The Great Canadian Transit Thread

[Nouvellecosse]

Fredericton i find pretty good. From what I can tell probably the best in the Maritimes.

[Taeolas]

Fredericton is surprisingly bikeable considering it is built in a big river valley. Trying to get up the hills from downtown to Prospect/the Malls is a challenge. But for getting around the core or going from one side of the river to the other, we have an excellent railtrail system that gives us a solid backbone for the bike lanes to hit the rest of the city.

[p_xavier]

Financing is finally closed for the Montreal's blue line extension.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/blue-line-federal-investment-1.5199749

[hipster duck]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

Which I find interesting given all the paths through the ravines.

Those ravine bikeways are incomplete, don’t have convenient access points and are often in poor shape.

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by hipster duck

Definitely not Toronto.

I mean, the cycling infrastructure is haphazard and inadequate at best, but insofar as the built environment and road network actually being set up in a way that's good for biking I would certainly say it is.

[hipster duck]

Originally Posted by MonkeyRonin

I mean, the cycling infrastructure is haphazard and inadequate at best, but insofar as the built environment and road network actually being set up in a way that's good for biking I would certainly say it is.

Sure, the population density and plethora of walkable commercial areas makes biking a viable option, just not a pleasant, safe or accommodating one.

[niwell]

I've biked almost daily for over a decade in Toronto, as well as in close to a dozen major cities worldwide, and I do think the "unsafe and miserable" factor is overplayed quite a bit. It's far from the best but also far from the worst I've experienced. Some of the local articles that have come out don't help much at all (and are actually counterproductive in my eyes).

Infrastructure is definitely lacking and too slow to expand, but the sheer level of cyclists in many areas of the central city, and corresponding forced awareness in drivers, does help a lot. For instance, Chicago has a significantly better network of bike lanes and cycle-tracks but I feel much more unsafe biking there. Car traffic is insane and drivers seem blissfully unaware of cyclists. I even felt this way - albeit to a lesser extent - in Portland, which is often elevated as a model for cycling cities.

Montreal is certainly better than Toronto (never biked in Van so can't comment there), but the difference between the two is much less significant, than say, Copenhagen and Montreal. The former being the best cycling experience I've experienced, though I may have been slightly frustrated with the speed of traffic if riding my own bike.

This all being said I still wouldn't list Toronto in a "best of" list of places to cycle, but it's not terrible.

[GeneralLea]

Something I'm glad to see happening to with regards to Toronto's biking infrastructure is more bixi-bike stations being installed through the city. I just earlier passed by and saw one nearly completed not far from Yonge and Eglinton, right in the centre of the city. Although trails and dedicated laneways aren't very common, that awareness from drivers is what makes things more welcoing and safe for many cyclists in Toronto.

[hipster duck]

If you commute east-west, south of Davenport then biking in Toronto is acceptable, as long as you’re very aware of your surroundings and watch out for bumpy pavement, frequent construction closures and streetcar tracks. This is already a poor experience but at least drivers are aware and there’s strength in numbers.

If your bicycle commute is primary north-south, like mine, then Toronto is very far behind. Forget about biking in the postwar, car-oriented parts of the 416 - try biking from downtown to Yonge and Eglinton, or biking to or around North York Centre. In our peer cities, there would be dedicated bicycle routes between trip generators of this size and urbanity.

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by niwell

I've biked almost daily for over a decade in Toronto, as well as in close to a dozen major cities worldwide, and I do think the "unsafe and miserable" factor is overplayed quite a bit. It's far from the best but also far from the worst I've experienced.

Agreed with all of the above. And while they're nice to have, I think the importance of bike lanes in particular is overstated.

Toronto's blessing/curse in regards to cycling are streetcars. They control the flow of traffic and the setup of a typical streetcar route effectively renders the right lane as a parking lane with a narrow strip that's only usable by bikes: https://goo.gl/maps/RGb7n2ZX82NKiE7a9

The downside of course, is that the immovable tracks and existing narrow-ish street widths make adding bike lanes alongside them impossible in most instances. Crossing over the tracks can be tricky as well. The city actually has been pretty good with adding bike lanes on non-streetcar streets though (Bloor, Richmond, Adelaide, Sherbourne, etc. as well as many residential back streets).

[WhipperSnapper]

My experience mirrors Niwell although it makes sense north of Eglinton is not nearly as safe.

Lane closures for construction are a nuisance for everyone. I'm not going to risk streetcar tracks to continue cycling past these obstructions. Just get off and walk.

Half the on street bike lanes the city has installed in the east end are impractical for cyclists and create needless congestion. There's this tremendous push to add more kilometres and look better on these lists without much reason going into it. For this reason, I honestly don't think Toronto would be any better if it had a comparable rank to Montreal and Vancouver. (this list being very specific to separate bike lanes notwithstanding)

[Kilgore Trout]

My experience in Toronto (at least below Dupont) is that its geography and density makes it very easy to get around by bike – but cycling is not at all pleasant, because of aggressive drivers and a general lack of cycling infrastructure. In many cases cyclists have no choice but to bike on streets like Dundas and College where you are forced between streetcar tracks and parked cars, right in the dooring zone.

Montreal is better partly because it doesn't seem to have as many drivers who have a hate-on for cyclists, but especially because it has just that much more dedicated cycling infrastructure, especially protected bike lanes. It feels safer which is why you see entire families out biking around on busy city streets, including little kids, which I've rarely seen in other North American cities (except for recreational paths like the Seawall in Vancouver and the river valley paths in Calgary).

