OKLAHOMA CITY | Legends Tower | 1,907 FT | 134 FLOORS | VISION

[Shakespeare2016]

Originally Posted by G.Walker

I remember when the Devon Tower was proposed, and we heard the same rhetoric. "This will never get built". "This won't happen in Oklahoma City". "We are about to go into a recession, this will never happen".

so we will see...

Well at least OKC gets things done though there is pessimism. In my city nothing gets done and mostly because of pessimism.

[Spocket]

Originally Posted by MAC123

Wow that's crazy. That's whole lot of nothing backed up by even more nothing.

Okay, then explain the economics of it to us, then. I mean, the economics don't work anywhere in the world but for some reason you think they work in a place where it costs a fraction of whatever this costs to build a campus style development. Explain why any company would pay $1200+ a square foot when they could build their own tower for a fraction of that and also get the kind of space they need in a tower tailor made for said needs. You can rent at under 20 bucks a square foot in Devon Energy Tower in a city with a third of its office space empty but you think there's any economic sense whatsoever in building a tower where rents would need to be a multiple of that number. I don't know, then,...you tell me: would YOU build this thing in OKC? Would you build this anywhere, for that matter?

If you think this will ever actually get built then I have a bridge I want to sell you.

[Hot Rod]

The three 35+ floor towers WILL BE BUILT, 2 residential towers and a DREAM hotel. Done deal.

Tower 3 which is now being VISIONED as a supertall dream is just that, but it likely also WILL BE BUILT just to a lower scale.

That is why this master development being phased, towers 1,2 and hotel tower 4 are being built, for sure; funding's already there. Construction set to begin by June. Tower 3's height will be determined by how well tower 1 and 2 lease. I personally am hoping for at least a 1,000 footer. OKC is on a verge of it's next downtown building boom, highlighted by the $1.3B+ replacement of Paycom Center, this project, and a new multipurpose Soccer stadium.

To those arguing, OKC already has a very dense downtown skyline in it's core CBD area. These new projects extend that dense core out a bit. I agree that we should encourage expansion of the CBD density but with the location of the new arena that wont be possible; so 'new' density areas will be built instead in W Bricktown, S Bricktown, and near and between the two parks (Myriad Botanical Gardens and Scissortail Park), and continued infill in Northern and Western downtown neighborhoods.

Hopefully the new arena site itself (currently the COX/Prarie Surf Media center) can be developed with more than just the arena (think LA Live type developemnt) which would expand the existing CBD density but that's no guarantee.

[Dale]

^ With all this development assured, what’s your prognosis for the Ford lots ?

[Hot Rod]

the REHCO lots between the two parks is another situation, those developers are not as bullish on highrise development as the Boardwalk. They hold arguably the most valuable lands in all of Oklahoma yet there's no current plans for the REHCO/Ford lands.

I suspect once the aformentioned arena district/Boardwalk at Bricktown (sans the supertall)/Multipurpose Soccer stadium all get going into next year - we'd likely see movement on the REHCO lands, in addition to the decommissioning of Paycom Center and redevelopment there.

That's not necessarily a bad thing because if they had developed those lands years ago we'd likely not have the quality development (and height) that we WILL likely have moving forward. Case in point, there are two key lots in the CBD area currently proposed for a 5 floor workforce housing (Alley's End at EK Gaylord and 4th) and a 8 floor housing proposed next to the Omni Hotel along OKC Blvd (Boulevard Place, that was SUPPOSED to wrap the OKC CC Parking garage). BOTH of these projects are small potatoes compared to what should be going on those prominent locations; this is why Im happy REHCO lands is taking the organic approach - we should see significant towers instead of low and mid-rise infill.

[Dale]

Originally Posted by Hot Rod

the REHCO lots between the two parks is another situation, those developers are not as bullish on highrise development as the Boardwalk. They hold arguably the most valuable lands in all of Oklahoma yet there's no current plans for the REHCO/Ford lands.

