Ontario Highways

[Dengler Avenue]

Yea at one point the assumption was that Buttonville Airport would be decommissioned to make way for the upgrade of 404 and of 16th Avenue. Now it seems that the airport isn’t going away any time soon.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by sonysnob

The 404 is an odd one. It's a two contract job, and the northern contract has been more or less complete since the end of 2020, yet the southern contract, required to actually open the HOV lanes won't be completed until the end of 2022.

I think the potential redevelopment of Buttonville Airport was one of the factors that slowed construction on the 404. The MTO has had several iterations of the design of the 16th Avenue interchange that required land from Buttonville.

At one point Cadillac Fairview owned Buttonville (they still might) and there was a firm date for it's closure, but that date has long since passed. Cadillac Fairview had filed a bunch of Record of Site Condition with the Ministry of the Environment which is required to change the land use from industrial to a more sensitive use, so at one point they were serious about redevelopment, but all of those plans have seem to have fallen by the wayside. At least to my limited knowledge.

I believe there wasn't much of a market for employment lands in the area for a long time so CF wasn't in a rush. The warehouse market has absolutely exploded in the last few years though so now CF is re-investing development of it I believe, likely for distribution warehouses. I know they recently bought out the co-owners for a 100% stake in the property.

[sonysnob]

edit, Buttonville isn't as busy as I thought it was, it isn't the busiest general aviation airport in Canada.

[Dengler Avenue]

Here's some gem that I've found: https://www.hcms.mto.gov.on.ca/PermitsControlledArea
One can see some of the proposed bypasses and extensions. Oddly enough, nothing is showing for Northwestern Ontario.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Here's some gem that I've found: https://www.hcms.mto.gov.on.ca/PermitsControlledArea
One can see some of the proposed bypasses and extensions. Oddly enough, nothing is showing for Northwestern Ontario.

I like how it shows various proposed areas

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

I like how it shows various proposed areas

Particularly, there are some that otherwise don't even register on people's mind, like 64 Noëlville Bypass.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Particularly, there are some that otherwise don't even register on people's mind, like 64 Noëlville Bypass.

If I had hours, I could learn a lot of the intentions of the MTO. I am thinking this will be how you will spend the next few days, if not longer.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Particularly, there are some that otherwise don't even register on people's mind, like 64 Noëlville Bypass.

The have the Bradford Bypass but not the GTA west corridor.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

If I had hours, I could learn a lot of the intentions of the MTO. I am thinking this will be how you will spend the next few days, if not longer.

First I need to ask MTO to fix the glitch about NWO though. It’s confirmed that all permit control zones are designated there as well. I’m really hoping that this will allow me to find the designated corridors through the unorganized parts of T Bay and Kenora districts.

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

The have the Bradford Bypass but not the GTA west corridor.

Some are missing indeed, like the segment of Highway 17 Mattawa Bypass that runs parallel to Ottawa River. Equally sad is that we don’t know how future Highway 7 is supposed to run between Peterborough and Carleton Place.

Then there are some surprising ones like the extension of Hanlon Expressway towards Fergus, which was designated as far back as 1973.

[jamincan]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

If I had hours, I could learn a lot of the intentions of the MTO. I am thinking this will be how you will spend the next few days, if not longer.

I'm not sure I would read into it as the MTO's intentions. The 69 realignment to Hwy 17, for example, has officially been abandoned to the best of my knowledge, despite the permit control remaining. Similarly, the Hanlon extension Dengler Avenue mentioned didn't even warrant mention in the Hwy 7 planning docs as I recall, which suggests that plans have been shelved.

Once the permit control area is implemented, there is very little reason for the MTO to remove the requirement since they don't benefit in any way by doing so. A government might see this as needless bureaucracy and force the MTO to eliminate it in places where it's no longer needed, but presumably this hasn't gotten high enough on anyone's radar to do something about it.

[Innsertnamehere]

That is very interesting indeed. It protects several corridors that have been quiet for a long time, like the Hanlon Expressway extension and Highway 3 realignment through Haldimand (badly needed still if you ask me), but is missing others from the same era that are still in local municipal official plans like the Highway 6N extension from Caledonia down to nanticoke..

It also for some reason still protects some unbuilt bypasses on downloaded provincial highways but not the downloaded highways themselves.. notably a Highway 20 bypass of Smithville.

It's also missing several EAs that have been completed for new corridors for some reason as well. The one that stands out to me is the planned new 7/8 from New Hamburg to Stratford, which isn't shown.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by jamincan

I'm not sure I would read into it as the MTO's intentions. The 69 realignment to Hwy 17, for example, has officially been abandoned to the best of my knowledge, despite the permit control remaining. Similarly, the Hanlon extension Dengler Avenue mentioned didn't even warrant mention in the Hwy 7 planning docs as I recall, which suggests that plans have been shelved.

Once the permit control area is implemented, there is very little reason for the MTO to remove the requirement since they don't benefit in any way by doing so. A government might see this as needless bureaucracy and force the MTO to eliminate it in places where it's no longer needed, but presumably this hasn't gotten high enough on anyone's radar to do something about it.

Another example is it shows an extension of the St. Thomas Expressway to past Alymer, which the government recently publicly stated is officially dead as they sold off the land they owned to protect for it.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

Another example is it shows an extension of the St. Thomas Expressway to past Alymer, which the government recently publicly stated is officially dead as they sold off the land they owned to protect for it.

Indeed. Some corridors have since been abandoned. Nevertheless, it's still valuable to see previous plans too. Then there's also the 424 between Hespeler and Guelph but I frankly can't see any good way for it to tie into Hanlon Expressway if completely free-flowing connections between freeways are required.

