Taipei: The World's Most Underrated City?

[Quixote]

The Taiwanese are also "edgier" when it comes to architecture, sort of like how the French are compared to British/German. There seems to be more of a willingness to experiment with massing, proportions, and bold design elements, although a lot of it is probably by accident and poorer execution.

[Quixote]

Look at this gem of a streetscape. I hope these apartments never get replaced with taller, austere-looking buildings.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/2byF8RgvzBF8Pm6J9

[Quixote]

Some brick buildings with wrought-iron fencing:

https://goo.gl/maps/YuzwmnKmpdrWKeVo9

Taipei just might be Asia’s best city, yo. NY-level urbanism but with Chicago’s size and recognition.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Quixote

Look at this gem of a streetscape. I hope these apartments never get replaced with taller, austere-looking buildings.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/2byF8RgvzBF8Pm6J9

Originally Posted by Quixote

Some brick buildings with wrought-iron fencing:

https://goo.gl/maps/YuzwmnKmpdrWKeVo9

Taipei just might be Asia’s best city, yo. NY-level urbanism but with Chicago’s size and recognition.

These give me Iberian peninsula (+ maybe Rio) vibes.

[Quixote]

^ That's been the gist of my newfound Taipei fandom. It's the only major Asian city with a vaguely Latin European-style form.

New Taipei definitely has that "developing world" vibe though. More random street layout, less orderly, less polished, and less served by rail — definitely more akin to NYC's outer boroughs or London south of the Thames. This is the place to build residential towers. I see Taipei proper becoming more and more like Manhattan — the "favored quarter."

[Architype]

Originally Posted by Quixote

Look at this gem of a streetscape. I hope these apartments never get replaced with taller, austere-looking buildings.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/2byF8RgvzBF8Pm6J9

And this Asian architecture has been exported somewhat to many parts of the world, Chinatown Vancouver:

https://maps.app.goo.gl/K1aDa4QL7pFghY737
https://maps.app.goo.gl/rkTh3vgcxvBFpRRt5
https://maps.app.goo.gl/fsHT9gKHdH6PGCDz9

[Agitprop]

It's fun to think of it as an Asian Palermo where the local version of the Cosa Nostra i.e. the Triads affected the capital less poorly than the Camorra/Tongs did to Naples/HK.

[lio45]

I'm seriously considering visiting Taipei now (gf and I are somewhat looking for travel destinations) and that's pretty much thanks to this thread (not just Quixote, other contributors too).

[Quixote]

^ That's great to hear, and I'm glad that those who have actually visited can lend credence to Taipei's awesomeness.

One interesting thing that I picked up on while binge-watching Taipei vlogs these past few weeks is the prevalence of Japanese and Korean translations provided. Taiwan is the most popular overseas destination for Japanese tourists, and South Korea shares a high degree of cultural (political, economic) parallels with Taiwan. I think this clearly suggests that Taiwanese culture is far less insular/isolationist, but also that part of Taiwan's geopolitical strategy is to get Japan and South Korea to put aside their differences and meet Taiwan in the middle. The problem is that I don't think either country (particularly Japan) wants to get involved in any conflict. It's not just that Japan is facing an economic crisis; I think they are too solipsistic. Taiwan provided more relief aid than any other country in the aftermath of 3/11, so not coming to its defense would be disappointing and drive a wedge between the two countries.

[Quixote]

Why Taiwan thinks it's a poor loser when it’s actually a success

By Matthew Ryan
August 16, 2023

Living in Taiwan for a long time, you would notice that many locals and the media often express a sense of disappointment with their country. Taiwan is commonly thought of as an also-ran, a nobody. The boom has already passed, and the island now seems to be in stasis, with a small economy and few opportunities.

A more extreme version of this narrative is the "ghost island" theory, which has somewhat subsided in the last five years. The core of this narrative is that Taiwan is a hopeless wasteland, hurtling towards collapse, and inhabited by ghosts just going through their daily motions. It certainly is not a place for ambitious young people.

Personally, for a time, this kind of discourse affected my own mental well-being and my decision to reside and work in Taiwan. In my first job in Taiwan, my boss told me that, as an aspirational, hard-working foreigner, I was wasting my time in Taiwan, and should move to Shanghai in order to make something of myself. I often deliberated, “If mainstream society viewed Taiwan as a place without a future, then why was I here at my own volition?”

