The Great Canadian Transit Thread

[SFUVancouver]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

When was that dark decade? It seems like Vancouver is the only city that has been continuously been expanding it's network over the last 35 years, with Calgary coming in second.

[...]

I would say that progress was made, despite the Provincial government's interference.

A very not-so-quick history lesson: Translink was created by the Province in 1999 to download and delegate regional transportation planning, funding, procurement, and operation from the provincial level (BC Transit) to the local/regional level in Metro Vancouver. Central to this grand bargain, which included uploading some responsibilities from the region to province, shifting debt, etc., was a promise of additional funding tools to enable Translink to fulfill its mandate and obligations. The additional funding mechanism was originally going to be a car registration tax but this was withdrawn at the last moment by the (outgoing) NDP government and the (incoming) Liberal government promised in its campaigning to provide an alternate and better permanent long-term funding tool. This never happened.

In 2005, in the midst of years of back and forth wrangling about the promised funding tools between the Translink Board and the provincial government, the Canada Line was put forward by the Province as a fait acompli for the next rapid transit line, skipping over the planned Evergreen Line. The Translink Board voted it down twice before approving it, mostly to demonstrate that it was an independent body and the Province was dealing with it in bad faith.

Furthermore, the Province issued the RFP for the Canada Line and it called for undersized capacity for such an important trunk line and specifically excluded economies of scale and efficiencies that would be realized from integration with the existing system from the evaluation of bidders. This resulted in the SNC-Lavalin-based team winning with a bid that introduced new trains that were physically incompatible with the existing system (width, platform height, train control system, etc.) and required a whole new operations and maintenance and train storage yard and permanently prevents interoperability between the Canada Line and the rest of the SkyTrain system. This was a colossally shortsighted move, the negative impacts of which will be felt in perpetuity.

Now, the Canada Line, setting aside the trainset decisions, was still the right line to build since it was integral to the Olympics in 2010. But the back and forth and multiple Translink Board votes infuriated the Provincial government and in 2007 the Province imposed legislation arbitrarily restructuring Translink. It removed the non-partisan airport and port authority-style Translink Board of experts that had been running Translink for almost a decade and replaced it with a Mayors Council and a Provincially-appointed Executive Board. The Provincial Government would define the transit plan for Translink and the Mayors Council would be responsible for approving the plan and figuring out the funding. If they disagreed with the Province's plan or voted down anything, the Provincially-appointed Executive Board was empowered to proceed anyway.

The only way that Translink could raise the ongoing revenue required to operate and maintain the regional transit system and the regional major road network, including major new Provincially-mandated capital projects like the over-built/money-losing Golden Ears toll bridge and the successful but expensive Canada Line, all while providing population growth-driven increases in bus service, was to significantly increase transit fares, the regional Translink gas tax, parking tax, and Hydro levy. These increases were supremely unpopular in Metro Vancouver after years of Provincial transit funding promises, and the timing of them being phased in as the 2008 Great Recession loomed only added insult to injury.

This hopelessly politicized system led to round after round of fighting between the Mayors Council and the Provincial Government. The Province put forward a fantastically ambitious 2008 Provincial Transit Plan for Translink and campaigned on it in that year's election (arguably earning reelection in large part from Metro Vancouver ridings swayed by its scope and promised major funding increases). However, once re-elected, the Province left it up to the Mayors Council to figure out how to fund the new SkyTrain lines, bus service, and new bridges, and every one of the Mayors Council funding proposals was rejected by the Provincial Government.

Meanwhile, the Province approved the Evergreen Line but refused to provide Translink with new tools to fund its share of the line’s capital cost and its operation, let alone the investment in new bus service that would be required for the suburban Tri-City area to access and utilize the new line. An agreement was eventually struck in which the Mayors Council agreed to temporarily increase the gas tax to pay for its share of the Evergreen Line upfront capital costs, with the explicit promise from the Province that it would provide Translink with replacement long-term funding for the line’s operation and associated bus service by the time the temporary gas tax increase expired. The Province reneged on this promise as soon as the gas tax went up.

Fast forward a few more fractious years and in 2015 the Province announced that it would be prepared to increase the PST in Metro Vancouver by 0.5% (that worked out to about 25 cents a day per household) in order to fund its 2008 Provincial Transit Plan promises, but before it would do so, it would require a successful result from a new transit funding referendum and all future funding increases for Translink would also be required to be passed by referendum. This new wholly unprecedented policy was announced during a time when the Province was making billions upon billions of investments in the region's highway infrastructure without any requirement for local capital funding participation or approval by referendum.

