Winnipeg Retail

[optimusREIM]

Originally Posted by Biff

Interesting...I didn't know that Guess, Fossil, Coach, Le Creuset, Champs, American Eagle, Lego, Harry Rosen, Foot Locker, Apple, Vans, H&M, Soft Moc and Shoppers Drug Mart were "ghost retailers". They are all north of centre court. Apple is relocating to centre court as we speak so I guess they could be considered on the non-ghost retailer side of the mall. Foot Locker is investing in the dead side of the mall and poor Nike is looking at putting a flagship in the "dead" part of the mall.

It's no use pointing out facts, nostradamus is very invested in arguing his version of reality.

[Authentic_City]

Originally Posted by Winnipeg Grump

I mean, Rodd & Gunn opened up a full store up on the second floor right by the escalators. That's a premium brand just for men...

Yeah, thanks, Rodd & Gunn is one of the few stores left that really appeals to me. Personally, the loss of the Bay was pretty significant. I supported the Downtown store as long as possible, then Polo Park. With that gone, what's left in Polo? If you select the category "Men's Apparel" on the website, here's what is listed: American Eagle, Bluenote, Bootlegger, H&M, Harry Rosen, JD Sports, lululemon, Mark's (not even in the mall?), Moose Knuckles, Oak & Fort, Rod & Gun, Roots, RW & Co, TipTop and Zara. It's pretty slim pickings as far as I'm concerned. But again, I'm not looking for youth oriented fast fashion, branded sweatshirts or whatever Moose Knuckles sells (outerwear, maybe?).

I wouldn't say there are "dead mall vibes", but I think Polo has been getting a bit of negative press from some violent altercations, and I'm not sure what will fill the Bay space - maybe not even be retail space (office space, call centre?). I was being dramatic for effect when I said retail is dead and dying, but I do think Polo needs to pivot in new directions to keep their property viable. As we've discussed here, adding residential, entertainment, grocery, etc. in a mixed use redevelopment seems the way of the future.

[bon_vivant]

Bring back Kresge's department store while you're at it. Ah never mind, the Apple Store just took its old spot. I dunno, PP seems to be doing fine despite the bad press. Maybe the old Bay space will be divided up like they did with Eaton's at St-V. Or maybe a mall extension. How about Bretton's? Oops. There I go again...

[SpongeG]

Originally Posted by CoryB

That portfolio is full of dead mall vibes. Some of the large mall operators in the USA facing the reality of the 2008 economic recession noticed countless retailers going bankrupt and scaring their properties with vacant and effectively unleasable spaces. What they then started doing was buying up store brands out of bankruptcy and operating them as these sort of ghost stores. They have inventory, they sell stuff, but their main purpose to to be a liminal place until something better needs the space.

That Eddie Baurer is closing in the dead mall wing of Polo Park is itself somewhat ironic. It also has not operated continuously in Polo having previously closed after either the 2003 or 2009 bankruptcy.

Filling your mall spaces with Calendar Club, Eddie Baurer, Aeropostale, Nine West, Lucky Brand, etc. doesn't fool anyone that matters to retail leasing. The desperation is clear and everyone knows what is going on. That Polo has all the high value tenants clustered on the south side of center court and mostly ghost retailers on the north side of the mall is definitely no accident.

to be fair thats a problem all the malls in Canada are dealing with, no department stores left, Simons are nice but they aren't department stores and they are constantly dropping brands and labels at least at the Park Royal store does that. A lot of retailers have pulled out of Canada and others just don't seem interested.
Zara could bring in its other brands which are in almost every mall in Mexico that I have been to, like Bershka, Pull & Bear, Oysho and Strativarius, they do ofer online shopping in Canada but no stores so there is hope that they open stores.
Mango is in Canada its a Zara competitor from Spain, they have stores so far only in Ontario and Quebec, doesn't seem like they are quick to expand beyond yet.
Decathalon is a store that usually opens very big stores, but I don't know if Canadians are into them, they closed two of their Toronto stores.
I'm watching a walking tour of South Coast Plaza in California, holy crap that mall has every luxury brand that exists. Not many places in Canada could support such tenants.
Retail in Canada is kinda sucking.