As for Hanlon Parkway Extension, I'd say, one step at a time. Build the Kitchener-Guelph Freeway first. Eventually, that extension will be warranted because there's quite a bit of commuting traffic between Guelph and Fergus. (I'm basing that off the one time I went that way in summer 2017, lol). It will come down to when traffic signal timing is maxed out at Woodlawn Road E & Woolwich Street even with 2 left-turn lanes for the EB-to-NB movement.

[ericmacm]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Here's some gem that I've found: https://www.hcms.mto.gov.on.ca/PermitsControlledArea
One can see some of the proposed bypasses and extensions. Oddly enough, nothing is showing for Northwestern Ontario.

Interesting to note how many non-controlled-access highways maintain interchange sized permit controls at intersections. Obviously, that's not to say that any major upgrades or extensions will happen anytime soon, considering how many get mothballed and then revived again, but it paints a good picture of what new major corridors could potentially emerge in the long-term. Here are some that I have found interesting:

• Highway 3 from Windsor to Leamington, as well as the sections from Fort Erie to Port Colborne, and the realignment through Haldimand
  
• Highway 6 from Waterdown to Owen Sound (including Morriston/Puslinch bypass, no bypasses planned yet for Fergus, Mt. Forest, Durham, Chatsworth, and Owen Sound), as well as the section from Hamilton Airport to Jarvis (no bypasses planned yet for Hagersville or Jarvis)
  
• Highway 21 from Forest/402 to Owen Sound (no bypasses planned yet for Forest, Grand Bend, Bayfield, Goderich, Port Elgin, Southampton, and Owen Sound)
  
• Highway 24 from Brantford to Simcoe, but doesn't include the planned Brantford to Cambridge highway yet, presumably because alignment has not been determined
  
• Highway 26 from Barrie to Owen Sound (no bypasses planned yet for Barrie, Stayner, Collingwood, Thornbury, Meaford, and Owen Sound)
  
• Highway 40 from Chatham to Sarnia (including Wallaceburg Bypass, but no bypass planned yet for Chatham)

I think the most interesting thing by far is that many of these corridors will eventually lead to Owen Sound. It'll be neat to see if it grows enough in the future to eventually warrant the construction of at least a couple of RIRO expressways up that way.

[Dengler Avenue]

That many of the corridors lead to Owen Sound is a neat observation. It’ll be interesting to watch.
I’m also curious how 21 holds up (in terms of traffic, for example) along Lake Huron Shore without any bypasses.

[ericmacm]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

I’m also curious how 21 holds up (in terms of traffic, for example) along Lake Huron Shore without any bypasses.

I have driven Highway 21 many times now for work, it gets a fair amount of use south of Goderich and around Kincardine, but overall, it moves well without any bypasses since the overall traffic level is relatively low outside of cottaging season and wouldn't really warrant an upgrade just yet. I have driven it as far north as Tiverton so far. It does get closed in the winter a fair amount due to whiteout conditions as well.

The major towns along Highway 21 are beginning to grow a fair amount, with plenty of new suburban developments being built in Forest, Goderich, Kincardine, and Port Elgin/Southampton. Retirees, priced-out young families, and remote workers are largely driving this growth, so there's a chance that these areas will eventually become more important as population centres in the future.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by ericmacm

I have driven Highway 21 many times now for work, it gets a fair amount of use south of Goderich and around Kincardine, but overall, it moves well without any bypasses since the overall traffic level is relatively low outside of cottaging season and wouldn't really warrant an upgrade just yet. I have driven it as far north as Tiverton so far. It does get closed in the winter a fair amount due to whiteout conditions as well.

The major towns along Highway 21 are beginning to grow a fair amount, with plenty of new suburban developments being built in Forest, Goderich, Kincardine, and Port Elgin/Southampton. Retirees, priced-out young families, and remote workers are largely driving this growth, so there's a chance that these areas will eventually become more important as population centres in the future.

Interesting that you travel that way for work. Were you based in Windsor at one point? At least that was my impression of you.

[ericmacm]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Interesting that you travel that way for work. Were you based in Windsor at one point? At least that was my impression of you.

I used to live in Windsor when I was a student. I now work out of London since I couldn't find a job in Windsor, but currently live in Chatham, working semi-remotely. For work, my office has a large territory that encompasses the triangle of Windsor, Bruce, and Niagara Falls, so I've had to drive up that way for a handful of projects.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by ericmacm

Here are some that I have found interesting:

I would think that the 26 from Barrie to Owen Sound would be a primary candidate for bypasses and improvements. Something like a Thornberry-Nottawa bypass around the Blue Mountains might work. It would capture all of the future Collingwood sprawl and provide a more direct shot between Barrie and Owen Sound and could likely be extended to cut between Stayner and Wasaga Beach in the further future.

Originally Posted by ericmacm

I think the most interesting thing by far is that many of these corridors will eventually lead to Owen Sound. It'll be neat to see if it grows enough in the future to eventually warrant the construction of at least a couple of RIRO expressways up that way.

Owen Sound is in a really interesting spot these days. It's very much at a crossroads of N/S and E/W traffic. I'm not sure how feasible it would be to have an interchange of the 6/10/21/26 south of Owen Sound (say, Inglis Falls) but that seems the simplest to me, at least.

[Dengler Avenue]

Indeed, 26's an interesting one. Here's a snippet: https://www.riouxbakerteam.com/blog/ever...idening-of-hwy-26-but-were-afraid-to-ask