DENVER | Main Development Thread #7

[Robert.hampton]

Originally Posted by TakeFive

CherryCreek... Not sure if you're thinking of Kroenke selling the land, developing it for Amazon or doing some type of joint venture. Likely only the third option would interest Kroenke.

Kroenke is as much a sports franchise investor as real estate developer/land owner. He has managed to acquire the real estate for his franchises except for maybe the Arsenal which I can't speak to. Whether he gives a wit about Amazon I couldn't say.

Kroenke didn't buy Elitches for the Nuggets or Avs -- he says he went in on it because it was a viable business but the investment teams comments since then have been more foretelling -- they have been explicit that they are looking to redevelop the parking lots around Pepsi Center and likely Elitches itself eventually. Can't imagine Kroenke would scoff at an offer from Amazon (and it would be great for his sports teams to have 40,000 people working next door)

[mr1138]

I'd be curious to get people's take on the flood risk in the Auraria portion of the Platte River Valley. It has always been my understanding that the 100-year flood plain is generally off-limits to most development in the modern era. Changes can be made to the floodplain by moving dirt around and increasing river conveyance capacity, but anything that affects stream flow is subject to federal regulation.

Denver's Flood Map shows that a good portion of Kroenke's property is in this flood plain (though I'm surprised looking at the map that it is more in the Pepsi Center parking lot, and not the Elitches site). I'm a bit unclear what Flood Zone "X" is (is this perhaps the zone that would flood if Chatfield failed?), but it covers almost all of the Auraria Platte Valley. In either case, it seems we may be a bit ahead of ourselves, and there is some pretty serious master site planning and greenway improvements that need to be done (perhaps involving the Elitches site) before Kroenke's land is ready for the scale of development we have seen just to the north.

[comoneymaker]

It is just like when Boeing was moving. It was about who would give the biggest tax breaks not about the city. Denver like always will come up short and I am happy for that. Go to the Seattle threads. They hate hate hate Amazon.

[CherryCreek]

Some of the "experts" are weighing in on which cities are likely viable candidates:

Bloomberg:

Toronto, Boston, Atlanta, Washington, Dallas Denver.

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/...ld-accommodate-amazon-s-new-headquarters

Chicago Tribune:

Toronto, San Fran, Pittsburgh, NY, Denver, Boston, Austin, Chicago

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/ct-amazon-second-headquarters-cities-20170908-story.html


MarketWatch:

Provo (!), Denver, Austin, Tampa, Atlanta, Raleigh, D.C., NY, Bridgeport, Boston, Baltimore


http://www.marketwatch.com/story/here-ar...r-amazons-second-headquarters-2017-09-07
SF Gate:

Boston, Pittsburgh, Austin, Chicago, Atlanta, Toronto

http://www.sfgate.com/business/tech/arti...uld-consider-for-its-second-12180272.php


I'm sure more will come. Of course, most of us could come with a respectable list on our own.

[Ich]

Thanks guys. Glad to see Denver has a better chance than Austin. I think the biggest thing that is working against us is our super low unemployment rate. I don't think states financial incentives mean to much to Amazon as they don't really need to rely on that but more so the overall commitment from the state and city.... and they can show/ prove that. Also Denverites aren't as welcoming as they once were so I'm sure there will be plenty of push back.

From my understanding it sounds like Chicago is the top contender along with Atlanta, Dallas and Boston.

I really hope it's not Chicago as corrupt and crime ridden as that city is, never been to Atlanta so I can't say much but logistically speaking it makes sense. Dallas is sooooo hot and bleh, I also feel like coming from Seattle, the political culture in Texas may not align well with Amazon. Boston is a great city and I'm pretty sure Amazon has a presence there already but if they are looking to avoid another city with a high cost of living then Boston isn't a great choice.

As for Denver, personally I think we make great sense. BUT we'd need to show we could recruit that much labor to the city, solve our housing issue (because we are going to need to build a shit ton more units that we are now and we are already having issues getting condo development to take off) and show we can improve or infrastructure to handle the added population. In regards to placement, Pepsi Center seems like an odd choice. If I was looking to build a campus, I'm sure I would want a sports arena in the middle of it. I think Arapaho square makes the most sense as there is plenty of infill there (actually the area reminds me of Denny Triangle where their current HQ is), close to union station, has the D line which will eventually connect to the A line, also has room to build plenty of housing around it and close to RiNo where most of the new tech company's are setting up shop.

[TakeFive]

Oftentimes with these types of expansions, companies look very closely at costs of doing business as well as cost of living - which generally are consistent with each other. Even high-brow Apple drives a very hard bargain. Facebook and Google have been more the exception. Amazon could swing either way so it will be interesting...

If Denver isn't ruled out geographically then it should be a strong contender. Amazons's new presence will evolve and grow over a decade or longer I'd assume. Denver has some good infrastructure bones already in place and should easily be able to grow as Amazon grows.

[rds70]

It looks like Denver is indeed getting an Apple office:

[DUPio]

Do not want Amazon.