After being starved of funds since day one and forced to impose unpopular fare increases and gas and parking taxes to help fulfill the unfunded budget shortfalls associated with operating the new SkyTrain lines, Translink was ridiculed in the press by the Province and anti-transit polemicists as being wasteful, incompetent, and unable to fulfill the Province's unfunded 2008 Provincial Transit Plan. Deferred maintenance, aging equipment, and calamitous weather caused several never-seen-before delays and full system shutdowns of the SkyTrain system and the lack of spare buses and the lingering effects of budget-driven driver hiring freezes meant that Translink could do little to help the hundreds of thousands of people regularly struggling to get through their commutes. And all of this occurred during the run-up to the referendum. Unsurprisingly, it failed.

Fortunately, the situation has dramatically changed. The new Provincial Government eliminated the Translink Executive Board and fully empowered the Mayors Council. The Mayors laid out their three-phase 10 Year Plan, which is almost identical to the 2008 Provincial Transit Plan, just a decade later, and between the Province, Federal Government, and an empowered Translink, funding has been secured for the first two phases.

That gets us to where we are today, with long, long overdue investments being made in bus service, new SeaBuses, SkyTrain station renovations and expansion, new SkyTrain cars, and the first phase of the Millennium Line extension to UBC and the Surrey-Langley rapid transit system approved, funded, and moving forward. Shovels should be in the ground for the Millennium Line expansion by 2020, the year when the original 2008 Provincial Transit Plan promised the full line to UBC would be operational.

The recent investments have resulted in ridership surging like a coiled spring and for the last several years Translink has experienced some of the largest ridership growth in North America:

2014->15 364.3M boardings +2.0% (averaging 20,274 additional daily boardings)
2015->16 386.2M boardings +6.0% (averaging 60,000 additional daily boardings) | 234.2M journeys (Compass begins tracking journeys; 1st tap to last, regardless of transfers, is 1 journey)
2016->17 408.2M boardings +5.7% (averaging 60,274 additional daily boardings) | 247.8M journeys +5.8% (averaging 37,260 additional daily journeys)
2017->18 437.4M boardings +7.2% (averaging 80,000 additional daily boardings) | 262.6M journeys +6.0% (averaging 40,548 additional daily journeys)

[J.OT13]

Thanks for that history! From the outside looking in, everything looked peachy but clearly there were some major issues.

It seems political interference is rampant in Canada, especially when it comes to transit. We've seen it in Ottawa with the original N/S plan cancellation in 2006 (in hindsight, it was probably best), we've seen it in Toronto for the past two decades and now it seems to be taking hold in Québec with the new CAQ government.

[ssiguy]

Thanks for the Translink backgrounder SFUVancouver, very informative.

It is clear that transit ridership in Greater Vancouver is rising, if for no other reason than we pay 40% more for a litre of gas than Toronto. I will say thou that one must be very cautious about ridership reports that only report the number of trips as opposed to the passengers as this can be very deceptive. As an example, I lived in White Rock both before and after the Canada Line opened. Before it opened the #351 bus went right from downtown WR to downtown Vancouver. When the CL opened we had to transfer onto the CL at Bridgeport.................all of a sudden we went from being one passenger trip to 2 even though we started and ended at the same destinations.

Vancouver is also very unique in that it has absolutely no buses that run from any area of the city to another municipality. The system is very divided so geographically and it's transit service system. In Toronto you can take one single bus and ride right acorss the entire city north/south or east/west while In Vancouver in the same geographic size, that is impossible hence a transfer and hence another trip.

Just trip numbers make transit planner glee like they are properly doing their jobs and of course politicians milk it for all it's worth but it is a deceptive system. Just stating paying passengers also is problematic as many systems offer free rides to those under 12 but a lot don't. A truly fair comparison would be reporting of both riders and passenger trips.

[nname]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

As an example, I lived in White Rock both before and after the Canada Line opened. Before it opened the #351 bus went right from downtown WR to downtown Vancouver. When the CL opened we had to transfer onto the CL at Bridgeport.................all of a sudden we went from being one passenger trip to 2 even though we started and ended at the same destinations.

It goes both ways. I used to take bus to/from SkyTrain before Evergreen extension opens, but now I have one-seat ride on SkyTrain to the same destination. So my trip went from 4 boardings all the way down to 1. This probably the same for most people who commute from the Tri-Cities (note: TransLink do NOT count transfer between Expo and Millennium line as separate boardings)

The same will probably happen when Broadway and Langley extension opens, as some trips will no longer require a transfer to/from bus.

