anything else. I may be wrong, but my understanding is that the rapid transit route will also bypass Blackburn Hamlet altogether. That seems like a big mistake. There is even room for LRT through Blackburn Hamlet as the Innes Road right of way allows for a wider road that will never be built as a result of opening of the bypass road. Of course, we are determined to build 100% right of way separation and that will never work in Blackburn Hamlet, which demands something more integrated into the community.

Agreed again! On-street LRT directly on Innes including in Blackburn would be preferred. Given how low traffic volumes are through Blackburn Hamlet (most traffic uses the bypass), it could even be mixed-traffic LRT through Blackburn if required.

Such a plan also has another attractive element: As an interim step, the city could add limited-stop express service to the route (potentially replacing the 94 depending on stop spacing) and install some transit priority at traffic lights. This isn't really possible with a new route on a separate ROW.

[JM1]

What I don't get is why the West End is getting a Baseline connector to connect two branches of their LRT (so total, BRT + 2 LRT branches) while the East End gets a single LRT line. We need a Montreal Road or Hemlock/Montreal Road LRT that connects Blair to Rideau and we need an Innes Road/South Orlean LRT or BRT.

[GoTrans]

Originally Posted by JM1

What I don't get is why the West End is getting a Baseline connector to connect two branches of their LRT (so total, BRT + 2 LRT branches) while the East End gets a single LRT line. We need a Montreal Road or Hemlock/Montreal Road LRT that connects Blair to Rideau and we need an Innes Road/South Orlean LRT or BRT.

I wouldn't complain; after years of neglect LRT is finally being built. You might think that you are hard done by but Orleans is in a much better position than Kanata which gets no LRT or O Train service along the former CN irght of way. It is only the built up area inside the old city of Ottawa that has the short split after Lincoln Fields to Baseline and Bayshore. You will benefit from higher frequency then either Bayshore or Baseline. The first line plus the Trillium line cannot create a network. They are only the starting blocks. You have no right to complain because everything on your wish list has not been included in Stage 1 or Stage 2.

[Mikeed]

The fact that Orleans has the highest transit usage in the city and converting the majority of that to significantly cheaper mode of transit could save a 100 million in operating expenses every year (from OCtranspo's current 478m budget). Orleans is in the best setup for saving the most in operating expenses which would free up more busses for other areas. (to feed this awesome metro were building)

Though the Confederation Line will significantly eat up most of Ottawa's capital spending till mid-century it makes no sense really to double down on a new moderately expensive BRT r.o.w and double the volume of expensive to operate BRT in the area that uses transit most in a very straight forward way (Orleans > DT). (projects like the $$$ Baseline transit way are of utmost concern atm) (fully funded by Ott)

That would just put a lot more pressure on an already very high transit cost city wide and will eat into ridership. (possibly creating a negative feedback loop)

EDIT: yes that 100m is just a place holder, but you get the idea.