The Official Saint John, NB Project Thread

[UptownJeff]

Originally Posted by cdnguys

Had to stop reading comments on CBC - people are so f’ing ignorant.

I stopped reading those! Another thought. IF it is sold we have many other companies like JDI, Cooke and The Port that are exploding and the HQ staff who may be impacted would likely have absolutely no trouble finding a new career path.

[Helladog]

WRT the refinery, i think it's just politics; a whole load of nothing to be concerned about.

If the Irvings do decide to get out of the oil business, they should shut it all down, sell for scrap, and reclaim the land to it's original glory. It's not going to be in business forever anyway.

[cdnguys]

Originally Posted by Helladog

WRT the refinery, i think it's just politics; a whole load of nothing to be concerned about.

If the Irvings do decide to get out of the oil business, they should shut it all down, sell for scrap, and reclaim the land to it's original glory. It's not going to be in business forever anyway.

Arthur is 94 and unwell. This is succession planning. The refinery is their big money maker. People lament fossil fuels are on the decline, however Irving is taking a bigger share of a slowly shrinking market. Just look at Atlantic Canada - there were 4 refineries now it’s only Irving. They supply the fuel to 900 stations in Quebec, Atlantic Canada and New England / New York State in addition to hundreds of other branded stations. They survived because they plowed money into annual maintenance whereas other refineries beholden to shareholders were not maintained and became obsolete and too expensive to bring up to standard. In the next 25 years I think the refinery in Levi, QC will be at risk as Canada will probably only need 4 refineries to meet demand. I wouldn’t be surprised if one of the options they are exploring is selling their downstream business to couche tard / Circle K and transitioning to green energy production like wind, solar, hydrogen production on a larger scale, maybe batteries. They have some very smart people working at HQ and their lab at Golden Ball whose only job is to plot the future of the company in the new green environment of next 60 years. Despite the badmouthing they constantly get, they really do care about the communities they operate in and I wouldn’t be surprised if units were sold off that it would be baked into the sale agreement the requirement to maintain units/employees in Saint John. Worse case if they needed to shed hundreds of HQ jobs - they would fill a seemingly insurmountable need for workers at JDI and others to replace retirees. When I talk to business owners they all have same problem - they can’t get workers and their business can’t grow much.

[RR Drummer]

Originally Posted by cdnguys

Arthur is 94 and unwell. This is succession planning. The refinery is their big money maker. People lament fossil fuels are on the decline, however Irving is taking a bigger share of a slowly shrinking market. Just look at Atlantic Canada - there were 4 refineries now it’s only Irving. They supply the fuel to 900 stations in Quebec, Atlantic Canada and New England / New York State in addition to hundreds of other branded stations. They survived because they plowed money into annual maintenance whereas other refineries beholden to shareholders were not maintained and became obsolete and too expensive to bring up to standard. In the next 25 years I think the refinery in Levi, QC will be at risk as Canada will probably only need 4 refineries to meet demand. I wouldn’t be surprised if one of the options they are exploring is selling their downstream business to couche tard / Circle K and transitioning to green energy production like wind, solar, hydrogen production on a larger scale, maybe batteries. They have some very smart people working at HQ and their lab at Golden Ball whose only job is to plot the future of the company in the new green environment of next 60 years. Despite the badmouthing they constantly get, they really do care about the communities they operate in and I wouldn’t be surprised if units were sold off that it would be baked into the sale agreement the requirement to maintain units/employees in Saint John. Worse case if they needed to shed hundreds of HQ jobs - they would fill a seemingly insurmountable need for workers at JDI and others to replace retirees. When I talk to business owners they all have same problem - they can’t get workers and their business can’t grow much.

Well said. 👏

[adamuptownsj]

Reportedly there is a 'monster' PAC agenda coming in July.

And regarding the deck railing at City Hall, it's stunningly cheap. Pressure treated 4x4s. I can't believe that's acceptable.

Also, the Barbour General Store is now a homeless encampment. Laundry hanging off it.

[Ottawa]

RE: IOL

It's unfortunate that these are the things that get 'leaked' for reasons that are likely not what they first appear to be. This was certainly publicized with IOL's knowledge. That's how this current media works. They know that news like that will sell lots of papers (as they used to say). If there really was a deal, it would be kept super secret until the deal was finalized.

Of course I might be wrong, but I need more facts than are currently public.

[ColSJ]

Trojan Rugby's fieldhouse is under construction



A small but nice project for recreation in Saint John.

[NewIreland]

Originally Posted by Helladog

WRT the refinery, i think it's just politics; a whole load of nothing to be concerned about.

If the Irvings do decide to get out of the oil business, they should shut it all down, sell for scrap, and reclaim the land to it's original glory. It's not going to be in business forever anyway.

I heard a rumour that Kohn Jr. might be taking over IOL.

[cdnguys]

Originally Posted by Ottawa

RE: IOL

It's unfortunate that these are the things that get 'leaked' for reasons that are likely not what they first appear to be. This was certainly publicized with IOL's knowledge. That's how this current media works. They know that news like that will sell lots of papers (as they used to say). If there really was a deal, it would be kept super secret until the deal was finalized.

Of course I might be wrong, but I need more facts than are currently public.