I suspect once the aformentioned arena district/Boardwalk at Bricktown (sans the supertall)/Multipurpose Soccer stadium all get going into next year - we'd likely see movement on the REHCO lands, in addition to the decommissioning of Paycom Center and redevelopment there.

That's not necessarily a bad thing because if they had developed those lands years ago we'd likely not have the quality development (and height) that we WILL likely have moving forward. Case in point, there are two key lots in the CBD area currently proposed for a 5 floor workforce housing (Alley's End at EK Gaylord and 4th) and a 8 floor housing proposed next to the Omni Hotel along OKC Blvd (Boulevard Place, that was SUPPOSED to wrap the OKC CC Parking garage). BOTH of these projects are small potatoes compared to what should be going on those prominent locations; this is why Im happy REHCO lands is taking the organic approach - we should see significant towers instead of low and mid-rise infill.

Thanks for the insight. The future is bright for OKC!

Sidenote: I first visited OKC in 1993. And even then the CBD has appreciable density. It’s one of those cities I expected to dislike and ended up liking.

[jackster99]

I'm surprised ArchGuy1 hasn't asked if this will have an observation deck yet.

[Dale]

Originally Posted by jackster99

I'm surprised ArchGuy1 hasn't asked if this will have an observation deck yet.

There was a poster on UP who wanted an Asian-style vertical mall in every high rise.

[Hot Rod]

yes, it does have a very under-appreciatedly dense cbd core that prior to Devon was accused of not having height. Post Devon, OKC got accused of having a disconnected beautiful supertall that "belonged" in NY or Chicago. That's all mute now with BOK Park Plaza tower built to balance out that part of the skyline, and the new announcements should give OKC a sort of Charlotte effect that hopefully will put to rest the criticisms and allow OKC to be, OKC worthy of highrises/supertall(s).

[BnaBreaker]

I could certainly see the hotel and entertainment complex components being built given the new arena supposedly going in next door, and maybe a scaled down version of one of the condo towers, but two 30+ story condo towers? How much demand even is there for residential space in downtown OKC? Apparently not much given the near total lack of new residential construction in that neighborhood.

I'm not even touching the vision for the supposed 1,700 foot apartment tower. I mean I wish nothing but the best for Oklahoma City, and I certainly understand the excitement a concept like this might generate there. But we've got to be realistic here, and the reality is that aside from there being apparently limited demand for urban residential in the downtown area, the Oklahoma City economy is seeing relatively modest, if not slow growth at the moment. So call me pessimistic, or a hater, or whatever, but let's just be nice and say I have my doubts about the likelihood of such a tower getting built there by any company, much less one with effectively zero experience building highrises, and little more than a LinkedIn page in terms of online presence.

[Shakespeare2016]

Originally Posted by Dale

Thanks for the insight. The future is bright for OKC!

Sidenote: I first visited OKC in 1993. And even then the CBD has appreciable density. It’s one of those cities I expected to dislike and ended up liking.

I would love to OKC there but I am afraid of leaving my family behind.

[Dale]

Originally Posted by BnaBreaker

I could certainly see the hotel and entertainment complex components being built given the new arena supposedly going in next door, and maybe a scaled down version of one of the condo towers, but two 30+ story condo towers? How much demand even is there for residential space in downtown OKC? Apparently not much given the near total lack of new residential construction in that neighborhood.

I'm not even touching the vision for the supposed 1,700 foot apartment tower. I mean I wish nothing but the best for Oklahoma City, and I certainly understand the excitement a concept like this might generate there. But we've got to be realistic here, and the reality is that aside from there being apparently limited demand for urban residential in the downtown area, the Oklahoma City economy is seeing relatively modest, if not slow growth at the moment. So call me pessimistic, or a hater, or whatever, but let's just be nice and say I have my doubts about the likelihood of such a tower getting built there by any company, much less one with effectively zero experience building highrises, and little more than a LinkedIn page in terms of online presence.

