Manitoba Hydro

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

It's not enough or their grid wouldn't keep crashing.

It crashed what, 3x now in the last 6mths? AB + SK could eat 4gw without blinking. They have 17gw of dirty energy between them after all. That's just at current demand. Grids need to double in supply. He who acts first gets the pie. Let it be us.

BC is already there and is eating the pie. Site C comes on-line next year and will become the 4th largest producer of hydroelectricity in BC with an expected capacity of 1,100MW; much of which will be heading to Alberta. While Manitoba dreams and talks, BC acts.

[BlackDog204]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

I'm on facts. I will redirect you to the start of the thread with my study on the neighboring energy markets to Manitoba. They're expensive. They're dirty. They're maxed out.

Are you not seeing AB's grid outages? Just another this week. That's money for us.

The grid problems in Alberta came about when that lunatic Danielle Smith was elected as Premier in 2022. She's a complete wingnut, who thinks climate change is a hoax, an antivaxxer, and a turncoat. She has also suspended all green energy projects.

You may want to delete the post where you all but call her a genius. Those of us who have lived under her batshit policies, and have a college degree or more, all realise she is nuts. Alberta will continue to suffer as long as Smith and the UCP are Governing. Alberta is in huge trouble with the people who govern her, when and if there is another oil price crash.

I respect the fact that you are passionate about Hydro, but it's not like Manitoba is sitting on a goldmine. If Hydro had the ability to turn Manitoba into a "have" province, we would have seen it happen decades ago.

[BlackDog204]

Originally Posted by Ozabald

BC is already there and is eating the pie. Site C comes on-line next year and will become the 4th largest producer of hydroelectricity in BC with an expected capacity of 1,100MW; much of which will be heading to Alberta. While Manitoba dreams and talks, BC acts.

You are correct, sir.

Site C will be a game-changer.

[bodaggin]

Originally Posted by BlackDog204

You are correct, sir.

Site C will be a game-changer.

Site C of a piddly 1.1gw will be a gamechanger but 30gw of wind, hydro, and PSH won't? Dude, for a "university education" you don't even know 3rd grade math.

At $0.10/kw this 30gw would bring $10B/yr of revenue to MB Hydro. That's half of the MB Gov's provincial budget. Manitoba IS sitting on a goldmine. You want better roads, this pays it. You want better health, this pays it. You want lower tax, this pays it. We could say "well gee, if planes are so good, why didn't they have them already in the 1700's?". Because conditions, markets, technology and costs change. And idiocy subsides.

Get the politically charged lunacy out of your head and speak numbers and reality. If you can't, learn them or listen to the people who do know. Jesus.

[borkborkbork]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

NO LAND ACQUISITION hurdles. Land acquisition is a huge hurdle in wind. We can rubber stamp and build. Fast, cheap, minimal transmission cost. Average wind farm build times are 1-3yrs. We have huge competitive advantage here.

the crown has a duty to consult.

the province got slapped on the wrist a few years ago when they tried to build flood channels near lake st martin. they did some consultations, but they were limited and came after a permit was sought. the FN sued and won.

you can feel that this is good, bad, or neither, but it's clear there's no fast-track rubber-stamp path to doing major infra developments on the lake

[BlackDog204]

[QUOTE=bodaggin;10243161]Site C of a piddly 1.1gw will be a gamechanger but 30gw of wind, hydro, and PSH won't? Dude, for a "university education" you don't even know 3rd grade math.[/quote]

There you go again, with petty insults. You talk like you are the smartest one in the room, when you have no understanding of the fact that hydroelectricity is not even remotely close right now to the lucrative oil and gas industry. Trust me, if Manitoba's hydroelectricity was going to make them a "have' province, similar to Alberta, it would ahve occurred decades ago.

At $0.10/kw this 30gw would bring $10B/yr of revenue to MB Hydro. That's half of the MB Gov's provincial budget. Manitoba IS sitting on a goldmine. You want better roads, this pays it. You want better health, this pays it. You want lower tax, this pays it. We could say "well gee, if planes are so good, why didn't they have them already in the 1700's?". Because conditions, markets, technology and costs change. And idiocy subsides.

Maintoba is NOT sitting on a goldmine, and hydroelectricity can only do so much to help out the province's economic situation.

Get the politically charged lunacy out of your head and speak numbers and reality. If you can't, learn them or listen to the people who do know. Jesus.

