The Official Moncton, NB Project Thread

[CreamOfpumpkin]

I for one, oppose the development, Good city planning means spreading out these services. When you have a high density of similar services and development types it will have inadvertent effects on the neighborhood. This project, in particular, already has the Harvest house and humanity project in the same block, which will make this place turn into a ghetto. We all can remember when we use to put up blocks of public housing, and how successful they were, they instantly turned into dens of criminal activity. 

The city and the planning department are really throwing their money in the wrong areas. giving millions to a company that has the mandate to feed the homeless does nothing but perpetuate an already bad situation. Good planning would see the 500+ units that are going up have 3% of the units dedicated to a subsidy program. This way 1-4 units per new building has a corner basement apartment for a less desirable tenant, low ratio to the building, and the low desire tenants are not concentrated into one building or area. The city allowing a 16 unit low rental will only make it so 30-40 individuals with similar poor lifestyles amplify their drug and crime activity.

Apart from the development aspect, Moncton does not have a housing issue. Yes, it is expensive, yes we need more single-family homes. But none, and I mean none of these tent city, garbage throwing, piss bottle, shit disturbed, freeloaders that have flocked to the streets of Moncton for 3 solid meals a day from every corner of the Maritimes has anything to do with a housing problem. It is simple as day, it is a drug problem, and an over-servicing problem. The city and the RCMP are both guilty at not acting soon enough, too busy with their glamourous permit numbers. Let's get back to talking about developments, but know that this issue can only be addressed by intelligent and out-of-the-box thinking. Sandwiches do not fix problems!

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by Franco401

Some people really do just hate the poor.

It says a lot about a society or a community wrt how they treat every member of that group, the poor and unhoused included. It's one thing to live in a society that does nothing to help some but another to actively dislike and hate those below them. Entirely predictable and depressing that some people's solutions to issues in our society is to turn our backs and pretend they don't exist rather than actively trying to better their lives and improve their living conditions.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by CreamOfpumpkin

This way 1-4 units per new building has a corner basement apartment for a less desirable tenant

Do the undesirables get their own separate entrance at the back where they can't be seen or are they allowed to mingle with the more desirable citizens?

[LewisVillis]

Originally Posted by CreamOfpumpkin

... But none, and I mean none of these tent city, garbage throwing, piss bottle, shit disturbed, freeloaders that have flocked to the streets of Moncton.....!

How to completely invalidate any possible point you were trying to make... Intelligent, out-of-the-box-thinking, eh?

[mylesmalley]

Originally Posted by CreamOfpumpkin

But none, and I mean none of these tent city, garbage throwing, piss bottle, shit disturbed, freeloaders that have flocked to the streets of Moncton for 3 solid meals a day from every corner of the Maritimes has anything to do with a housing problem.

I hope for your sake that if you ever end up in a situation like this that someone more compassionate than you is there to help.

[CreamOfpumpkin]

I realize I can come across as brash, and you may not like my tone but you will not fix this issue solely on compassion. You need the right mix of rock and water to make solid concrete. It will take both a soft touch and a hard nose to fix this issue. 
I am very close to the situation, personally and geographically. The only way I see this working out is separating the abusers from the fallen on hard times. Let's not try to be more politically correct than we have to be. 
Sometimes to find solutions you need to take humanity out of the equation and speak the truth. Respect goes both ways, I see no respect for the neighbourhood, no respect for public property, no respect for businesses, and no respect for the hand that feeds them. Maybe the troubled ones I speak about only represent 60-70%. They are the ones passed out on the street corners in broad daylight, throwing their garbage from one end of st. George to the other, Let's not be too polite with the ones polluting our streets, schools, and parks with needles. 

Maybe if you were more affected personally you would see from my side of the street, where the shopping carts roll 24/7 and neighborhood kids grow up sharing space with addicts and criminals. Do your children go to EC? or what about any one of the daycares downtown? or maybe you or someone you know owns a business west end of st George, ask them why they have to lock their doors while they hang open signs. 