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Vancouver is also very unique in that it has absolutely no buses that run from any area of the city to another municipality. The system is very divided so geographically and it's transit service system. In Toronto you can take one single bus and ride right acorss the entire city north/south or east/west while In Vancouver in the same geographic size, that is impossible hence a transfer and hence another trip.

I don't get what you mean... Buses in Vancouver span through the entire city and most East-West route even cross into Burnaby. It's just the most buses stop when it meets a SkyTrain station, and you'll have to transfer to another bus to go to the other side of the station. Isn't this the same in Toronto where many routes breaks at Yonge?

[p_xavier]

And yet I've still have to get actual data that the Canada Line was under built. It's more like an urban legend now. Even with the new trainset order, it's still at its half potential capacity.

[SFUVancouver]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

Thanks for the Translink backgrounder SFUVancouver, very informative.

It is clear that transit ridership in Greater Vancouver is rising, if for no other reason than we pay 40% more for a litre of gas than Toronto. I will say thou that one must be very cautious about ridership reports that only report the number of trips as opposed to the passengers as this can be very deceptive. As an example, I lived in White Rock both before and after the Canada Line opened. Before it opened the #351 bus went right from downtown WR to downtown Vancouver. When the CL opened we had to transfer onto the CL at Bridgeport.................all of a sudden we went from being one passenger trip to 2 even though we started and ended at the same destinations.

Vancouver is also very unique in that it has absolutely no buses that run from any area of the city to another municipality. The system is very divided so geographically and it's transit service system. In Toronto you can take one single bus and ride right acorss the entire city north/south or east/west while In Vancouver in the same geographic size, that is impossible hence a transfer and hence another trip.

Just trip numbers make transit planner glee like they are properly doing their jobs and of course politicians milk it for all it's worth but it is a deceptive system. Just stating paying passengers also is problematic as many systems offer free rides to those under 12 but a lot don't. A truly fair comparison would be reporting of both riders and passenger trips.

Good point about boardings vs journeys. I added boarding and journey data from Translink (pg 7) to my original post. Here it is again, too:

2014->15 364.3M boardings +2.0% (averaging 20,274 additional daily boardings)
2015->16 386.2M boardings +6.0% (averaging 60,000 additional daily boardings) | 234.2M journeys (Compass begins tracking journeys; 1st tap to last, regardless of transfers, is 1 journey)
2016->17 408.2M boardings +5.7% (averaging 60,274 additional daily boardings) | 247.8M journeys +5.8% (averaging 37,260 additional daily journeys)
2017->18 437.4M boardings +7.2% (averaging 80,000 additional daily boardings) | 262.6M journeys +6.0% (averaging 40,548 additional daily journeys)

As for there being no buses that travel between municipalities or sub-areas of the region, that's not necessarily true. There are buses between the North Shore municipalities and downtown Vancouver (250 & 257), the 95 B-Line from downtown Vancouver to SFU in Burnaby has been running for ages as the 135, there are numerous buses between Burnaby and Vancouver (19, 41, 43, 49, 430), the 130 connects the North Shore to Burnaby, the 100 connects New Westminster and Richmond, the 351 connects Richmond to Surrey, the 601 and 620 connect Richmond to Delta, the 555 connects Surrey to Burnaby, the 595 connects Maple Ridge to Langley, and the 701 and 791 connect Burnaby and the Tri-Cities to Pitt Meadows and Maple Ridge.

I'm sure there are more, I just skimmed the key regional transit connections system map.

A last thought, an airline considers each person travelling on their planes to be a passenger. If they connect to a second flight, that’s considered two passengers.

[nname]

Originally Posted by SFUVancouver

I'm sure there are more, I just skimmed the key regional transit connections system map.

I was going to list all the routes that cross municipality boundary, but just realized how foolish I was. I think transit system in Vancouver is known for cross municipal boundaries as if there were nothing. By a quick count, there are actually more routes that crosses boundary than those that doesn't! (of course, this also have to do with the foolish division between.. say North Vancouver City/DM, and Langley City/Township, etc)

Or looking at this another way... There are a total of 33 different ways to cross municipality boundaries by road and bridges within Metro Vancouver, and there are 34 different ways you can cross boundary by transit here (even though one of them skipped through a municipality without having a stop).

[ssiguy]

All of the City of Toronto {pop 3.1 million} is one a grid so many buses cross the entire city N/S & S/W far more than Vancouver. Sort of imagine the entire Zone 1 & 2 area being one solid land mass and most routes going from one end all the way to the other.

[nname]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

All of the City of Toronto {pop 3.1 million} is one a grid so many buses cross the entire city N/S & S/W far more than Vancouver. Sort of imagine the entire Zone 1 & 2 area being one solid land mass and most routes going from one end all the way to the other.