[DenverInfill]

New York Times says Amazon should pick Denver.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017...uld-amazon-new-headquarters-be.html?_r=0

[SnyderBock]

Just a thought...
Maybe the City of Denver could put forth a proposal to locate the HQ2 out in the Panasonic smart city? Amazon could team up with Panasonic to test driverless car technology, smart grid and internet of things devices, drone technology and more. Amazon would accelerate build out of the smart city. The end result could be the most technologically advanced campus and community on Earth. The A-line would provide quick access to Denver International Airport and to Union Station and downtown. Land is plentiful and cheaper out there. While it goes against my urbanism beliefs, the prospect of a smart city technology testing ground seems like the most logical fit for this project; perhaps more so than any other location in the entire country.

[TakeFive]

Originally Posted by DenverInfill

New York Times says Amazon should pick Denver.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017...uld-amazon-new-headquarters-be.html?_r=0

Interesting screens. Initially I assumed Amazon would want to be more easterly and that the sunbelt would be a front runner just as with Toyota, Boeing etc. But if Denver doesn't have a location disadvantage or just a teensy one then Denver should at least be a finalist. I also realized that costs wouldn't be as important as they were with State Farm (for example) who divided 25,000 employees between Atlanta, Dallas and Phoenix.

Interestingly with respect to the University system I'm sure they'd also include ASU as a great recruiting ground. They're certainly familiar with Phoenix/Tempe when you realize their footprint. It's only a convenient plane flight away after all.

Also considering the Bloomberg piece I'll make my short list to be Denver, Dallas (or Austin), Atlanta, DC with sleepers Charlotte and Pittsburgh.

Originally Posted by SnyderBock

Just a thought...
Maybe the City of Denver could put forth a proposal to locate the HQ2 out in the Panasonic smart city? Amazon could team up with Panasonic to test driverless car technology, smart grid and internet of things devices, drone technology and more. Amazon would accelerate build out of the smart city. The end result could be the most technologically advanced campus and community on Earth. The A-line would provide quick access to Denver International Airport and to Union Station and downtown. Land is plentiful and cheaper out there. While it goes against my urbanism beliefs, the prospect of a smart city technology testing ground seems like the most logical fit for this project; perhaps more so than any other location in the entire country.

SnyderBock... You may have come up with a winner by golly.

First I was intrigued, then it was "Nah" but ultimately I decided to split the difference.

This HQ is primarily for administrative purposes but they will be looking for software engineers ofc too. Downtown is clearly the better location. But wait...

You do make some very good points especially if you look to more of an R&D presence. Perhaps, just maybe Amazon would be so intrigued with the opportunities to utilize Smart City for various purposes that it becomes a difference maker in their hunt. There's absolutely no reason why they couldn't take advantage of both locations.

[spr8364]

Originally Posted by SnyderBock

Just a thought...
Maybe the City of Denver could put forth a proposal to locate the HQ2 out in the Panasonic smart city? Amazon could team up with Panasonic to test driverless car technology, smart grid and internet of things devices, drone technology and more. Amazon would accelerate build out of the smart city. The end result could be the most technologically advanced campus and community on Earth. The A-line would provide quick access to Denver International Airport and to Union Station and downtown. Land is plentiful and cheaper out there. While it goes against my urbanism beliefs, the prospect of a smart city technology testing ground seems like the most logical fit for this project; perhaps more so than any other location in the entire country.

I agree that the Panasonic site is probably the best location. Another good suburban candidate would be at the RidgeGate light rail station where Amazon could be the core of the new downtown they want to build out there. Just not great access to DIA though.

[RyanD]

That roofline....

[CastleScott]

^ Phenomenally gorgeous Ryan!! Wow!!!

[BG918]

I'm hearing the 18th & Market apartments are going to break ground in December. TCR selected Milender White as the GC and is ready to get started. One of downtown's biggest parking lot craters could finally be getting some help. I'm curious if there is anything in the works for the lot across the street (between Blake and Market)?

With this project, Market Station and the hotel at 16th & Market this will really change the look of this street through downtown. I also LOVE the new infill building at the corner of 15th & Market.

[CastleScott]

I'm curious if there is anything in the works for the lot across the street (between Blake and Market)?

Yeah that half block really needs some help as well.

[seventwenty]

Ryan, where did you take that shot of a non-flat roof? LA? KC?

[RyanD]

Originally Posted by CastleScott

^ Phenomenally gorgeous Ryan!! Wow!!!

Hey thanks!!

Originally Posted by seventwenty

Ryan, where did you take that shot of a non-flat roof? LA? KC?

Ha! Come to think of it... KC has a lot of non-flat roofs.

[corey]

Glad to hear that the 18th and Market apartment building is about to break ground. It's an Alexan, right? I wouldn't mind if Alexan built a nearly identical building on the other side of the street to fill in that gaping hole also.

[Cirrus]

It's too bad KC's tallest building is so ugly. It has all the right ingredients for a beautiful building, but somehow they just got the proportions wrong and it comes out awful.

I actually think that one would've been better with a flatter roof (ie without the highest setback segment):