Confederation Line (Stage 1) | In Service 1.0

[PHrenetic]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

From my experience, we get that kind of cold in Ottawa once every 25 to 50 years. I know we had that degree of cold in January 1981, not sure if ever since then.

Good Day.

Yep....2004

EC, OMCIA, Daily :

2004 Jan 13 (-27.5) , 14 (-30.1) , 15 (-30.7) , 16 (-25.7).
2004 Dec 19 (-25.8) , 20 (-30.7) , 21 (-25.9).

I remember it; I was out in it.
I did not recall the 1981 spell, I guess I still thought it was normal for Ottawa, having arrived in 1978.

Same EC, OMCIA, Daily says :
1981 Jan 02 (-29.9) , 03 (-34.5) , 04 (-35.2) ,,,, 10 (-26.9) , 11 (-29.6) , 12 (-28.9) , 13 (-28.2).
Ouch!

Still, -34 . That's WOW ! Wind chill must be a Polar Bear !

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by PHrenetic

Good Day.

Yep....2004

EC, OMCIA, Daily :

2004 Jan 13 (-27.5) , 14 (-30.1) , 15 (-30.7) , 16 (-25.7).
2004 Dec 19 (-25.8) , 20 (-30.7) , 21 (-25.9).

I remember it; I was out in it.
I did not recall the 1981 spell, I guess I still thought it was normal even for Ottawa, having arrived in 1978.

Still not -34 . That's WOW ! Wind chill must be a Polar Bear !

I will not forget 1981 because it was absolutely frigid and I ended up at the hospital (partially because of the cold) and my father couldn't get the car started. At our house, our mercury thermometer froze, which is about -39C. I think the official records were something like -36. 1994 was also pretty cold.

[AuxTown]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

I will not forget 1981 because it was absolutely frigid and I ended up at the hospital (partially because of the cold) and my father couldn't get the car started. At our house, our mercury thermometer froze, which is about -39C. I think the official records were something like -36. 1994 was also pretty cold.

It's interesting how we often exaggerate the high and low temps for the season in Ottawa. It gets cold for sure but -30C or below is quite rare. Check these record max/min: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_extreme_temperatures_in_Canada

-63C!

[caveat.doctor]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Regardless, it is hard to achieve a time saving on a route that involves yet another transfer and is more indirect.

Quite right. Honestly I didn't think of the 53 because it's at a different stop (not complaining about that, I get why it is where it is). In any case yes there might be a multitude of routes, but without certainty on their spacing to offer frequency, it's still not (yet) reliable enough to count on making that 2nd transfer.

Originally Posted by bradnixon

A requirement to transfer is not the same as a service cut. We could have a more robust transit system with a network of frequent routes rather than a bunch of routes that attempt to provide a 1-seat trip.

I generally agree, we "could" - but there's a point where adding meaningful frequency is so costly that some "boutique" trips seem reasonable, especially to large ridership masses like Carling Campus. (Also seems reasonable to have a fare supplement too.) Interested to see where the trial routes end up.

Originally Posted by bradnixon

Yes, the IT upgrade is supposed to improve predictions of bus departure times from the first stop at the route by considering where the bus is in its previous trip. So if the bus that is scheduled to depart Bayshore as the 55 is late arriving inbound, its departure time prediction would take that into account. They will also hopefully be ale to integrate cancellations into the app as well.

Thanks for the info, that would be a help. Do you know when that will happen?

Originally Posted by bradnixon

The 58 at Carling Place should be able to always give you a GPS time because that route never starts at Carling- it should either be on its way from Bayshore (to Moodie) or on its way from Moodie (to Bayshore).

You're right - I was mixing up another situation in my head (my trips from St Laurent to Montfort hospital). Yes, the Transit app is useful at tracking departures from Carling, but I'm still bound to take whatever comes first to make it home in time - I've been burned too often relying on the app unfortunately. That IT upgrade you mentioned though might fix that.

Originally Posted by bradnixon

I can see that, but as you said before, you can also use the 53 down Parkdale. Between the 53, 56, 80, 86 and 89, you should be able to have a minimal wait at Tunney's.

"Should be"... But yeah, one of these weeks where my wife can back me up on daycare pickups I might try "gambling" on those connections more and see what happens.

BTW I notice we've had several conversations on my situation already - do you see why my commute has gotten so much longer now? Do you also work at Carling? What has your experience been like?

[Harley613]

Originally Posted by SidetrackedSue

Since you are in Wakefield, where are you parking the car?

When we go out on the weekend we park on side streets adjacent to Tunney's Pasture and ride downtown from there. During the week I have parking at my work in the CBD and can hop on the train at Lyon and ride around.

