London Public Transit

[haljackey]

Originally Posted by van Hemessen

GRT expansion including possibility of more express lines:

If this is all it takes to expand bus service shouldn't it be just as easy in London? City hall needs to change from a "no" council to a "yes" council.

London really lacks when it comes to transportation.

Do you have a freeway? No.
Do you have even traffic flow? No.
Do you have a connected pedestrian path system? No.
Do you have a connected bike network? No.
Do you have express buses? No.
Do you have bus rapid transit? No.
Do you have light rail transit? No.
Do you have plans for any of this? No.

BRT may come, but it won't be true BRT. Bike lanes are only added when road widenings / reconstruction happens, which does not make for a well connected bike network. No freeway plans. No express bus plans.

Ok enough whining. Let's get our newly elected government to go from "no" council to a "yes" council when it comes to transportation. Cutting funding for the LTC isn't the greatest place to start...

[Kokkei Mizu]

There are already bus connections to St. Thomas. Don't know if Dorchester has anything, but I wouldn't be surprised if Aboutown went out there as well.

[Simpseatles]

Originally Posted by Kokkei Mizu

Don't know if Dorchester has anything, but I wouldn't be surprised if Aboutown went out there as well.

Nope, they don't. A huge 500 home subdivision was just proposed near my house, so the demand will only increase.

[haljackey]

Well the route to Saint Thomas isn't an LTC route so I don't count it.

At least we don't have a system like the GTA. Friends of mine who live there say they have to pay double fare when they cross city boundaries. For example if they need to get from Toronto to Vaughan they have to pay fare for the TTC and then fare for Vaughan's transit system. Just because there's a fictional line. Toronto should just swallow the GTA cities/regions so it all becomes one big mess of a city. Maybe that way they can straighten their heads when it comes to transit.

Or why not make one all-encompassing system like Grand River Transit in K-W? Stupid. Hope London doesn't end up like this.

[manny_santos]

The Aboutown service is not promoted, and it is obscenely expensive. I think it's $15 each way. Almost as much as a Greyhound bus to Detroit.

[Simpseatles]

I just remembered that when I was in Sudbury last summer, I noticed even they had a central bus terminal! Sudbury!

I think we should compile a list of cities smaller than London (in Canada), that have central bus terminals for public transit! I wonder how many there are?

[manny_santos]

Originally Posted by Simpseatles

I just remembered that when I was in Sudbury last summer, I noticed even they had a central bus terminal! Sudbury!

I think we should compile a list of cities smaller than London (in Canada), that have central bus terminals for public transit! I wonder how many there are?

Brantford also comes to mind for me.

[manny_santos]

My morning bus didn't show up this morning. It was freaking cold.

[haljackey]

Originally Posted by Simpseatles

I just remembered that when I was in Sudbury last summer, I noticed even they had a central bus terminal! Sudbury!

I think we should compile a list of cities smaller than London (in Canada), that have central bus terminals for public transit! I wonder how many there are?

Even Guelph has put in plans for a transit terminal: http://guelph.ca/remastered/?p=1086

How sad. Our city needs to take some action.

Of course the public does not want the buses off Dundas... change is bad for most people.

Sorry about your bus. My morning bus was pretty late today too.

[MrSlippery519]

Originally Posted by manny_santos

Brantford also comes to mind for me.

That was the first one that came to mind for me as well, my buddy's girlfriend went to school there and I was shocked when she told me they had a bus terminal.

I really do not understand why people want the buses to run on Dundas, I certainly get the fact for some people it means walking an extra block but in the long run it would dramatically help the downtown area. If they did this in conjunction with a central bus terminal (someone mentioned King and Clarence) it would be a great plan.

[manny_santos]

Originally Posted by MrSlippery519

That was the first one that came to mind for me as well, my buddy's girlfriend went to school there and I was shocked when she told me they had a bus terminal.

I really do not understand why people want the buses to run on Dundas, I certainly get the fact for some people it means walking an extra block but in the long run it would dramatically help the downtown area. If they did this in conjunction with a central bus terminal (someone mentioned King and Clarence) it would be a great plan.

Taking buses off Dundas means the Downtown Rotten Ronnie's crowd (demographics including the Scream 'N' Swears, the Teenage Octomoms, and London Dope Users) have to walk an extra block to get to McDonald's.

If I were Shmuel Farhi, I'd be pissed right now.

[ForestryW]

Peterborough has a central bus terminal...population of about 85,000 (city). The lot at King/Clarence is way too small for such a terminal (the K-W Charles Street terminal takes up a whole block). The only spots I can think of that would be big enough are Talbot/York (on top of Tim's and across from the Greyhound terminal), or the Queen/Talbot/Fullarton/Ridout block.

