Baseline Rd. Bus Rapid Transit (BRT) Project | Proposed

[TransitZilla]

Display boards.

[zzptichka]

Too bad they didn't post detailed plans they had at the open house.

[Catenary]

Originally Posted by zzptichka

Too bad they didn't post detailed plans they had at the open house.

Yes, this is a big loss. Those files would have been huge though, the scale of this project is pretty massive. To put it in perspective, the Baseline BRT is longer than Confederation Line phase 1 by 1.5 km.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by Catenary

Yes, this is a big loss. Those files would have been huge though, the scale of this project is pretty massive. To put it in perspective, the Baseline BRT is longer than Confederation Line phase 1 by 1.5 km.

The internet is big.

It is absolutely baffling why the City of Ottawa is so bloody secretive about its consultation documents. Why keep them from the public until the last possible second? Why prevent interested parties from doing their homework?

In university, I read the assigned readings before the lectures.

[hwy418]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

The internet is big.

It is absolutely baffling why the City of Ottawa is so bloody secretive about its consultation documents. Why keep them from the public until the last possible second? Why prevent interested parties from doing their homework?

In university, I read the assigned readings before the lectures.

Geez you're impatient! I spoke to the City's PM - they'll be up very soon.

Last minutes tweaks and translation are often done at the last minute so it's not always possible to post the materials ahead of time. As someone mentioned the plans are very long so it will take time to break-up the corridor into manageable pieces in an accessible format.

Besides, there's a lot of time and effort that goes into preparing a POH - it's worth going in person.

[dodoburd]

From page 16 in the display boards: look like we're getting those Dutch cycling intersections that many have been asking for!

[JCL]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

Dear Whoever At City Hall Monitors This Forum:

Why don't you publish the storyboards for consultations online WELL ahead of time?

Why the secrecy?

I believe they want people to actually attend the open house in-person. If they had posted the display boards ahead of time, people might not actually attend (except for those who are affected by the project and are opposed to it).

Just my guess, though.

[JCL]

Originally Posted by Richard Eade

I am not sure of the rational that was used to select where the stops are to be. For instance, there are still a good number of Carleton U. students who walk to the Heron Road Bridge, but they are being left out, while both the Wal*mart and Clyde get stops. I think that maybe the stop locations could be refined a bit - after they figure out if they are making a BRT with limited stops, or a Local route in dedicated lanes.

Someone actually raised that issue during the open-mic session last night.

[Beedok]

I still suspect that Baseline and then up the transitway has good odds of being the 2nd metro line in Ottawa. Far enough into the suburbs and whatnot.

I suppose we'll find out in 50 years or so.

[Catenary]

Originally Posted by Beedok

I still suspect that Baseline and then up the transitway has good odds of being the 2nd metro line in Ottawa. Far enough into the suburbs and whatnot.

I suppose we'll find out in 50 years or so.

Conversion to LRt was brought up last night. They say it is being designed with that in mind.

I could see the first half being built as BRT, then never building the second half as BRT but rather converting it all to LRT.

[zzptichka]

A few intersections (my phone sucks, so I borrowed these from @HansontheBike on twitter):

Cedarview:



Greenbank:



BRT meets LRT at Baseline station:



Navaho back to Baseline:



Clyde:



Merivale:



Prince of Wales:



Riverside:

[McC]

I like those protected corners. Begs the question why in the heck Booth and Albert doesn't look like that.

[Aylmer]

But holy turning-radii, Batman! Do people need to take a right turn at 60? I'm happy about the protected cycle intersections, but there's still a lot more which could be done to make Baseline more of a street and less of a drag:
- do away with swooping right turns and right turn channels.
- go for the safer 3-3.2m lane standard instead of the more dangerous 3.5's.
- put in crossing refuge islands wherever possible to break up the crossing into safer/more comfortable segments.

[Buggys]

Originally Posted by Aylmer

But holy turning-radii, Batman! Do people need to take a right turn at 60? I'm happy about the protected cycle intersections, but there's still a lot more which could be done to make Baseline more of a street and less of a drag:
- do away with swooping right turns and right turn channels.
- go for the safer 3-3.2m lane standard instead of the more dangerous 3.5's.
- put in crossing refuge islands wherever possible to break up the crossing into safer/more comfortable segments.

Regarding the swooping right turns, it's probably because Baseline is a busy main/arterial street, and it's better for traffic flow. I would think that it's better for seeing cyclists with as well, because the turn angle is smoother.

What is the 3-3.2m standard and why is it safer to cyclists than 3.5m?

Regarding the refuge islands, Baseline is already very tight for fitting in 2 bus lanes + 4 car lanes. Expropriation will be needed along stretches of Baseline, and can't go as far as inches from people's single family home's living room windows.

[TransitZilla]

Originally Posted by Aylmer

But holy turning-radii, Batman! Do people need to take a right turn at 60? I'm happy about the protected cycle intersections, but there's still a lot more which could be done to make Baseline more of a street and less of a drag:
- do away with swooping right turns and right turn channels.
- go for the safer 3-3.2m lane standard instead of the more dangerous 3.5's.
- put in crossing refuge islands wherever possible to break up the crossing into safer/more comfortable segments.

It looks like the right-turn channels are to be removed from most of the intersections along Baseline, but it's curious that they are to be left as-is at Riverside and Prince of Wales.

[zzptichka]

Originally Posted by Buggys

Regarding the swooping right turns, it's probably because Baseline is a busy main/arterial street, and it's better for traffic flow. I would think that it's better for seeing cyclists with as well, because the turn angle is smoother.

What is the 3-3.2m standard and why is it safer to cyclists than 3.5m?

Regarding the refuge islands, Baseline is already very tight for fitting in 2 bus lanes + 4 car lanes. Expropriation will be needed along stretches of Baseline, and can't go as far as inches from people's single family home's living room windows.

Narrow lanes are safer for everybody as they discourage people from speeding and force them to pay attention to the road. Also saves 1-2m on ROW and Millions dollars in expropriation money.

BTW all those pink dashed areas on the plans are marked for expropriation.

[lrt's friend]

As someone who will be travelling down Baseline later today, those right turn lanes at major intersections keep the traffic flowing.

Interesting that the only comments about transit frequency is during peak periods. I would like to see buses running every 10 minutes during off-peak hours. If we want to increase transit modal share as the city claims, this becomes important on a key route like this.

[McC]

Originally Posted by zzptichka

Narrow lanes are safer for everybody as they discourage people from speeding and force them to pay attention to the road. Also saves 1-2m on ROW and Millions dollars in expropriation money.

BTW all those pink dashed areas on the plans are marked for expropriation.

also saves in water runoff, and reduces the surface area to plow, salt, patch and re-pave.

[hwy418]

Originally Posted by Aylmer

But holy turning-radii, Batman! Do people need to take a right turn at 60? I'm happy about the protected cycle intersections, but there's still a lot more which could be done to make Baseline more of a street and less of a drag:
- do away with swooping right turns and right turn channels.
- go for the safer 3-3.2m lane standard instead of the more dangerous 3.5's.
- put in crossing refuge islands wherever possible to break up the crossing into safer/more comfortable segments.

The minimum lane width for a road such as this (i.e. major arterial, truck route, etc.) is 3.25m plus a curb offset of 0.25m. It used to be 3.75m.

[zzptichka]

Originally Posted by hwy418

The minimum lane width for a road such as this (i.e. major arterial, truck route, etc.) is 3.25m plus a curb offset of 0.25m. It used to be 3.75m.

Is it Ontario-specific minimum?
One of the Vancouver main arterials has 2.75 width. A bit too extreme, but nonetheless, it's possible.