[lirette]

It is incredible to me the amount of people who still believe we can police ourselves out of homelessness rather than have to deal with the issues that lead to homelessness and drug addiction in the first place.

Until we address mental health, poor working conditions increased cost of housing we will be in this cycle forever no matter how many people blame the homeless for them being homeless. It won't do anything.

I don't know why there's this assumption that someone who advocates for housing somehow condones theft and other criminal behavior that a homeless person commits. I work downtown , I have seen the homeless issue rise over the last 10 years, ben yelled at by homeless, come into work everyday with them sleeping in the parking lot, fighting with each other, pissing in the middle of the sidewalk.

The bottom line is when we continue to expect the homeless to "pull up the bootstraps" when the only shelters we have currently are borderline dangerous and poorly run, and get out the pitchforks every time housing is in a location we don't like it's the definition of insanity to me.

Stable housing is one of the most important aspect of someone in recovery from drug addiction.

A small bungalow in my neighborhood that sold for under $200,000 just a few years ago is currently listed at $450,000. Rents that used to be $500-600 now over $1000. Minimum wage has not increased. The maritimes absolutely has an affordable housing problem

[theshark]

Originally Posted by lirette

It is incredible to me the amount of people who still believe we can police ourselves out of homelessness rather than have to deal with the issues that lead to homelessness and drug addiction in the first place.

Until we address mental health, poor working conditions increased cost of housing we will be in this cycle forever no matter how many people blame the homeless for them being homeless. It won't do anything.

I agree with you 100%, homelessness is not a police issue at all at the roots. It becomes a police issue because no one wants to deal with it but wants the homeless to shoo away. I’m going to tell you it’s frustrating as hell to finally get through to some of them and line them up to get help, just to find out later that the help never came through.

And forget about enforcement actions, what use is it to give a ticket to someone who can’t afford to pay it, who will eventually not pay it and serve time instead. Once you tally all the cost associated with that, it costs society a bunch of money and nothing has been solved. Its like throwing money in a fire and god knows this province can’t afford that.

Have social workers go out to them, fast track them through services, make sure that follow ups and services are provided. It will make a huge difference.

[josh_cat_eyes]

We need to treat homelessness at its roots. Drug addicts, and people mental illness make up the vast majority of the homeless population. We need a mental hospital where people can go to get care and subsidized housing, and the government can help them out with a job. Public housing for the mentally ill is a no-brainer to me.

As for drug addiction, it also often has a similar root issue. Maybe someone was abused as a kid, maybe they’re a veteran with PTSD there’s lots of reasons. But putting someone in jail who has drugs on them does nothing to fix the problem. It’s a medical issue not a criminal issue. This is why the war on drugs hasn’t worked. If we are ever going to fix this, we need to decriminalize drugs (for personal use amounts) like they have done in Portugal. Legalizing marijuana was a step in the right direction. What you do when you are caught with drugs in this new system, they are given a fine and sent to government mandated rehab facility. Reallocate money out of the prison system and help people get their life back together.

[lirette]

Originally Posted by theshark

I agree with you 100%, homelessness is not a police issue at all at the roots. It becomes a police issue because no one wants to deal with it but wants the homeless to shoo away. I’m going to tell you it’s frustrating as hell to finally get through to some of them and line them up to get help, just to find out later that the help never came through.

And forget about enforcement actions, what use is it to give a ticket to someone who can’t afford to pay it, who will eventually not pay it and serve time instead. Once you tally all the cost associated with that, it costs society a bunch of money and nothing has been solved. Its like throwing money in a fire and god knows this province can’t afford that.

Have social workers go out to them, fast track them through services, make sure that follow ups and services are provided. It will make a huge difference.

There are city's in Canada which have tried to implement fines for the homeless sleeping on the street. When inevitably the fines aren't paid they'll spend hundreds of thousands of dollars getting courts involved never to get their money back.