From Hot Rod post #123 …

“The three 35+ floor towers WILL BE BUILT, 2 residential towers and a DREAM hotel. Done deal.

Tower 3 which is now being VISIONED as a supertall dream is just that, but it likely also WILL BE BUILT just to a lower scale.”

My note: the project has been awarded substantial TIF incentives as well.

Hey, if Nashville can build 50 towers why can’t OKC build 3 ?

[BnaBreaker]

Originally Posted by Dale

From Hot Rod post #123 …

“The three 35+ floor towers WILL BE BUILT, 2 residential towers and a DREAM hotel. Done deal.

Tower 3 which is now being VISIONED as a supertall dream is just that, but it likely also WILL BE BUILT just to a lower scale.”

My note: the project has been awarded substantial TIF incentives as well.

Hey, if Nashville can build 50 towers why can’t OKC build 3 ?

I don't know, his enthusiasm just struck me as sort of hopeful optimism rather than any real insider knowledge. I mean, hopefully I'm wrong! It'd be cool to see some new highrise construction in Oklahoma City. I'm skeptical though because the developer seems to have little to no experience, and there doesn't really appear to be any demand for such a megaproject in Oklahoma City. I mean have there been any residential buildings higher than five stories built in Oklahoma City in the past decade? Devon Tower is different because it was an office tower that had a single corporate entity backing it and committing to fill it. And we both know that a percentage of dedicated funding being in place and an aspirational construction start date in no way means it is definitely moving forward.

I'm rooting for it, but this just has the feel of all those countless other gaudy proposals with cartoonish renderings just designed to make a splash and garner attention for a newbie developer (remember that Marina City tower proposed in Nashville like twelve years ago that was designed to look like a sailboat? lol) But obviously that's just pure speculation on my part. We'll see, I guess!

[G.Walker]

I am from Oklahoma City and been following this project closely. I guess what people from Oklahoma City don't realize is that this project has been in the works since June 2021. So this is not something that just popped off overnight. There has been a lot going on behind the scenes, and the developer Matteson is not by himself. This is actually an venture with local developer Randy Hogan. Randy Hogan has countless successfull developments around OKC. They have already changed the design several times, and the City Council has already approved $200M TIF for the project. Do I think the supertall will get built? Probably not, but the first phase with three 350ft high rises will happen, funding and approval is already in place.

There are also alot of major developments going in OKC right now that outsiders don't really know about. The Half, OAK, The Citizen, Convergence, & OKANA are all big projects currently under construction.

So don't be so quick to judge OKC from afar, take it from someone who is actually living here and breathing the air.

[BnaBreaker]

Originally Posted by G.Walker

I am from Oklahoma City and been following this project closely. I guess what people from Oklahoma City don't realize is that this project has been in the works since June 2021. So this is not something that just popped off overnight. There has been a lot going on behind the scenes, and the developer Matteson is not by himself. This is actually an venture with local developer Randy Hogan. Randy Hogan has countless successfull developments around OKC. They have already changed the design several times, and the City Council has already approved $200M TIF for the project. Do I think the supertall will get built? Probably not, but the first phase with three 350ft high rises will happen, funding and approval is already in place.

There are also alot of major developments going in OKC right now that outsiders don't really know about. The Half, OAK, The Citizen, Convergence, & OKANA are all big projects currently under construction.

So don't be so quick to judge OKC from afar, take it from someone who is actually living here and breathing the air.

I'm not sure any of those projects listed should really be considered a "major" development for a city the size of OKC, and so far as I can tell, only one of them (the 12 story Citizen) is actually downtown, which to me kind of supports my point about whether the demand is there for a project of this magnitude. But anyway, I've given my two cents, so I'll shut up. And like I said, I'm really not trying to be a negative nancy. I'm rooting for it to happen, and I do hope I'm wrong, but it's just not adding up to me. Let's hope this Randy Hogan guy can get it done! Fingers crossed!