As mentioned before, almost all route in Toronto does not go across the city. They breaks at Young.

According to this article, the longest (round-trip) non-night routes across Toronto are:

54A Lawrence East: 53.9 km
501 Queen: 50.8 km
52B Lawrence West: 47.6 km

In comparison, the longest routes within the city of Vancouver are:

41 Joyce/UBC: 55.3 km
49 Metrotown/UBC: 54.0 km
25 Brentwood/UBC: 53.2 km

They are pretty much comparable.

On the other hand, the longest route in suburb in Vancouver is more than 90 km round-trip...

[Doady]

I think that is not completely accurate to say Toronto's system is one grid. Most of the north-south bus routes start and terminate at Bloor/Danforth, similar to how most of the east-west routes start/terminate at Yonge.

Unless there are some priority measures for buses to improve their reliability, there is a limit to how long the routes can be. Maybe 60 or 70 minute run time or 10-12km length in each direction at most. Any longer and buses could have trouble keeping up with the schedule, unless there are layover time adde to the middle of the trip, which kinda negate the whoe purpose merging routes to begin.

I wouldn't expect to see bus routes in Vancouver merged with buses in Richmond for example.

It might also be hard to have the same bus route with the same frequency serving one area and also another area far away. Maybe the demand is very different and so different level of service is required in different areas.

I think overall service in Vancouver is probably better integrated than Toronto area. I wish Toronto was one system like Vancouver. But as I said, there aren't actually that many opportunities to combine routes as you might think since these all these individial agencies each serve their own already large area with already long bus routes.

[Reecemartin]

Originally Posted by ssiguy

All of the City of Toronto {pop 3.1 million} is one a grid so many buses cross the entire city N/S & S/W far more than Vancouver. Sort of imagine the entire Zone 1 & 2 area being one solid land mass and most routes going from one end all the way to the other.

False, lines EW break at Yonge and do not service the entire width of the city.

This is why there are Finch West and Finch East buses for example.

[Reecemartin]

After spending some time in the K-W region and hearing the great news about the opening date finally being set, we've decided to make a flyover analysis of the Waterloo ION LRT Line! Enjoy!

https://youtu.be/v2o7ozV-o8c

[Coldrsx]

A neat closeup of the epicentre of our Downtown and our new Valley Line LRT.


http://connect2edmonton.com/showthread.p...s-Under-Construction&p=932748#post932748
karlwas on C2E

[J.OT13]

Confederation Line's four retail opportunities at four stations.

General lines, the City is looking for one operator to take up the four retail spaces under a 5 year contract, with possibility of extending for an additional 5 years (total of 10 years, then you're out). Offers to be submitted by June 26th at 4 p.m.


Tunney's

• Located in the middle of the main concourse level overlooking the west side of the train platform in the fare-paid zone
• Customers access the train platform via stairs, escalators and elevators which are located on both sides of the retail space, therefore generating lots of foot traffic and visibility.
• The retail space is partially enclosed to the elements and public washrooms are available at this station. The size of the retail space is approximately 34 m2 or 366 ft2, as depicted by the red outline in the Tunney’s Pasture Station Retail Plan.
• The size of the retail space is approximately 34 m2 or 366 ft2 as depicted by the red outline in the diagram below
• The estimated 2021 AM peak hour customer activity for Tunney’s Pasture Station total 12,880
• The estimated AM peak hour customer activity once Stage 2 extensions are in place for Tunney's Pasture Station total 3,607. The estimated volumes increase to a total 3,937 for the 2031 AP peak hour estimates.

Hurdman

• The designated retail space at Hurdman Station is located in an open, outdoor area underneath the train platform.
• Visibility and access for customers in the fare-paid zone is excellent, with an opportunity for a small seating area should the tenant choose to include it in their design.
• The space is located about halfway between the main fare gates and the bus loop, capturing a large influx of customers.
• Designated as a major transit hub with multi-use pathways for cyclists and pedestrians, and transit connections from the east, south, west, and north ends of the city.
• Public washrooms are available at this station.
• The size of the retail space is approximately 34 m2 or 366 ft2, as depicted by the red outline in the outline below.
• The estimated 2021 AM peak hour customer activity for Hurdman Station total 5,830
• The estimated AM peak hour customer activity once Stage 2 extensions are in place for Hurdman Station total 7,038. The estimated volumes increase to a total 7,536 for the 2031 AM peak hour estimates.

