Landmark on Robson - U/C

[Vin]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Little to no new developments on Main or Broadway? Sure could have fooled me. One could easily argue that there's plenty of development.

I suppose your definition of "plenty" is different from mine.

[logan5]

Originally Posted by EastVanMark

Not so bad? Chinatown is having is roots ripped from the ground and is being turned into a bland, redundant, gentrified nightmare.

On the other hand, agree about Main, Fraser Streets.

Chinatown was becoming very run down. There has to be an influx of new residents to rejuvenate it. The City was picking its spots pretty well up until the proposal at the the Brickhouse/Jimi Hendrix site. That's what seemed to get peoples attention.

There's too many historic buildings in Chinatown for it to become bland. The City will retain most of the fine grained aspects of Chinatown.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by logan5

Chinatown was becoming very run down. There has to be an influx of new residents to rejuvenate it. The City was picking its spots pretty well up until the proposal at the the Brickhouse/Jimi Hendrix site. That's what seemed to get peoples attention.

There's too many historic buildings in Chinatown for it to become bland. The City will retain most of the fine grained aspects of Chinatown.

This. A whole lot of Vancouverites seem to have forgotten that Chinatown was dark and dead most of the year, save for the Night Market or the Chinese New Year parade; nowadays, the area's pretty well-frequented.

Now if we could just teach the dogwalkers how to use a plastic bag...

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Vin

I suppose your definition of "plenty" is different from mine.

As is our definition of "deteriorating" and "(not) improving." Neither street is anywhere near close to stagnant - not in terms of liveliness or growth, not now or in the future.

Unless said definitions involve several thirty-storey towers on every block, in which case both areas are indeed stunted.

[Tetsuo]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

This. A whole lot of Vancouverites seem to have forgotten that Chinatown was dark and dead most of the year, save for the Night Market or the Chinese New Year parade; nowadays, the area's pretty well-frequented.

Not true pre-2000, Chinatown was bustlin'

Ron,

[Alex Mackinnon]

Originally Posted by Tetsuo

Not true pre-2000, Chinatown was bustlin'

Ron,

That's great and all... But Chinatown of 2010 was pretty dead after 5pm.

I remember the day I moved to Strathcona, I went for a walk to find an open restaurant on a weeknight. We made it all the way to the International Village before we found some really mediocre food.

Now, there are a tonnes of options that are open late. I live just off Hastings, and in the last 2 years we've gone from having no restaurants between the Pink Pearl and Hanoi Pho (at Dunlevy), to having 2 good ones. That between restaurants gap was just under 1km on a primary arterial!

The difference between pre-2000 Chinatown, and now is pretty big. The old school Chinese population has gone from being fairly old to really old. At a certain point, they become a lot less visible in the community, especially in the evenings.

Having a mix of people and eyes on the street is a real nice thing to have when you're adjacent to the frequent craziness of Main and Hastings. People behave much better if others are around.

[Changing City]

Remind me what a discussion of whether Chinatown was bustling, or not, 17 years ago has to do with the redevelopment of a seismically challenged hotel in the West End?

[osirisboy]

Originally Posted by Changing City

Remind me what a discussion of whether Chinatown was bustling, or not, 17 years ago has to do with the redevelopment of a seismically challenged hotel in the West End?

Both areas that are or were stagnant, or aren't.

[Feathered Friend]

As someone who has spent far too much time at the Empire these last few months, including making a point to check out Cloud 9, I think I'm qualified to chip in my two cents.

Will I miss the idea of being to go up to Cloud 9 and look at an amazing view? Do I feel that the tower was interesting to see from Kits Beach? That it added something unique to our skyline? Do I feel sympathy for the employees now out of work? The answer to all of these questions is clearly yes (plus the food at Cloud 9 wasn't half bad). Does that mean I feel that block would be better for retaining the hotel? The answer to that is a hard no.

It's a shame that the new towers won't be as tall, but they'll be far more dense than the Empire could have ever been. They're providing a great social housing contribution (as per the zoning requirement). Much like the Development Permit Board, I have hopes that the finished project will be to a high standard, and look better than the renderings (or for that matter the half finished model from the open house that I never got around to posting).

The Empire, like a lot of other areas that see controversy when going for rezoning, seems to have struck a nerve. This is not because it's a bad project replacing a really high quality landmark building, but simply because it's been a part of peoples lives and, let's face it, big change is hard. Years from now once this, 1684 Alberni, The Kengo Kuma Tower, The Jenga tower, etc. are all built, we'll wonder why anyone thought these bland concrete towers generated any fuss at all.

Also, I hated that the food usually provided at the open house events was one I couldn't eat, essentially onions and tomatoes on bread... I would take a sledge hammer to the kitchen myself for that reason.

