NEW YORK | Penn Station / MSG Renovation

[montydawg]

Originally Posted by ChiND

Penn Station’s gross defects must be remedied. ASTM’s plan and GPA’s both cost a little over seven billion dollars.

At the end of the day, Amtrak moved their operations across the street, and this will be used mostly by commuters, who won’t be dwelling at the station for very long. With that said, I believe the retail environment will be lower quality than that at the Monahan train hall and these super expensive projects won’t win out. I believe a version where they open up the 2 levels inside the existing footprint will win. I also believe when the opportunity to build a tower on an adjacent block becomes visible they will use that opportunity to expand the track platforms into an adjacent parcel.

[ChiND]

I wonder when in May, the decision will be made. We have about three and a half months until we know the fate of Penn. While I prefer GPA, ASTM also would be a vast improvement.

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by ChiND

Penn Station’s gross defects must be remedied. ASTM’s plan and GPA’s both cost a little over seven billion dollars.

The original plan they had was to move MSG and one penn plaza allowing for either a rebuilt old penn design or a new design. The GPA has narrow pinch points to access the train hall..makes no sense.

[ChiND]

Well know what we’re getting soon.

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by ChiND

Well know what we’re getting soon.

I also like how the Rethinknyc went from opposing all the bloat to embracing it to further their agenda.. I think the end result of whatever they go with won't actually fix anything..

[Nexis4Jersey]

Originally Posted by montydawg

At the end of the day, Amtrak moved their operations across the street, and this will be used mostly by commuters, who won’t be dwelling at the station for very long. With that said, I believe the retail environment will be lower quality than that at the Monahan train hall and these super expensive projects won’t win out. I believe a version where they open up the 2 levels inside the existing footprint will win. I also believe when the opportunity to build a tower on an adjacent block becomes visible they will use that opportunity to expand the track platforms into an adjacent parcel.

NJT and MTA use the orignally station and i'd argue Amtrak needs to use the old station aswell.. The New addition is to small for day to day operations..

[ChiND]

I can’t wait for May!






GPA

[ChiND]

I wonder what this is about. If, any many believe, the ASTM plan is the frontrunner, I thought that ASTM was essentially funding it.

https://www.crainsnewyork.com/transp...station-revamp

January 29, 2026 05:33 AM
Trump’s Penn Station revamp heads for funding fight with states
Michelle Kaske, Bloomberg

[ChiND]

Who knows what will happen. We'll know in June.

This looks absolutely incredible.

https://www.grandpenn.org/video-libr...e-walking-tour

The above video is magnificent, as is the still rendering below. I like how Farley is visible through the skylight.


GPA

[UrbanImpact]

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/don...sed-rcna257708
Trump wanted Dulles Airport, Penn Station named after him — in exchange for releasing federal funds

[ChiND]

Something grandiose must be planned because no one would want a mild upgrade of Penn named after them.

[Busy Bee]

Fuckin Hell.

No seriously, we're living in fuckin Hell.

[UrbanImpact]

Originally Posted by ChiND

Something grandiose must be planned because no one would want a mild upgrade of Penn named after them.

Sure Red Lion As Blondie says, "Dreaming is Free".

[NYguy]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

NJT and MTA use the orignally station and i'd argue Amtrak needs to use the old station aswell.. The New addition is to small for day to day operations..

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

I also like how the Rethinknyc went from opposing all the bloat to embracing it to further their agenda.. I think the end result of whatever they go with won't actually fix anything..

Basically what they are going to do is the plan that has already been moving forward the past few years - consolidating things on a single level, removing the upper level for increased ceiling heights, and possibly some daylighting.

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

It feels like a giant grift to me...so MSG isn't moving?

No MSG isn't moving. Neither is 2 Penn Plaza (both of which sit in the footprint of the original stationhouse). And for a variety of reasons, any reasonable person would have grasped that by now. But every time I open this thread, I see someone's fantasy - and not even a practical one - for something that will not happen. But, time cleanses all.

[NYguy]

Vornado, which controls all of the retail in both Penn Station proper, and Moynihan train hall, as well as most of the surrounding area has jumped on the Halmer plan.

[SammyBaby]

As firm as NY Guy stands on their opinion that MSG will not move, I stand on mine which is that when the money is right MSG will move. Additionally 2 Penn is in the drawing of the new Penn Station and doesn't have to be demolished to build it.

[ChiND]

It’s interesting that Grand Penn has Foster on its team. His work on the Reichstag and on the British Library are precedents for his work on Neoclassical landmarks.

I don’t think that Roth’s alignment with any team means anything. If Trump picks Grand Penn, Roth will play ball.

If Trump picks the ASTM plan, some here suggest that it will be dramatically scaled back and won’t even include the MSG theatre. Will it simply encompass the single level concourse under MSG? That would be sad. This is a once in a lifetime opportunity to fix Penn Station.

Anyway, if Trump picks ASTM and MSG stays in place, NY should end its tax exemption.

We’ll know what we’re getting soon enough. While the finalist will be selected in May, the winner supposedly won’t be disclosed until June.

The main terminal in Grand Penn is bigger than Farley and Grand Central. Its ceiling is 125 feet high.


GPA


The ceilings on the lower level concourse in the ASTM plan are 30 feet high.




GPA

I wonder how high the ceilings on the single level concourse for the ASTM plan are.

[ChiND]

If Dante, John Milton, and James Joyce could have traveled to the future to observe Penn Station and MSG, their descriptions
of Hell in the Inferno, Paradise Lost , and Portrait of An Artist would have been far more odious!

Will New Yorkers forever be relegated to the Ninth Circle of Hell? Why spend $7 billion for lipstick on a pig?

Will we be left with the oldest and worst arena in the NHL/NBA and a terrible and disgusting, congested "train station"?

Further, since MSG and Penn are the worst arena and train station now, how utterly execrable will they be in fifty years?


Flickr





Are the flaming, sulfurous pits of Tartarus the best that New Yorkers can have?


Bruce Bennett



Are people happy with this vile, putrid dystopian mess?


Earth pro




Where’s the Cerberus?


Flickr




Orpheus couldn’t have escaped the violent grip of this putrid hell.





Traveling through Penn is about as horrible as enduring the pain
that Prometheus is subjected to in Tartarus. Anything less than
the Grand Penn plan would subject New Yorkers to that terrible fate
in perpetuity.


Wikipedia

[ChiND]

https://nysfocus.com/2026/02/02/vorn...-station-trump

Landlord That Won Big in Cuomo’s Penn Station Plan Makes a Comeback Under Trump
Vornado Realty Trust has a stake in Halmar’s proposal to rebuild the Manhattan rail hub.
Nick Garber · February 2, 2026

[NYguy]

• Video Link



• Video Link