Sports in Canadian culture

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by logan5

The CFL is a 2nd tier league. Sorry but it's true. The Argos just aren't all that significant in Toronto. Just like a Memorial Cup in Vancouver didn't designate Vancouver a championship city.

The only real indication of that is that CFL player's salaries are small. Other than that, I think it's right up there with any of the major leagues. WHL's hockey quality is noticeably lower than the NHL's. I really only watch the CFL but also watch NFL on occasion and I don't see nearly the same jump in skill.

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by TownGuy

Oh lord do people elsewhere in Canada truly believe this? It has absolutely NOTHING to do with that. I feel the same way about the CFL that I do the USA based MLS. They are not the best league in the world for their sport. For football it's the NFL for soccer it's the Premier league.

But why should that make a team irrelevant? Do you think Barcelona fans care more about the Premier League than their own team?

[TownGuy]

Originally Posted by Prometheus

I am shocked at how low those numbers are, especially considering how hot the Raptors have been and the massive hype they and this playoff series have been getting in the local and national media. Those numbers are less than 1/3rd of the viewers a CFL playoff game receives. The Argos attracted 1.7 million (3.1 million peak) viewers for their playoff game in November:

http://www.tsn.ca/cfl/story/?id=436925

I wouldn't compare game 1 of a 7 game series in the first round of the playoffs to an elimination game in the eastern finals involving two rivals in the same country. Just sayin.

[logan5]

Supply and Demand. Low supply of football plat-off games generates high demand which in turn generates higher ratings. If CFL play-offs had 7 game series, ratings would plummet. More supply = less demand. That's how I see it anyways. I know others don't.

[GlassCity]

I think it's a combination of both. If the CFL had 7 game series ratings would absolutely fall. At the same time, I think it'd be hard to argue that nationwide football isn't more popular than basketball.

[TownGuy]

Originally Posted by GlassCity

But why should that make a team irrelevant? Do you think Barcelona fans care more about the Premier League than their own team?

They arent irrelevant, just on the next rung of teams after the big 3 franchises. I would include them with TFC and perhaps the Toronto Rock. Argos being the most popular of the 3.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by TownGuy

Oh lord do people elsewhere in Canada truly believe this? It has absolutely NOTHING to do with that. I feel the same way about the CFL that I do the USA based MLS. They are not the best league in the world for their sport. For football it's the NFL for soccer it's the Premier league.

I have my my doubts that the PL is the best soccer league in the world, like the NFL it is the most hyped. I believe last year the Bundesliga was rated the best league in the world. La Liga for years was better than the EPL.

So you Toronto people who wannabe the "best" do you ever not eat at Rotten Rons or is it always the Park Plaza?

[elly63]

Originally Posted by logan5

The CFL is a 2nd tier league. Sorry but it's true.

That's right, its a fact! Even though it's only your uninformed opinion. But it's true all right!

[Prometheus]

Originally Posted by TownGuy

I wouldn't compare game 1 of a 7 game series in the first round of the playoffs to an elimination game in the eastern finals involving two rivals in the same country. Just sayin.

I wouldn't compare the major-league Raptors playing a massively hyped game in the world-famous NBA playoffs in the land of Wiggins and crucible of contemporary Canadian basketball to the virtually ignored Argos playing in a 2nd tier league where the CFL is supposedly irrelevant and universally derided. Just sayin.

I mean it would be embarrassing if the bush league Argos attracted more than three times the viewers than a major league NBA playoff game featuring Canada's basketball team, regardless of the excuse.

[logan5]

Originally Posted by elly63

That's right, its a fact! Even though it's only your uninformed opinion. But it's true all right!

What? The NFL is the top tier for football, then CFL. Right?

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Prometheus

I am shocked at how low those numbers are, especially considering how hot the Raptors have been and the massive hype they and this playoff series have been getting in the local and national media. Those numbers are less than 1/3rd of the viewers a CFL playoff game receives. Even the Argos, playing in a region where the CFL is supposedly irrelevant, attracted 1.7 million (3.1 million peak) viewers during their all-southwestern Ontario playoff game against Hamilton in November:

You ever wonder what's going on when we see things like TV ratings and the poll below. When the owners of the teams control most of the media, objectivity goes out the window. And when they own every team except two (Argos, Rock), guess who gets the shaft? The people are speaking but the conglomerates don't seem to be listening.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by logan5

Supply and Demand. Low supply of football plat-off games generates high demand which in turn generates higher ratings. If CFL play-offs had 7 game series, ratings would plummet. More supply = less demand. That's how I see it anyways. I know others don't.

So hockey and baseball ratings would skyrocket with half the games?