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

to be fair thats a problem all the malls in Canada are dealing with, no department stores left, Simons are nice but they aren't department stores and they are constantly dropping brands and labels at least at the Park Royal store does that. A lot of retailers have pulled out of Canada and others just don't seem interested.
Zara could bring in its other brands which are in almost every mall in Mexico that I have been to, like Bershka, Pull & Bear, Oysho and Strativarius, they do ofer online shopping in Canada but no stores so there is hope that they open stores.
Mango is in Canada its a Zara competitor from Spain, they have stores so far only in Ontario and Quebec, doesn't seem like they are quick to expand beyond yet.
Decathalon is a store that usually opens very big stores, but I don't know if Canadians are into them, they closed two of their Toronto stores.
I'm watching a walking tour of South Coast Plaza in California, holy crap that mall has every luxury brand that exists. Not many places in Canada could support such tenants.
Retail in Canada is kinda sucking.

Thanks for sharing the South Coast Plaza video. No real WOW factor from that mall. It looks like a downscaled version of Yorkdale Mall in Toronto. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WViWd85BFE

[SpongeG]

yeah its not the prettiest looking but quite the tenants. Vancouver is getting Oakridge in the spring will be interesting to see.

I went to a really nice mall in Melbourne, it's also very high end and a good design, the roof was just glass.


visitvictoria.com


pointparking.com.au

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

to be fair thats a problem all the malls in Canada are dealing with, no department stores left

The problem actually goes far beyond the Canada.

The challenge Polo Park is having is that all the high revenue stores are south off center court. If you start at SportsChek and walk through the mall, turn at center court and walk out the Forever 21 door very few stores making any significant revenue have been missed. Sure there are still a couple outliers like Coach but when it located there it was across from Lulu Lemon and a few doors over from Pandora, both those have since relocated to the non-dead part of the mall. It seems likely once Apple is fully moved into the former Gap/HMV/Kresge's space that retailers from the dead part will relocate to the current Apple store location.

And to call out Shoppers are a sign that part of the mall isn't dead is laughable. They have been it that location since Krege's was still in the mall and are still shamelessly rockin' their 80s era store design. I believe there are only three of those left in the city Winnipeg Square and Tuxedo Park. The move to the more big box format is the direction that brand was going in even before Weston took them over. Considering there have been opportunities at Polo Park such as the former Pier One/EQ3 building to move outside the mall to the current format their rent in Polo must be ridiculously cheap. Especially when Kildonan Place, St Vital, Garden City, Grant Park, Unicity, Portage Place, Forrest Park Mall, and maybe others all moved to exterior fronting locations with no direct mall access where the mall still exists.

And I am sure someone living in a fantasy world is going to try and claim the changes at Polo Park are just as a result of the Bay closing when in reality this has been happening over at least 10 years already and the post-pandemic retail reality has heavily accelerated it.

[Biff]

I guess you are right...Polo Park is on it's last legs.

Someone should tell, Uniqlo, Nike, Abercrombie and Apple to stope their investments.

[neutroniks]

Originally Posted by bon_vivant

Bring back Kresge's department store while you're at it. Ah never mind, the Apple Store just took its old spot. I dunno, PP seems to be doing fine despite the bad press. Maybe the old Bay space will be divided up like they did with Eaton's at St-V. Or maybe a mall extension. How about Bretton's? Oops. There I go again...

They should just make the 2nd floor of the Bay building a Goodlife. It would have its own dedicated entrance from the theatre parkade for after mall hours.

[neutroniks]

Originally Posted by Biff

I guess you are right...Polo Park is on it's last legs.

Someone should tell, Uniqlo, Nike, Abercrombie and Apple to stope their investments.

Yeah that Nike flagship store on the main floor will be massive. I wonder if they'll subdivide the space and not use it entirely?