I think by declaring that Danielle Smith is a "genius," and is "killing it" in Alberta, demonstrates that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Of course, you ahve the position that anyone who (dare to say it), disagrees with trying to privatise health care, threatens to separate from Canada, is balls-deep in conspiracy theories, and considers the vaccinated community nearly equivalent to Holocaust survivors, and lies about a non-existent Indigenous background a "genius" says more about you, than anyone else on this forum. Maybe do some actual research and get back to us.

Or maybe do stand-up comedy, since your ideas are so unintentionally hilarious.

[bodaggin]

Originally Posted by BlackDog204

Bunch of crazy rambling.

Done with site until this fucktard is off it. Bye.

[BlackDog204]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

Done with site until this fucktard is off it. Bye.

How will SSP ever recover from such a loss?

On a serious note, put your cell phone away when driving in passing lanes of major roads or highways. I would hate to read about you in the news, after a major accident involving multiple vehicles.

[FactaNV]

Well that escalated quickly.

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

Site C of a piddly 1.1gw will be a gamechanger but 30gw of wind, hydro, and PSH won't? Dude, for a "university education" you don't even know 3rd grade math.

At $0.10/kw this 30gw would bring $10B/yr of revenue to MB Hydro. That's half of the MB Gov's provincial budget. Manitoba IS sitting on a goldmine. You want better roads, this pays it. You want better health, this pays it. You want lower tax, this pays it. We could say "well gee, if planes are so good, why didn't they have them already in the 1700's?". Because conditions, markets, technology and costs change. And idiocy subsides.

Get the politically charged lunacy out of your head and speak numbers and reality. If you can't, learn them or listen to the people who do know. Jesus.

If Manitoba is sitting on a "goldmine", then why isn't MB Hydro or some private entity such as Fortis or Emera chomping at the bit to build the transmission network? FYI, BC Hydro's current generating capacity is 54gw; plus the production from private producers. I guess BC is already sitting on a goldmine...

Of the five largest hydro producing provinces in Canada, Manitoba is fifth. Quebec, BC, Newfoundland and Ontario are larger producers of hydro. So again, how's Manitoba going to be this goldmine of power for Alberta when BC is already there?

[audie]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

Done with site until this fucktard is off it. Bye.

Fingers crossed that it sticks this time

[pspeid]

MB Hydro has been portrayed as a "potential gold mine" for the province for a number of years. I've held that belief myself, but now I'm not so sure we need to keep thinking of it as an uncashed lottery ticket.

i have no doubt MB Hydro can be profitable for the province, especially if it upgrades and increases it's capacity. IMO we need to think of it as part of a diversified economy, rather than the answer to all our economic woes. I'm not sure Manitoba will ever find that "one big resource" that will make us into Alberta east, but I don't think there's anything wrong with growing the economy through a number of smaller pieces. Perhaps several "tin" or "copper mines" are just as good as one "gold mine"?

[FactaNV]

Originally Posted by Ozabald

If Manitoba is sitting on a "goldmine", then why isn't MB Hydro or some private entity such as Fortis or Emera chomping at the bit to build the transmission network? FYI, BC Hydro's current generating capacity is 54gw; plus the production from private producers. I guess BC is already sitting on a goldmine...

Of the five largest hydro producing provinces in Canada, Manitoba is fifth. Quebec, BC, Newfoundland and Ontario are larger producers of hydro. So again, how's Manitoba going to be this goldmine of power for Alberta when BC is already there?

In all fairness, any exporters would probably be exported to SK first. That said their nuke program may curtail that one day.

[Winnipeg Grump]

Originally Posted by FactaNV

In all fairness, any exporters would probably be exported to SK first. That said their nuke program may curtail that one day.

I am informed that SaskPower and MB Hydro are not on the best of terms, institution-wise.

In all seriousness, maybe the biggest hurdle we have is the jurisdictional barriers to the build-out of interties, as well as the pushback from the public when a proposal for a transmission line appears.

Even down in the US, they have a HUGE problem with these issues causing a backlog in getting RE projects built out. The Biden admin has made some progress on that recently, but it's a big hurdle to the electrification of the economy.

[bodaggin]

Originally Posted by Ozabald

BC Hydro's current generating capacity is 54gw; I guess BC is already sitting on a goldmine...

This is false. BC has 18gw of current generating capacity. You're off by a factor of 3. Go read the wiki.

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by Winnipeg Grump

I am informed that SaskPower and MB Hydro are not on the best of terms, institution-wise.

In all seriousness, maybe the biggest hurdle we have is the jurisdictional barriers to the build-out of interties, as well as the pushback from the public when a proposal for a transmission line appears.

Even down in the US, they have a HUGE problem with these issues causing a backlog in getting RE projects built out. The Biden admin has made some progress on that recently, but it's a big hurdle to the electrification of the economy.