Blair

• The designated retail space at Blair Station is located at the main lower entrance level in the fare-paid zone.
• Customers will pass the retail space en route to the escalators, stairs and elevators in order to make their way to the train platform above.
• The space has excellent visibility and sight lines to the public concourse area.
• Public washrooms are available at this station.
• The size of the retail space is approximately 24 m2 or 258 ft2, as depicted by the red outline below.
• The estimated 2021 AM peak hour customer activity for Blair Station total 9,220.
• The estimated AM peak hour customer activity once Stage 2 extensions are in place for Blair Station total 3,795. The estimated volumes increase to a total 4,251 for the 2031 AM peak hour estimates.

Rideau

• The designated retail space at Rideau Station is located underground, in the public concourse, outside of the fare-paid zone.
• Customers will pass the retail space in order to access the platform located nearby.
• The design of the space is similar to Blair Station, located in a corner with excellent visibility and sightlines.
• Public washrooms are not available at this station.
• The size of the retail space is approximately 15 m2 or 161 ft2, as depicted by the red outline in the diagram.
• Customer activity at Rideau Station will increase gradually and will not change significantly once Stage 2 extensions are in place
• The estimated AM peak hour customer activity once Stage 2 extensions are in place for Rideau Station total 4,820. These estimated volumes increase to a total 5,319 for the 2031 AM peak hour estimates.

More info available on the City's website.

https://ottawa.ca/en/business/doing-busi...n-confederation-line-light-rail-stations

[Reecemartin]

Metrolinx made some very important announcements yesterday about the GO Transit expansion: Here's my recap video and some opinions I have about it:

https://youtu.be/2rtWTixss-U

Let me know what you think. Would love more discussion about this.

[Chadillaccc]

The GO expansion is crazy impressive. Happy to see it going so big-league.

[J.OT13]

Some shots from O-Train Fans. This is the eastern end of the line headed west.

Blair, the eastern terminus. It will be in the top tree in terms of ridership until Stage 2 Est opens in 2024.


Bus drop-off within the fare-paid zone, where thousand suburban east-end riders will transfer.


Re-purposed Transitway pedestrian link over the bus drop-off, rail station and across the Queesway serving an office park and residential area.


Art work along the tracks.


Bike racks.

Cyrville, a neighborhood station. Expected to have the lowest ridership until Stage 2 East opens in 2024 (or possibly Stage 2 West in 2025).


MUP pathway along the track. We can see the stations art piece, stainless steel trees at centre-left.


West entrance.


East entrance. Fare gates for this entrance are at platform level.

St-Laurent, Currently the only underground station outside downtown (one of two after Stage 2). Much of the station is retained from its 30 years as a BRT station. It will be a major transfer between inner-urban east-end bus routes and the rail line.


Direct indoor entrance to St-Laurent Shopping Centre.


Stations mid-level, mall's entrance is behind the photographer.


View down to track level.


Tremblay, connection to VIA Rail, and across a pedestrian bridge over the Queensway is Ottawa's minor league baseball park and a major hotel/conference centre.


Station entrance.


Artwork as part of covered path to VIA Rail.


Entrance concourse.


Platforms with VIA Station to the right.

Hurdman, transfer station between Line 1 and the S/E BRT Transitway. Expected to be a high volume station, as it was in the Transitway days.


Fare-paid bus-loop to the right, O-Train Station to the left.


Artwork at main entrance.

Many more pictures available on the website for those interested.

https://www.otrainfans.ca/blogs/snapshot...laurent-tremblay-and-hurdman-may-31-2019

[Reecemartin]

I did a flyover analysis of OTrain Line 1, check it out here!

https://youtu.be/xJcUKRsE5IE

[le calmar]

Nice update. Can-Am league is pro (or semi-pro?) as far as I know and not a minor league, but yeah, it looks like one with only a handful of teams. And I can't believe the only mall besides Rideau taking advantage from a direct connection to rapid transit is borderline a dead mall. Perhaps the switch to LRT will improve the situation.

[Taeolas]

Originally Posted by le calmar

Nice update. Can-Am league is pro (or semi-pro?) as far as I know and not a minor league, but yeah, it looks like one with only a handful of teams. And I can't believe the only mall besides Rideau taking advantage from a direct connection to rapid transit is borderline a dead mall. Perhaps the switch to LRT will improve the situation.

Which mall do you mean? The Gloucester Centre?

St Laurant and Rideau both have always had a strong transit connection and still do with the O-Train. But the Gloucester mall is basically your standard suburban Zellars mall, a big anchor, a grocery store and misc smaller stores to serve the locals. So it wasn't really much to do with the transit even in its heyday.