Make no mistake, there is funding available to to increase the housing stock, it is just not being prioritized. Instead we continue to waste more and more money on things that make it look like a solution but don't improve conditions whatsoever.

If we want our growing downtown to thrive we must do more than offer up a war on drugs (has been tried over and over and over again for 30+ years) and over policing the homeless.

I'm all for low cost units being added to new buildings as well, I think you need to approach this from many different angles, I'm just incredibly skeptical it will ever happen.

[MonctonRad]

The agenda for the November meeting of the Moncton PAC:

https://www5.moncton.ca/docs/pac/PAC/Nov..._24_novembre_2021_lordre_du_jour_CCU.pdf

I will save you the trouble of clicking on the link - there is absolutely nothing on the agenda!

Not to worry though, this has been a very busy and eventful year so far, and it sounds as if big things are coming up in the new year as well. We are just heading into the winter doldrums........

[Irish1]

Forgive me for belaboring the point, but I am amazed at the amount of typing done on this subject of homelessness with little consideration at what the problem actually is. Ironically most points made by people on opposite sides of the “issue” are usually true — but social media bandwidth is full of flames by people who cannot understand why the other side doesn’t see their point.

That’s because they are arguing about different things. There are actually several serious problems that society needs to address — and each have NOTHING to do with the other, except that the result is homelessness.

There is the issue of the working “poor” who are trying hard, but cannot seem to make ends meet. I doubt there’s a Canadian alive that would argue society shouldn’t help those who need a hand up.

Then there are the drug addicts. Completely different issue. There’s little interest in a hand up — just trying to get money to support their habit. This group is the most insidious because they are the folks who engender distain because they are either committing crimes or passed out on a sidewalk downtown.

Then there’s the mentally ill. There’s very little interest in a hand up because they don’t trust the hand. Again, I doubt most people would ague we need to help them in every effective way possible.

At issue here is that most folks sitting at a computer typing is thinking about the issue without considering the actual problems. Social or affordable housing is a great solution for the first group, but it won’t work well for most of the other two. Policing is a good solution for stealing and public intoxication of group two, but not for the other two. And we could have 2 million psychiatrists in New Brunswick, but they can’t help a mentally ill person who doesn’t want help.

If these issues are going to be discussed and solved, we need to stop mixed apples, oranges and tomatoes.

For what it’s worth, my wife will very rarely shop downtown because running the gauntlet of beggars, passed out people and those who seem unsavory is something she’s not willing to do. She’s not judging — she’s actually a much nicer person than I am — she feels scared or intimidated.

And that’s the ultimate impact of these issues: whether it’s fair or not, whether it’s deserved or not, whether you like it or not, the presence of the idle homeless hanging around an area does deter people.

I did notice that in Moncton’s plan for downtown development there were no homeless sitting around.

[Riberview]

Originally Posted by Irish1

Forgive me for belaboring the point, but I am amazed at the amount of typing done on this subject of homelessness with little consideration at what the problem actually is. Ironically most points made by people on opposite sides of the “issue” are usually true — but social media bandwidth is full of flames by people who cannot understand why the other side doesn’t see their point.

That’s because they are arguing about different things. There are actually several serious problems that society needs to address — and each have NOTHING to do with the other, except that the result is homelessness.

There is the issue of the working “poor” who are trying hard, but cannot seem to make ends meet. I doubt there’s a Canadian alive that would argue society shouldn’t help those who need a hand up.

Then there are the drug addicts. Completely different issue. There’s little interest in a hand up — just trying to get money to support their habit. This group is the most insidious because they are the folks who engender distain because they are either committing crimes or passed out on a sidewalk downtown.

Then there’s the mentally ill. There’s very little interest in a hand up because they don’t trust the hand. Again, I doubt most people would ague we need to help them in every effective way possible.

At issue here is that most folks sitting at a computer typing is thinking about the issue without considering the actual problems. Social or affordable housing is a great solution for the first group, but it won’t work well for most of the other two. Policing is a good solution for stealing and public intoxication of group two, but not for the other two. And we could have 2 million psychiatrists in New Brunswick, but they can’t help a mentally ill person who doesn’t want help.