[Reecemartin]

Station Focus: Kennedy on TTC Line 2 and 3!
https://youtu.be/CG2d9WRCEv0

[MonkeyRonin]

Originally Posted by Kilgore Trout

My experience in Toronto (at least below Dupont) is that its geography and density makes it very easy to get around by bike – but cycling is not at all pleasant, because of aggressive drivers and a general lack of cycling infrastructure. In many cases cyclists have no choice but to bike on streets like Dundas and College where you are forced between streetcar tracks and parked cars, right in the dooring zone.

I bike on College and/or Dundas literally every day and I've never found the experience anything but enjoyable. Maybe it's that cyclists from other cities are just wimps?

Also as someone who likes to go a little on the faster side, I much prefer painted bike lines where you're more easily able to pass slower riders to protected lanes, which are typically congested and can leave you penned in amongst the slow.

[niwell]

^I'm that kind of cyclist as well. When you're going fast you definitely do have to pay more attention, but I still find it very enjoyable. I'm much more irritable on the rare days I take the TTC to work!

When I'm biking with my fiance, who rides a single speed cruiser, the experience is much more laid back. In those situations streets with protected bike lanes can be nice. Another thing I appreciate for more casual rides is the increasing network of bike lanes and contra-flow bike lanes on residential streets. They seem to be adding more and more under the radar and you can make it through large swaths of Toronto's west end on side streets. It's a lot slower, so I rarely do, but good for less confident cyclists.

I'm hoping to make it to Montreal this summer and if I do will be relying mostly on bikeshare, so interested to see any differences since last time I was there.

[Pavlov]

Originally Posted by Kilgore Trout

My experience in Toronto (at least below Dupont) is that its geography and density makes it very easy to get around by bike – but cycling is not at all pleasant, because of aggressive drivers and a general lack of cycling infrastructure. In many cases cyclists have no choice but to bike on streets like Dundas and College where you are forced between streetcar tracks and parked cars, right in the dooring zone.

Montreal is better partly because it doesn't seem to have as many drivers who have a hate-on for cyclists, but especially because it has just that much more dedicated cycling infrastructure, especially protected bike lanes. It feels safer which is why you see entire families out biking around on busy city streets, including little kids, which I've rarely seen in other North American cities (except for recreational paths like the Seawall in Vancouver and the river valley paths in Calgary).

The river valley paths in Calgary are interesting. They aren't sexy urban bike infrastructure but, as long as 20 years ago, they became pretty effective bike commuting thoroughfares.

[begratto]

Originally Posted by niwell

I'm hoping to make it to Montreal this summer and if I do will be relying mostly on bikeshare, so interested to see any differences since last time I was there.

You will probably not notice a lot of difference downtown, but there's been tons of new developments (and more to come) in the central boroughs like Plateau-Mont-Royal, Rosemont/La Petite-Patrie, le Sud-Ouest, Verdun, Mercier/Hochelaga-Maisonneuve. The bike path network is much more dense in these boroughs compared to downtown.

In the city centre, we're supposed to get new protected bike lanes on Peel and Guy, but only once they have completed the major roadworks on these two streets.

Montreal bike paths map
Yellow : on-street protected bike lane
Red : off-street protected bike path
Blue : Painted bike lane

[hipster duck]

Originally Posted by MonkeyRonin

Also as someone who likes to go a little on the faster side, I much prefer painted bike lines where you're more easily able to pass slower riders to protected lanes, which are typically congested and can leave you penned in amongst the slow.

I think the objective with urban cycling should be to get as much of the populace comfortable riding bikes.

I don’t know you, but my guess is that you’re on the right side of the road confidence bell curve.

An equitable situation would be to create a system (more separation from vehicles) where people with your skills and abilities (the few) would have to sacrifice thrill in order for others (the many) to have the confidence to get on a bike in Toronto.

[WhipperSnapper]

I think designated bike lanes in mixed traffic being safer is more perception than reality. It allows drivers to ease off on cyclist awareness and adds to vehicular traffic congestion which promotes aggressiveness towards cyclists. It's the direction Toronto is taking and it is, IMO, the worst direction to go.

I have encountered the occasional aggressive drivers during my many years cycling but, they are few and far between. Honking has been seldom heard whenever I must occupy both lanes to safely get around an obstruction.

I was in PEI for a while. There were few if any pedestrian crossings at that time. I was a little apprehensive but, Drivers were ingrained to give pedestrians the right of way.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper

I think designated bike lanes in mixed traffic being safer is more perception than reality. It allows drivers to ease off on cyclist awareness and adds to vehicular traffic congestion which promotes aggressiveness towards cyclists. It's the direction Toronto is taking and it is, IMO, the worst direction to go.

I have encountered the occasional aggressive drivers during my many years cycling but, they are few and far between. Honking has been seldom heard whenever I must occupy both lanes to safely get around an obstruction.

I was in PEI for a while. There were few if any pedestrian crossings at that time. I was a little apprehensive but, Drivers were ingrained to give pedestrians the right of way.

there are about a million pages of data showing that it's world's safer. I seem to recall the Richmond / Adelaide lanes cutting cyclist-vehicle collisions by a factor of 100 in terms of cyclist-miles-traveled. The actual amount of collisions remained about the same after the installation of the lanes, but the amount of cyclists increased by 1000% so..

That gets to the other point of bike lanes. Most cyclists need the "perceived" sense of safety just to get on their bike. Thus the 1000% increase in cycling on the corridor. You (and I) qualify as a "strong" cyclist - someone who will cycle regardless of what infrastructure is available. Most people aren't like that though.. they need safe infrastructure to be lured onto a bike.