[Chrisforpm]

Originally Posted by Biff

I guess you are right...Polo Park is on it's last legs.

Someone should tell, Uniqlo, Nike, Abercrombie and Apple to stope their investments.

As long as they are being replaced by other retailers, it’s not the death of retail. Retail is a finicky industry. Tastes change, what’s new becomes old and outdated. Heck, as a kid I remember going to the mall when Willson Stationaries, St. Clair the Wallpaper people, Dapper Dan and Agnew existed. They all closed down, no one panicked and said the mall was dying 30 years ago. It’s an evolution. There will probably come a day when the likes of Walmart go bankrupt and are replaced by something new.

[laumag]

Originally Posted by Chrisforpm

As long as they are being replaced by other retailers, it’s not the death of retail. Retail is a finicky industry. Tastes change, what’s new becomes old and outdated. Heck, as a kid I remember going to the mall when Willson Stationaries, St. Clair the Wallpaper people, Dapper Dan and Agnew existed. They all closed down, no one panicked and said the mall was dying 30 years ago. It’s an evolution. There will probably come a day when the likes of Walmart go bankrupt and are replaced by something new.

The 1959 opening of Polo Park.

August 20, 1959, was a significant event in Winnipeg's retail history.

I was 8 years old and I remember it was awesome in my mind.

[trebor204]

What about Zellers (moving into the old Bay), they opened a rebranded store in Edmonton, and plan open new stores over the few years.

[SpongeG]

have you seen that Zellers? it looks awful, shoppers said it sells clothing from the other stores that they own I think Fairweather etc. And the home section didn't seem like much, people were expecting a competitor for Walmart where they could get things like detergents and toilet paper etc. but they don't carry it.

you can see a walking tour here on YouTube

[trueviking]

Oof. That’s terrible.

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by Chrisforpm

As long as they are being replaced by other retailers, it’s not the death of retail. Retail is a finicky industry. Tastes change, what’s new becomes old and outdated. Heck, as a kid I remember going to the mall when Willson Stationaries, St. Clair the Wallpaper people, Dapper Dan and Agnew existed. They all closed down, no one panicked and said the mall was dying 30 years ago. It’s an evolution. There will probably come a day when the likes of Walmart go bankrupt and are replaced by something new.

St. Clair...the Wallpaper people - WOW, that's a memory back to 1980's Canadian retail. Totally forgot about them, thanks for the reminder.

[Authentic_City]

My memories of Polo Park in the 80s revolve around Ye Old Hobby Mart and Cricklewood and Co. (same local owner for both). A Saturday morning bowling and playing video games in the bsmt at the Polo Park bowling centre, followed by a treat at the Malt Stop (located out in the mall near centre court, I think?) then a ride home on the bus (25 cents for a kids fare).

[laumag]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

have you seen that Zellers? it looks awful, shoppers said it sells clothing from the other stores that they own I think Fairweather etc. And the home section didn't seem like much, people were expecting a competitor for Walmart where they could get things like detergents and toilet paper etc. but they don't carry it.

you can see a walking tour here on YouTube

I viewed your link to Zellers at Londonderry Mall and I too was not at all impressed. It looks like it could vacate at a moment's notice. The stock reminded me of Value Village.

I hope that Primark moves into the Polo Park Bay space. I hope something moves in that will revitalize that end of the Mall.

[bon_vivant]

So the "new Zeller's" is basically another Winner's type store. The hyped up music in that video is hilariously at odds with the dreary reality. I think a cacophony of sad trombones would be more fitting. Let's hope nobody tries to revive Woolco, too.

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by laumag

I hope that Primark moves into the Polo Park Bay space. I hope something moves in that will revitalize that end of the Mall.

From memory there was lots of noise before the Pandemic about Primark coming to Canada. That has seemed to go silent and no stores opened in Canada. That doesn't take it fully off the table but Winnipeg is almost never a first in Canada for an international chain.