[Dale]

Does anyone remember if there was a lot of naysaying here when Devon Tower was proposed ? As I recall, it was proposed at 925’ and got built at around 850’.

And then outsiders complained it was too tall for OKC.

[Shakespeare2016]

Originally Posted by Dale

Does anyone remember if there was a lot of naysaying here when Devon Tower was proposed ? As I recall, it was proposed at 925’ and got built at around 850’.

And then outsiders complained it was too tall for OKC.

Devon Tower is nice even if it is too tall for OKC skyline. The proposed tower imo should be like 80 stories and 1,100 feet tall and a separate tower that is 50 stories and 700 feet tall to balance the skyline.

[Hot Rod]

LOTS of neisayers for the Devon Tower and that was 13 years ago. Nowhere we are with OKC in a bit of a population boom with multiple projects u/c or approved; and more naysayers. Can OKC just be OKC? Or does it always need to be defined as inferior to NYC or Chicago? I get it, OKC will NEVER be as dense as those mega cities but it doesn’t mean OKC can’t be tall or have meaningful skyscrapers/skyline. Look at Austin for example, it too has taken a growth spurt that is recently reflected in its skyline with a few 1000 foot towerS in the works. Can OKC be similar? Many in OKC think it’s possible esp considering the past 30-year trajectory the city has been on.

So to recap as other OKC insiders have done, the Boardwalk project will proceed. It is the hardest proposal for OKC since Citizen tower currently T/O and the BOK Park Plaza tower in scale. Proposed is 4 towers, 2 residential and a Dream Hotel, and a vision super tall that was recently disclosed. The 3 towers are in design review for construction permitting and have not only been approved but have received $200 million in TIF to help augment the appx $750 million total for phase 1 (the three towers, podium, and parking) to be built on a current mini parking crater one block away from the recently approved $1+ billion NBA arena. Add this and the announced multipurpose soccer stadium announce to the south, and considering the pent up demand for downtown highrise living in OKC (consider this project initially proposed as three 26 floor towers 3 years ago, now planned to three at 35); I think one could agree this will proceed. Now for the super tall, it is a vision. If phase I is successful then some form of the super tall will also be built.

Lots of evidence esp when you consider OKC (and recent peer cities and not the NY/Chicago lens), that this is a go. Hopefully this discussion will be confirmed ina couple of months with approved construction permits and site samples.

[Hot Rod]

Early quote from G.Walker: “ There are also alot of major developments going in OKC right now that outsiders don't really know about. The Half, OAK, The Citizen, Convergence, & OKANA are all big projects currently under construction.”

Originally Posted by BnaBreaker

I'm not sure any of those projects listed should really be considered a "major" development for a city the size of OKC, and so far as I can tell, only one of them (the 12 story Citizen) is actually downtown, which to me kind of supports my point about whether the demand is there for a project of this magnitude. But anyway, I've given my two cents, so I'll shut up. And like I said, I'm really not trying to be a negative nancy. I'm rooting for it to happen, and I do hope I'm wrong, but it's just not adding up to me. Let's hope this Randy Hogan guy can get it done! Fingers crossed!

True, they may not be major for Chicago, but they are for OKC (and would be for Nashville too)..

[BuildThemTaller]

A lot of the tallest towers in the world absolutely dwarfed everything around them when they were built. The Sears Tower, for example, absolutely redefined the Chicago skyline when it was built in the early 1970's. It took years for the rest of the Loop skyline to fill in around it a little (it's still much, much taller than everything around it).



The same thing was true for the Transamerica Building San Francisco.



Eventually, the tall tower becomes an anchor for the skyline when other towers are built around it.

Even if this proposed tower gets chopped in half, it would be cool to see another tall tower built in OKC. We all like tall buildings on this board, right? Who is against more tall towers being built?