[TransitZilla]

Originally Posted by caveat.doctor

BTW I notice we've had several conversations on my situation already - do you see why my commute has gotten so much longer now? Do you also work at Carling? What has your experience been like?

Ha! I guess we have. No, I don't work at Carling Place but I was interested in hearing about the experience of someone commuting by transit there given the parking challenges we have heard about. When I spoke to an OC Transit planner in the spring, she told me that transit ridership there was rather poor (and that was with the 101/103 in place). Since then the LRT has opened and the route changes have been implemented. Route 66 was beefed up from what was originally shown in the proposed schedules last winter.

I'm curious where things are at now. Your trip is worse because you need to transfer but others could be better.

I generally agree, we "could" - but there's a point where adding meaningful frequency is so costly that some "boutique" trips seem reasonable, especially to large ridership masses like Carling Campus. (Also seems reasonable to have a fare supplement too.) Interested to see where the trial routes end up.

I'm skeptical how those routes will work. They will probably only be able to offer a couple round trips to each location so the schedules will only work for a few. It would probably be better if they had a super high frequency shuttle between Carling Place and Moodie/Bayshore to connect with the rest of the OC network. That's the most likely game plan post-Stage 2 as well.

Thanks for the info, that would be a help. Do you know when that will happen?

I'm not sure- I heard about it at the December Transit Commission meeting. I think they said later this year. Probably Q3 or Q4.

[McC]

Originally Posted by PHrenetic

Good Day.

Yep....2004

EC, OMCIA, Daily :

2004 Jan 13 (-27.5) , 14 (-30.1) , 15 (-30.7) , 16 (-25.7).
2004 Dec 19 (-25.8) , 20 (-30.7) , 21 (-25.9).

I remember it; I was out in it.
I did not recall the 1981 spell, I guess I still thought it was normal for Ottawa, having arrived in 1978.

Same EC, OMCIA, Daily says :
1981 Jan 02 (-29.9) , 03 (-34.5) , 04 (-35.2) ,,,, 10 (-26.9) , 11 (-29.6) , 12 (-28.9) , 13 (-28.2).
Ouch!

Still, -34 . That's WOW ! Wind chill must be a Polar Bear !

2004 is my benchmark for a cold winter, remember it well, commuting by skate on the canal between UOttawa and Carleton doing RA work for one of my Profs.

2015 was special too. I remember my boss coming in with some hockey colour commentator type “powerplay save percentage when the moon is waxing and gold is in the opponent’s color scheme” Byzantine statistic about the cold in February. Something like “there were more days in Feb 2015 where the high was below -20 than we usually have lows below -20 in an entire winter” or something like that... lol

[lrt's friend]

I'm skeptical how those routes will work. They will probably only be able to offer a couple round trips to each location so the schedules will only work for a few. It would probably be better if they had a super high frequency shuttle between Carling Place and Moodie/Bayshore to connect with the rest of the OC network. That's the most likely game plan post-Stage 2 as well.

For some, this will offer even worse service. Unless, you live on the Confederation Line corridor, or in Kanata, everywhere else will require a minimum of two transfers. Moodie Station will have few if any bus routes coming from inside the Greenbelt.

The Confederation Line will offer great service if your destination is on the line. If your start and end points are off the Confederation Line, service will not be convenient. This is a perfect illustration of the last mile problem.

For those travelling from Barrhaven to the Carling Campus after Phase 2, they will face three transfers during peak hours. At Baseline, Lincoln Fields and at Moodie. This will encourage people to drive.

We are building a transit system with a lack of alternatives, again the lack of redundancy that I brought up when trains fail, but also the lack of ability to get directly between locations in the city without a bunch of transfers. People's tolerance of transfers is limited. There is always a transfer penalty and it is very difficult to make up for that penalty even with frequency. Even a 5 minute wait, is a 5 minute loss.

caveat.doctor's illustration shows that even a direct bus every half hour is better than a frequent rapid transit line and frequent bus routes with two transfers on a less direct routing. It is almost impossible to make up the time lost by the two transfers and the more out of the way route.

[Radster]

Knock on wood, but haven't been hearing much about LRT issues lately.

Anyone know how many trains are running these days, still 13?

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by Radster

Knock on wood, but haven't been hearing much about LRT issues lately.

Anyone know how many trains are running these days, still 13?

I have heard of two issues since New Years, a power failure and a door fault. As far as I know, they are still running 13 trains. It seems to be a big challenge to add a 14th and 15th train.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by AuxTown

It's interesting how we often exaggerate the high and low temps for the season in Ottawa. It gets cold for sure but -30C or below is quite rare. Check these record max/min: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_extreme_temperatures_in_Canada

-63C!