I may be misunderstanding, but there were no leaks and there is no sale. It was triggered by this statement from IOL: https://www.irvingoil.com/sites/default/files/irving_oil_statement_june_7.png

In addition, they gave a heads up to the mayor. The question is why did such a private and discreet company release a public statement? It’s not their MO.

[Ottawa]

Originally Posted by cdnguys

I may be misunderstanding, but there were no leaks and there is no sale. It was triggered by this statement from IOL: https://www.irvingoil.com/sites/default/files/irving_oil_statement_june_7.png

In addition, they gave a heads up to the mayor. The question is why did such a private and discreet company release a public statement? It’s not their MO.

That's one of the biggest statements I've ever seen made specifically to do nothing but stir controversy. It has no other purpose. One of the most secretive companies around puts out a "statement" that they are in the midst of doing something and that "something" isn't really clear and they haven't even determined how they are going to proceed. They just wanted us all to know they haven't really decided what they are going to do.

Whatever comes of this, it is not meant to inform anybody of what they are really doing.

[RR Drummer]

Originally Posted by Ottawa

That's one of the biggest statements I've ever seen made specifically to do nothing but stir controversy. It has no other purpose. One of the most secretive companies around puts out a "statement" that they are in the midst of doing something and that "something" isn't really clear and they haven't even determined how they are going to proceed. They just wanted us all to know they haven't really decided what they are going to do.

Whatever comes of this, it is not meant to inform anybody of what they are really doing.

My opinion is this is about trying to get ahead of the storm. Essentially something is about to happen and it’s all about trying to get ahead of it before news breaks. In time this will make more sense than it does currently.

[DyAm00394]

The new apartment building under construction at 80 Technology Drive is called The Vistas. There is now a website launched: https://somersetlivingnb.ca

[Ottawa]

From a report on CSX upgrades from trains.com

"It was not clear how Pan Am Railways volume has changed over the past six months: Traffic data was redacted in CSX’s June 1 update to the Surface Transportation Board. But CSX says it expects traffic to grow as upgrades are completed and service reliability improves.

“It’s still early on the volume side,” CSX CEO Joe Hinrichs said in an interview. “The capital projects are on plan. We’re getting the network up to our standards. … we’re not there yet, but we’re on plan.”

Hinrichs says he sees opportunity for CSX to tap into the growing Port of Saint John in New Brunswick once capital improvements are complete across the Pan Am Railways system. CSX inherited Pan Am’s haulage rights agreement with Irving Co. short lines Eastern Maine and New Brunswick Southern, which serve the port."

The entire report is at:

https://www.trains.com/trn/news-reviews/...ents-to-former-pan-am-railways-trackage/

[DyAm00394]

The upcoming common council meeting on June.12th, 2023 has a new proposal to transform the former Barbour’s General Store site, (10 Market Square), into a new public space area.

[adamuptownsj]

Originally Posted by DyAm00394

The upcoming common council meeting on June.12th, 2023 has a new proposal to transform the former Barbour’s General Store site, (10 Market Square), into a new public space area.

A public plaza... across the street from two other public plazas. This is prime development land and they want some pavers, grass, and a hypothetical tourist center. This should pair well with the other new public plaza planned for the foot of the market, and the empty public plaza at the law courts. I hate to be consistently negative but this calendar year... it's been hard. City's in lala land wasting prime real estate on this one.

[cdnguys]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

A public plaza... across the street from two other public plazas. This is prime development land and they want some pavers, grass, and a hypothetical tourist center. This should pair well with the other new public plaza planned for the foot of the market, and the empty public plaza at the law courts. I hate to be consistently negative but this calendar year... it's been hard. City's in lala land wasting prime real estate on this one.

Yes prime development - could easily fit a Wellington sized building. Disappointed too but maybe it’s just a holdover until developed.

[adamuptownsj]

Originally Posted by cdnguys

Yes prime development - could easily fit a Wellington sized building. Disappointed too but maybe it’s just a holdover until developed.

Minutes state it's a holdover until a tourist centre is built. Totally inane when said tourist centre could be a main floor tenant of a 4-7 story building instead.

[jonny golden]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

Minutes state it's a holdover until a tourist centre is built. Totally inane when said tourist centre could be a main floor tenant of a 4-7 story building instead.

Especially given the need for more housing in Saint John!

[DyAm00394]

Here's an excerpt from the council report:

"There exists an opportunity for a new purpose-built gateway building and transit hub that would service as a welcome centre for the Uptown and an opportunity to celebrate and showcase our diverse and inclusive heritage, arts and culture.

The proposed space could also include connection to the City’s sustainable transportation network with proposed overhead charging stations for Saint John transit buses and enhanced shelter and amenities for transit users. The interior program for the proposed space could include a small welcome information centre, interactive digital information displays, and transit amenities. The proposal will be pursued in partnership with Envision Saint John to re-establish the visitor information and welcome centre on the site from its temporary locations at the Port Container Village and the City Market".

https://pub-saintjohn.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=14796

[bridgeoftea]

Originally Posted by adamuptownsj

A public plaza... across the street from two other public plazas. This is prime development land and they want some pavers, grass, and a hypothetical tourist center. This should pair well with the other new public plaza planned for the foot of the market, and the empty public plaza at the law courts. I hate to be consistently negative but this calendar year... it's been hard. City's in lala land wasting prime real estate on this one.

Generally I'm into parks but this one was calling for some sort of cornerstone residential unit. As others pointed out, this is a big miss on the cities part.