[Wharn]

Originally Posted by haljackey

Well the route to Saint Thomas isn't an LTC route so I don't count it.
Toronto should just swallow the GTA cities/regions so it all becomes one big mess of a city. Maybe that way they can straighten their heads when it comes to transit.

Very bad idea, it's already painfully obvious that Toronto is experiencing major diseconomies of scale providing most city services. Amalgamating the city further would just turn it into a completely dysfunctional entity. However, that being said, I think it would be a good idea to create a regional transit authority and dissolve the TTC, but leave the separate cities to deal with their own problems.

Actually, it'd be a good idea to de-amalgamate Toronto back into its former constituant cities, but that's another discussion for another board section.

[welcome]

I was wondering why people in London want a transit terminal? Is London lacking service because of no terminal?

[bolognium]

Originally Posted by van Hemessen

Peterborough has a central bus terminal...population of about 85,000 (city). The lot at King/Clarence is way too small for such a terminal (the K-W Charles Street terminal takes up a whole block). The only spots I can think of that would be big enough are Talbot/York (on top of Tim's and across from the Greyhound terminal), or the Queen/Talbot/Fullarton/Ridout block.

I actually made a post comparing a few blocks in London to Charles Street Terminal. I figure our terminal would be equal to or slightly smaller than Kitchener's because Charles deals with a ton of buses and doubles as a Greyhound depot. Anyway here's the post:

Originally Posted by bolognium

There are a few surface parking lots that would be perfect for a downtown terminal, but I don't think the Wick lot would be large enough. I'm assuming the London terminal would be roughly the same size as Kitchener's Charles Street Terminal so I did a couple Google Map comparisons. There might be better areas, but I'm looking for locations that would require very little expropriation.




This is Kitchener's Charles Street Terminal. Like Manny said about Brantford's terminal, the Charles terminal also doubles as the City's Greyhound terminal. As you can see, it's quite large, serving as a central hub for many of K-W's buses.




At the top of this image is the parking lot on Clarence across from the Galleria. This lot is also a little on the small side, but it is VERY central. It is basically in the centre of downtown making everything fairly accessible. This would be my first pick as it would add much needed pedestrian traffic to this part of the core. The lots directly across King at the bottom of this image would also be a very good location for a terminal.




Another delicious spot for a terminal would be the large lot across from Laser Quest and Cousin Vinny's. However, with the new Shopper's Drug Mart development I'm not sure how much of this lot will be left available for the terminal. Again, the lot is very central and extremely close to Richmond St.




This lot on York Street is directly across from the Convention Centre. This lot isn't as central as the above locations, but it is quite large and very accessible for buses.




This last lot is on Fullerton near the courthouse. Again, not as central as the earlier locations, but it is fairly large and would require no expropriation.



I really don't see us getting a downtown terminal any time soon because London just loves its desolate-looking surface parking, but it's still fun to play city planner from time to time

[manny_santos]

There was a proposal many years ago for a transit hub that would've been located on the north side of Horton Street, I believe near Clarence. It would've served Greyhound and London Transit.

I think Wellington and York is a good spot. More central than anything along Horton.

[Snark]

Originally Posted by bolognium

I actually made a post comparing a few blocks in London to Charles Street Terminal. I figure our terminal would be equal to or slightly smaller than Kitchener's because Charles deals with a ton of buses and doubles as a Greyhound depot. Anyway here's the post:

The bus terminal in Kitchener was built in the mid-eighties to service an urban population of about 225,000. Any terminal for London would have to be significantly larger than the current Kitchener terminal.

Besides, all you guys are mayor Joe supporters! What happened to cut cut cut?

[ForestryW]

Originally Posted by bolognium

I actually made a post comparing a few blocks in London to Charles Street Terminal. I figure our terminal would be equal to or slightly smaller than Kitchener's because Charles deals with a ton of buses and doubles as a Greyhound depot. Anyway here's the post:

Missed that post earlier; all good points.

Any terminal in London would have to include a cafe to rival Transfers' coffee

[haljackey]

Originally Posted by Snark

Besides, all you guys are mayor Joe supporters! What happened to cut cut cut?

Not to get too political, but I'm sure Joe understands the need for a bus terminal and the economic benefits it brings to the downtown.

Plan now. When his term is up, we can then afford it.

[ssiguy]

I always thought the only option was Richmond & Clarence but , very happily due to the new Shopper;s that is no longer an option.
One spot I never really considered was the one at Clarence & King. Actually that would be ideal. Next to the Galleria and Market and there is that little alley from Dundas that cuts thru it..........the one where the street kids are. It could be turned into a lovely little alley with a few restaurants and greatly enhance the area.