Part of the problem with the temperature exaggeration is the undue emphasis placed on, and almost universal misunderstanding of, "wind chill".

[VANRIDERFAN]

Originally Posted by bradnixon

Ha! I guess we have. No, I don't work at Carling Place but I was interested in hearing about the experience of someone commuting by transit there given the parking challenges we have heard about.

I work in Carling. Now when I moved to Ottawa in 2017 I deliberately chose the neighbourhood near Tunney's due to the chance I may be working at various sites in the NCR.

The 53 stops right in front of my house. It goes directly to Tunney's where I transfer to the 66. The usual trip including transfers is 25 to 30 minutes. Not too bad in my mind.

[eltodesukane]

LRT elevator at Rideau out of service...

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

I have heard of two issues since New Years, a power failure and a door fault. As far as I know, they are still running 13 trains. It seems to be a big challenge to add a 14th and 15th train.

Why?

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

Why?

We have never been told officially, but I suspect it is because we can't keep enough functioning trains in service reliably to make up 14 or 15 trains. More trains require regular maintenance than was originally expected.

[kmcamp]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

We have never been told officially, but I suspect it is because we can't keep enough functioning trains in service reliably to make up 14 or 15 trains. More trains require regular maintenance than was originally expected.

On the other hand, the frequency in rush hour lately seems slightly higher. At Parliament now on my way home it's almost always 3 minutes between trains rather than 4 during rush hour. I'm actually wondering if they added another train.

[TransitZilla]

Originally Posted by VANRIDERFAN

I work in Carling. Now when I moved to Ottawa in 2017 I deliberately chose the neighbourhood near Tunney's due to the chance I may be working at various sites in the NCR.

The 53 stops right in front of my house. It goes directly to Tunney's where I transfer to the 66. The usual trip including transfers is 25 to 30 minutes. Not too bad in my mind.

That's pretty good. I guess you must be quite close to Tunney's?

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by CityTech

-34C is a very rare temperature in Ottawa. In fact, it wasn't recorded once in the entire last decade (coldest was -30.7 on January 24th, 2011).

Here's the coldest recorded hourly temperature of the past ten winters (source - EC, OTTAWA CDA RCS station)
2009-2010 -24.8
2010-2011 -30.7
2011-2012 -25.2
2012-2013 -29.5
2013-2014 -29.5
2014-2015 -28.0
2015-2016 -28.9
2016-2017 -27.2
2017-2018 -28.8
2018-2019 -26.6

We haven't even hit -30 once since 2011.

I've been in my house since the early 2000s. I've had an outdoor thermometer since then and the coldest I've seen is -34. This could have been in 2000-2011 or might have been in the years prior.

Though I am usually pretty bang on with the YOW weather station, or within a half degree or one degree.

I am in Gatineau but my readings are always closer to YOW than to Gatineau airport's readings which as weather watchers know is in a frost hollow and can sometimes be 5-10 degrees colder than YOW on the frostiest winter mornings.

(As the crow flies there is not much difference in the distance between my house and Gatineau airport vs. my house to YOW.)

[daud]

Originally Posted by Acajack

I've been in my house since the early 2000s. I've had an outdoor thermometer since then and the coldest I've seen is -34. This could have been in 2000-2011 or might have been in the years prior.

Though I am usually pretty bang on with the YOW weather station, or within a half degree or one degree.

I am in Gatineau but my readings are always closer to YOW than to Gatineau airport's readings which as weather watchers know is in a frost hollow and can sometimes be 5-10 degrees colder than YOW on the frostiest winter mornings.

(As the crow flies there is not much difference in the distance between my house and Gatineau airport vs. my house to YOW.)

Elevation plays a huge role in the microclimate of this city. I live just south of the airport and there have been many times in late winter and early spring where the temperature can be as high as 5-6c at my house and by they time I cross the bridge to Hull, it is down to 0c. I've even seen it rise again as I drive to places like camp fortune. Of course this can be a very temporary differential but it can also linger for hours. It happens maybe 3-4 times every late winter and usually involves a warm front moving in. It doesn't happen in autumn because there isn't that cold air lingering around the area yet. I grew up in Orleans, which has low elevation and my father used to always tell me the Airport weather was not the same weather.

Watch the weather at Kemptville when a warm front starts to creep into the region. Very often the front will creep as high as kemptville and jsut stall there for hours not reaching the airport.

I have a thermometer at my house and I would be hard pressed to remember if I have ever seen -30. I may have seen it 3 or 4 times since 2010 when i moved back to Ottawa.

[Acajack]

The entire Ottawa-Gatineau urbanized area is in the 5a hardiness zone.

My house is very close to the northernmost edge of the 5a zone.

Barely more than 5 minutes away going north you're into the 4b zone.