[Nathan]

Originally Posted by TownGuy

Oh lord do people elsewhere in Canada truly believe this? It has absolutely NOTHING to do with that. I feel the same way about the CFL that I do the USA based MLS. They are not the best league in the world for their sport. For football it's the NFL for soccer it's the Premier league.

It actually is based on that premise though... If a league is relevant in the USA it gets the major corporate and media support of the USA... which makes them by default the richest leagues of their type in the world... which then means they can afford to buy the top players for that specific sport... Canadian media/corporations can't/won't compete with that with our own league.

This isn't even taking into account that their college system acts as basically the single richest feeder system in the world.

If the USA as a whole actually cared about hockey, we'd probably be down to 3 teams at the most as it would be impossible to compete with their wealth (especially when our exchange rate was at $0.60 and Canadian teams were bleeding money).

The fact that the CFL has actually survived is pretty amazing when you consider our media companies would never be willing to dish out $17+ Billion dollars a year in media rights (the new Rogers hockey contract doesn't even get close to that in Canada), not to mention the massive corporate sponsorships/publicly funded billion dollar stadiums. That and the fact that for many years our major media constant either ignored/dismissed the league.

[TownGuy]

Interesting poll. When and where is that from? Im most surprised by how the Jays were almost aspopular as the Leafs there. Thats why I wonder when it was from. Toronto sports fans seem to go with the flavour of the day in regards to the Raptors and Jays. Raptors being on an upswing right now they would probably do better.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by Prometheus

I wouldn't compare the major-league Raptors playing a massively hyped game in the world-famous NBA playoffs in the land of Wiggins and crucible of contemporary Canadian basketball to the virtually ignored Argos playing in a 2nd tier league where the CFL is supposedly irrelevant and universally derided. Just sayin.

I mean it would be embarrassing if the bush league Argos attracted more than three times the viewers than a major league NBA playoff game featuring Canada's basketball team, regardless of the excuse.

Love the irony! Just sayin

You know it would be embarrassing if the bush league Argos attracted more than three times the viewers than a major league NBA playoff game featuring Canada's basketball team. But no one in the GTA watches the Argos, it's only the people of Saskatchewan. What was the rating 1.5 million? And Saskatchewan only has a million people total, wait we're 500k short!

Little known fact, the Argos garnered a 100 share, of infants aged 1-3 years in the province of Saskatchewan, sorry but it's true.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by TownGuy

Interesting poll. When and where is that from? Im most surprised by how the Jays were almost aspopular as the Leafs there. Thats why I wonder when it was from. Toronto sports fans seem to go with the flavour of the day in regards to the Raptors and Jays. Raptors being on an upswing right now they would probably do better.

It's from a CTV online poll on April 4/2014 that came after a story about the Jays season opener so you think it would be biased toward the Jays. While not scientific, I tracked the poll over the last 800 votes and it remained consistant with TFC just recently edging over the 10% bracket. They were at 9% throughout the poll.

[GlassCity]

Originally Posted by logan5

What? The NFL is the top tier for football, then CFL. Right?

Honestly, I might have to disagree. I think American and Canadian football is different enough that you can't make statements like that. For example, I really enjoy the CFL but I can't watch the NFL at all because it's so damn slow. It's not a patriotic thing either: If the leagues switched rules I'd only watch the NFL and wouldn't watch the CFL. I'd say that both the NFL and the CFL are the top tier for their respective sports.

[TownGuy]

Originally Posted by elly63

It's from a CTV online poll on April 4/2014 that came after a story about the Jays season opener so you think it would be biased toward the Jays. While not scientific, I tracked the poll over the last 800 votes and it remained consistant with TFC just recently edging over the 10% bracket. They were at 9% throughout the poll.

That would explain why the Raptors did so poorly. They seem to have the youngest fanbase of any of the franchises. Not the type that would be voting on a CTV poll.

[elly63]

Originally Posted by TownGuy

That would explain why the Raptors did so poorly. They seem to have the youngest fanbase of any of the franchises. Not the type that would be voting on a CTV poll.

Well, if they're that young who are the people buying the tickets at those outrageous prices?

[elly63]

If I may, I'll repost the interview with Carleton basketball coach Dave Smart (21:40). He explains in a way they might be able to understand, to the fantasy league, playoff pool playing wannabe water cooler types, attracted by the hype of puppies and shiny objects, how the real world operates.

Take the time to listen, and learn that sometimes things aren't as they seem. But unfortunately, I suppose they won't learn because the glare of the hype is too much.

Interesting quote from the interview: Aaron Doornekamp (Carleton) was the 51st ranked player in his year (class) in Canada. So of all the higher ranked players ahead of him who went to the NCAA, he is the only one left (since 2009) still playing professional basketball (Germany). He was named CIS Men's Basketball Player of the year in 2008.