If these issues are going to be discussed and solved, we need to stop mixed apples, oranges and tomatoes.

For what it’s worth, my wife will very rarely shop downtown because running the gauntlet of beggars, passed out people and those who seem unsavory is something she’s not willing to do. She’s not judging — she’s actually a much nicer person than I am — she feels scared or intimidated.

And that’s the ultimate impact of these issues: whether it’s fair or not, whether it’s deserved or not, whether you like it or not, the presence of the idle homeless hanging around an area does deter people.

I did notice that in Moncton’s plan for downtown development there were no homeless sitting around.

Well said.

[MonctonRad]

Do you want to have your say regarding the future urban growth strategy for the city of Moncton?

Then take this survey found on the "Lets Chat Moncton" webpage, sponsored by the city of Moncton.

This is your big chance to help influence the future direction of the city:

https://live.metroquestsurvey.com/?u=td44o#!/?p=web&pm=dynamic&s=1&popup=WTD

Hint - there are several places in the webform where you can type in your own personal reflections as to what the city should be concentrating on in the future. These are very important to thoughtfully fill out. Most of the "yes/no" responses are pretty much motherhood statements.

[MonctonRad]

Here's the address for a City of Moncton web app which provides an interactive map of the city, including planning and development zoning and priorities. It's kinda neat:

https://moncton.maps.arcgis.com/apps/web...ytdiB-11xVfJ3qTsSYRob98fl4oeNz4cya0ZoUwE

[MonctonRad]

Municipalities to get increased role in social issues under N.B.'s proposed reforms
Inclusive zoning among changes in white paper released last week
Shane Magee · CBC News · Posted: Nov 22, 2021 7:00 AM AT | Last Updated: 1 hour ago
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/municipal-reform-housing-homelessness-1.6255217

Moncton Mayor Dawn Arnold welcomed news the Southeast Regional Service Commission would take a greater role in addressing social issues.

"It is not a secret to anyone that some of the social issues that we are being challenged with in our community right now are regional issues," Arnold said.

Dieppe's Mayor Yvon Lapierre said his city, Moncton and Riverview should work together to implement a regional approach on inclusive zoning.

Meghan Cross, a spokesperson for Riverview, confirmed the town plans to work with Moncton and Dieppe on implementing inclusionary zoning once the Community Planning Act is amended next year.

[MonctonRad]

Still no official map of the City of Moncton's new boundaries, but these details were made available in todays T&T:

- will include 7% of the current Moncton LSD.
- the population of the city will increase by 682 souls (to 75,571).
- $69M will be added to the city's tax assessment base (to $8.93B)

The lands to be included will all be adjacent to the city's NW end, and will extend out to (and include):

- Briggs Cross Road (between Gorge Road and Rte 126).
- The northwestern tip of Mountain Road, up to where it intersects Rte. 126.
- Land surrounding Berry Mills Road extending west to the TCH.

Based on this GNB map of the Moncton civic boundaries, this would appear to be the area to be incorporated into the municipality:



https://www.gnb.ca/0113/maps/Municipal-Maps-2012/Moncton_12.pdf

[Feneant]

Until the city gets off their a@@ and brings city services like sewer and water to those areas the people living there are not going to be happy. This is nothing more than a greed play to get added tax income while not having to do anything more for the people living there.

[adamuptownsj]

Originally Posted by Feneant

Until the city gets off their a@@ and brings city services like sewer and water to those areas the people living there are not going to be happy. This is nothing more than a greed play to get added tax income while not having to do anything more for the people living there.

Fredericton extended services to a recently annexed neighbourhood like three years ago at immense cost and almost no one bit.

[habs33]

Not construction related but the Snowbirds released their 2022 schedule and Moncton is on it for June 29

https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=281389950681058&set=a.244751861011534