However, something changed for me as I delved a bit deeper and investigated more about how Taiwan's society and economy actually operate. I started to discover that a lot of what I had been told about the moribund state of the country is not true.

Taiwan is one of the most successful post-war economies and also one of the wealthiest places on the whole planet. From top to bottom, I discovered that this is an island of winners, achievers, and trailblazers. But why do so many consider their home a failure?

...

https://english.cw.com.tw/article/ar...action?id=3491

[Quixote]

I think the lack of new, shiny skyscrapers (a symbol of economic prosperity, especially in Hong Kong, Singapore, and second-tier Chinese cities) popping up and having to hear about mainland China's explosive growth for decades contribute greatly to Taiwan being the "forgotten one."

No Toyota, Honda, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Hitachi, Sony, Panasonic, Samsung, LG, Hyundai, Kia, etc.

No cultural exports like Nintendo, Sega, PlayStation, Game Boy, Pokemon, Yu-Gi-Oh!, Sanrio, K-pop, Gangnam Style, Parasite, Crazy Rich Asians, etc. Hell, even something as silly as Tamagotchis were a big deal.

Taiwan and Taiwanese culture is still trying to figure out its place in the world.

[Architype]

The Taiwan economy is among the world's largest.

World Economy Ranking 2023 Top 21

1. United States of America
2. China
3. Japan
4. Germany
5. India
6. United Kingdom
7. France
8. Italy
9. Canada
10. Brazil
11. Russia
12. South Korea
13. Australia
14. Mexico
15. Spain
16. Indonesia
17. Netherlands
18. Saudi Arabia
19. Turkey
20. Switzerland
21. Taiwan

https://rajneetpg2022.com/world-economy-ranking/

[Quixote]

^ It's not, but I too fell prey to the assumption that Taiwan was a very low middle-income country (like a Portugal) that was behind Japan and South Korea in development. Visually, it certainly looks that way in Taipei due to the absence of glassy skyscrapers to offset the slum-like tenement housing. Taipei-Taoyuan's airport is also down-right dowdy for a major East Asian city.

Yet, Taiwan in its current form is in many ways already a better country. Countries by freedom indices:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...e-RWBPFIndex-3

Taiwan is #4 for economic freedom, ahead of Spain and even the U.S. in freedom of the press, and #10 for democracy (behind Netherlands/Australia, ahead of Switzerland). Taiwanese culture is also less sexist toward women, and it's the only Asian country in which same-sex marriage if legal.

Taiwan is the world's best-kept secret. It is truly Formosa.

[Fabricio JF]

Taiwanese companies in my home (Apart from tech suppliers from other countries that are not mentioned)

AOC. Monitor (PC1/PC3).

Elitegroup Computer Systems. Motherboard (PC3).

Via Technologies. Chipset (PC3).

Realtek. NICs (PC3).

D-Link. Router.

Gigabyte Technology. Motherboard (PC2).

There are wonderful comments here that I hear from Acer, Asus and Soyo, which are greatly admired by their consumers. Acer and AOC seem to want to challenge the longevity test: Durability and modernity to overcome fragility and obsolescence and thus last for a long time.

[CalUrbanist]

Originally Posted by hipster duck

It still does kind of feel like a bit of a peripheral place. It's not a cowtown, of course, but it's not very cosmopolitan and it is the primary city for Taiwanese people, not a place where people from far away come to try out new things.

I don't quite get these comments about Taipei being uncosmopolitan. If Taipei were an American city, it would be more cosmopolitan than all American cities save for probably NY, SF, LA. Cosmopolitanism isn't all about having a 37% foreign-born population. It's about being at the crossroads of culture and ideas. If foreign-born ratio or immigrant-share were a good gauge of cosmopolitanism (which it is not) then we'd be forced to put Houston above Tokyo or Seoul. Surely this is not what forumers are implying?

Speaking of ideas, with the demise of a democratic HK, Taipei is now the center of the world for Chinese intellectual free speech and all of the things that go with that - publishing, media, think tanks, etc. No surprise Taipei is capital of the only Asian country to date (barring ANZ) that has legalized gay marriage, and where public discourse about trans rights is occurring in tandem with the most liberal cities of the West.

[CalUrbanist]

It seems like a weird surrogate, but retail also says a lot about a city's exposure to the world. The fact that Taipeiites (is that what we call them?) are savvy enough to justify standalone A.P.C. and Naim Audio boutiques tells me Taipei is a pretty cosmopolitan city. In the US, only SF, NY, LA have have enough people of discerning taste to justify these. No to mention Taipei's representation in the Michelin Guide as a global culinary capital.