SK could play the Quebec card; similar to what Quebec does with power from Churchill Falls in Newfoundland. Force MB Hydro to sell the power to SaskPower at a low amount and then SaskPower sell it to AB for a nice profit. As well, refuse MB Hydro access to the existing distribution grid in SK; something which Quebec also does to Newfoundland.

[FactaNV]

Originally Posted by Ozabald

SK could play the Quebec card; similar to what Quebec does with power from Churchill Falls in Newfoundland. Force MB Hydro to sell the power to SaskPower at a low amount and then SaskPower sell it to AB for a nice profit. As well, refuse MB Hydro access to the existing distribution grid in SK; something which Quebec also does to Newfoundland.

Why is your first thought trying to fuck over Manitoba when there could be a mutually beneficial agreement between two friendly provinces? You're such a nice person lol. Thank God you're not in power, you'd run this province or whatever province you're from into the ground.

[bodaggin]

Originally Posted by FactaNV

Why is your first thought trying to fuck over Manitoba when there could be a mutually beneficial agreement between two friendly provinces? You're such a nice person lol. Thank God you're not in power, you'd run this province or whatever province you're from into the ground.

As much as a lot of what Ozabald has said is wildly incorrect, the "landlocking" argument is valid. However, in no way insurmountable.

What would likely happen is MB would generate and bring power to the SK border via the amazing BiPole 3 map I posted here. Then, transmission would be built off that border to SK for local use, and a thru-line to AB. Either SK would build their own dedicated line to AB, adding a "transmission fee" to the sale to Alberta. Common and expected. Transmission isn't free. Or some joint arrangement between 2 or 3 of the provinces would occur on that transmission line, to prevent stonewalling and gouging like was mentioned.

If I'm MB, I'd likely want some claim on that line, to ensure SK can't screw me. But at the same time, I don't want to put out extra capital to build it. Because, risk. These are valid concerns in utility markets since there's only really 1 way to move the power. It's too cost prohibitive to just start up a new line. Maybe a 30 AB, 30 MB, 40 SK deal would make sense. Not sure. Needs to be negotiated.

But let me remind. AB/SK consume 20gw of power. Small. The nearby US states consume 100gw of power, 5x the amount to sell into and capitalizing on the weak CAD/USD. The real money is south.

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by FactaNV

Why is your first thought trying to fuck over Manitoba when there could be a mutually beneficial agreement between two friendly provinces? You're such a nice person lol. Thank God you're not in power, you'd run this province or whatever province you're from into the ground.

That's an interesting take. The situation is currently happening between two provinces in Canada. Maybe SK and MB will play nice; but SK does have the right to block the transmission of power from MB through the province. Newfoundland took Quebec to court over the issue of access to the Quebec grid to move hydropower from Labrador to Ontario and the US. They lost.

Why do you think with Muskrat Falls in Labrador, the distribution network is a cable from Labrador to the island, then a lengthy high voltage transmission line across Newfoundland; which connects to an underwater cable from Newfoundland to Nova Scotia to access the Maritime power grid to move Labrador power to the US and Maritimes? And with Hydro Quebec's ill-fated attempt to take over NB Power in 2009-10. What was the true purpose? To block hydro power from Labrador getting to the US market without going through the Hydro Quebec owned power grid.

[FactaNV]

Originally Posted by Ozabald

That's an interesting take. The situation is currently happening between two provinces in Canada. Maybe SK and MB will play nice; but SK does have the right to block the transmission of power from MB through the province. Newfoundland took Quebec to court over the issue of access to the Quebec grid to move hydropower from Labrador to Ontario and the US. They lost.

Why do you think with Muskrat Falls in Labrador, the distribution network is a cable from Labrador to the island, then a lengthy high voltage transmission line across Newfoundland; which connects to an underwater cable from Newfoundland to Nova Scotia to access the Maritime power grid to move Labrador power to the US and Maritimes?

Man, Manitobans are most myopic folks in Canada. Blissfully unaware of life outside of the province. Still blaming the Panama Canal for the decline of Winnipeg?

I was simply talking about selling to SK. Why sell two provinces away when you can sell to our neighbours to bring their prices down? SK can do whatever they want with it, export, use as is, whatever. You immediately spin it into some fantasy where SK can pull a Muskrat Falls situation. I'm not talking about selling to AB, I'm talking about selling to SK. If you hate us so much why do you bother frequenting this page? I'm also waiting for an answer on how MB Hydro is inferior to the private companies in the Maritimes, a claim you made and did nothing back up.

Nice edit to hide your slag against Manitobans.