In my experience, Taipeiites are very globally mobile. According to Knight Frank Taipei has the 8th largest UHNWI count in the world, above cities like Zurich, Shanghai, and all US cities not called New York. Taipei is also SF's twin as far as being the global center of the tech industry, with its dominance in tech hardware to the degree that SF is the epicenter of tech software. It can be said that Taipei and SF are on opposite sides of the same global tech coin. For example, through TSMC (the largest company in Asia by market cap) Taipei singlehandedly determines the technological limits of Nvidia GPUs and, by extension, the leading AI companies of the world who rely on Nvidia downstream of it (OpenAI, Anthropic, etc). It also decides the technological envelope for all the other bleeding edge chip design firms such as AMD and Qualcomm, and is central to US efforts to contain China's rise.

By pushing the limits of and supplying the world with the most advanced material that mankind is capable of fabricating, and by being the capital of a far more geopolitically important nation than Israel or similarly sized Australia, Taipei is far from peripheral or uncosmopolitan. Quite the opposite: Few US cities can even hope to claim Taipei's level of cosmopolitanism.

[Quixote]

A recent comment in a Reddit thread asking, "Have you ever experienced cities or place that felt more crowded than Taipei?" reads:

For a city of its influence, and for an urban area with its population, Taipei feels very uncrowded to me. It is at least below average.
So yes, especially when including even larger cities, I’ve experienced tons of places that felt more crowded. NYC, CDMX, London, Paris, HK, Manila, BKK, Shanghai, Beijing, Tokyo, Seoul are the ones that come to mind definitively. Quite a few others that I’d say maybe slightly but they’re on the same tier with Taipei.

Taipei's urban form is the creme de la creme among Asian cities, IMO. That along with the population density, abundance of food and drink options (night markets usually close at midnight), and 24-hour convenience stores on practically every corner create fertile ground for vibrant streets. So I find it quite peculiar that lots of people on Reddit say that Taipei feels neither crowded nor like a big city.

Anyway, Taipei has over 26 contiguous square miles of high-quality urbanism that's home to over 1.53 million people, which translates to a population density of roughly 58,600 per square mile. Songshan includes the airport, while Da'an and Xinyi have undeveloped hillsides within their districts, so the true population density is probably a little north of 60,000 per square mile.

Where else in the developed world sustains this level of density? I can only think of Manhattan, Paris, and maybe Barcelona. Taipei belongs to a very exclusive class of urbanism.


Songshan
204,066
56,906 (3.59 SM)

Xinyi
220,275
50,871 (4.33 SM)

Da'an
307,585
70,064 (4.39 SM)

Zhongshan
227,429
43,073 (5.28 SM)

Zhongsheng
157,851
53,690 (2.94 SM)

Datong
227,429
103,848 (2.19 SM)

Wanhua
187,220
54,742 (3.42 SM)

1,531,855 in 26.14 SM
58,601 / SM



https://highdensity.cargo.site/IX-Taipei-Taiwan

[Quixote]

In addition to having Asia's best fine-grained urbanism, Taipei's cityscape is second only to HK when it comes to natural beauty, being that it's surrounded by mountains in all four directions.

Taipei is the capital of Taiwan, which transformed itself from an authoritarian country to Asia's most liberal and progressive democracy in 30 years. Taiwan has the most and highest density of tall mountains of any island in the world, its mountains much more rugged than Japan. Geographically and culturally, Taiwan sits at the crossroads of East and Southeast Asia.

It's the world's best-kept secret. Almost everyone has heard of Taiwan, but few people actually know about it.

[berbers]

Taipei is a wonderful city. Why not live here forever? I am designing my lifestyle to fit the best of Taiwan and Japan's capital cities into one seemless experience.

-Live in Taipei with its multi-lingual languages, democracy, friendly and sophisticated populace, raise family, compehensive healthcare, and living in low inflation NTD dollars.

-Travel to Tokyo every quarter for the dynamic vibrance, fun, deep culture, clean fresh air, beautiful seasonal scenery and spending in relatively cheaper Yen.

-Then try to earn globally from American USD power as passive dividends and stock investments.

Love Taiwan!

[giallo]

Here's a link to a photo thread I just posted of Taipei. I think it shows off some of what's been talked about here. Enjoy!

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...5#post10184115