[mezzanine]

Originally Posted by Tetsuo

Not true pre-2000, Chinatown was bustlin'

Ron,

Not to my recollection, especially from the early 1990s. Woodwards closed and remained closed for the next 10-12 years and the DTES made world headlines at the time for having high rates of HIV infections from IV drug use. Even that janky casino at the mandarin centre moved away from chinatown sometime in the 1990s/early 2000s.

Prior to the 1990s after the freeway threat ebbed and before the rise of T & T it was bustling as it was the best place you could get hard-to-find asian foods. but certainly in the 1990s it was a place of grimness, until the past few years, really.

[/dead horse]

[red-paladin]

Sorry for not intervening sooner, but let's stick to the thread's topic.

[casper]

Was the restaurant space at the top of tower popular? I have never been up to the top of this one.

The pinnacle hotel also has something like this (though I don't think it revolves). I was up their a few months ago, that hotel only uses for catered events. The view is ok. The food marginal and I don't think it gets used all the much. The entry area is shared with a dedicated lounge for airline employees that stay at the hotel.

I don't see any of the new hotels getting these round spaces as a penthouse level.

[Klazu]

I made it a point to visit Cloud9 before it closed and so I visited few weeks ago and will post a lot of photos hopefully this weekend. I was blown away by the open view from the top and now regret that I never made it there with any visitors to the city I have had. Food was also good, although service was lacking.

Sad to see the place to go.

[phesto]

Originally Posted by casper

Was the restaurant space at the top of tower popular? I have never been up to the top of this one.

When I was there last week I asked our server about this. She said that the restaurant was very popular in the 70's and 80's but saw a steady decline over the past 20 years. Apparently a lot of the bookings in the final few weeks are older couples who are coming back one last time to re-live old memories from the early days.

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by Klazu

I made it a point to visit Cloud9 before it closed and so I visited few weeks ago and will post a lot of photos hopefully this weekend. I was blown away by the open view from the top and now regret that I never made it there with any visitors to the city I have had. Food was also good, although service was lacking.

Sad to see the place to go.

I thought this place was supposed to close on the 30th... is it officially closed now?

[connect2source]

Originally Posted by phesto

When I was there last week I asked our server about this. She said that the restaurant was very popular in the 70's and 80's but saw a steady decline over the past 20 years. Apparently a lot of the bookings in the final few weeks are older couples who are coming back one last time to re-live old memories from the early days.

Yes, it was THE place in the 70's, I remember being thrilled to be there as a small kid, totally magical, I was fascinated by how the entire restaurant revolved once / hour, I couldn't even concentrate on my meal as I was spell-bound by the view which was far better than today. Only the Royal Centre, The TD and Scotia Towers were taller but not by much. They served a cocktail in a glass shaped like the building which you could take home, I had it for years before my mom smashed it taking it out from the dishwasher.

Locals loved this place when it was the Sheraton Landmark and if it were still run like it was then, there would likely be more opposition to it's demolition but years of deterioration and neglect by the current owners have resulted in a lot of indifference towards the building.

[supercanuck]

Originally Posted by EastVanMark

Not so bad? Chinatown is having is roots ripped from the ground and is being turned into a bland, redundant, gentrified nightmare.

On the other hand, agree about Main, Fraser Streets.

I do sort of agree with you. When I was young my family basically did everything in Chinatown (doctor, shopping, etc). However, the area slowly deteriorated (E.Hastings), plus with the old Aberdeen Mall and T&T at Metrotown there was so many "better" alternatives for Chinese residents. I don't think I've been to Chinatown in 7-8 years.

I hope the new developments will help reinvigorate the area.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by connect2source

Yes, it was THE place in the 70's, I remember being thrilled to be there as a small kid, totally magical, I was fascinated by how the entire restaurant revolved once / hour, I couldn't even concentrate on my meal as I was spell-bound by the view which was far better than today. Only the Royal Centre, The TD and Scotia Towers were taller but not by much. They served a cocktail in a glass shaped like the building which you could take home, I had it for years before my mom smashed it taking it out from the dishwasher.

Locals loved this place when it was the Sheraton Landmark and if it were still run like it was then, there would likely be more opposition to it's demolition but years of deterioration and neglect by the current owners have resulted in a lot of indifference towards the building.

Hence we need a taller tower with a revolving restaurant for an even better view than Empire Landmark's. That should be the condition from CoV for project approval. Robson street should have buildings with a large commercial component rather than 90% residential. I thought this is the direction our City is taking after people lamented about the loss of commercial lots downtown. Even though this is in the West End, Robson street should be a commercial-heavy street, and to a certain extent, Alberni as well.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

As is our definition of "deteriorating" and "(not) improving." Neither street is anywhere near close to stagnant - not in terms of liveliness or growth, not now or in the future.

Unless said definitions involve several thirty-storey towers on every block, in which case both areas are indeed stunted.

http://urbanyvr.com/shortage-of-new-...etro-vancouver

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by Vin

http://urbanyvr.com/shortage-of-new-...etro-vancouver

That report's for Vancouver in general - which, mind you, is already the most crowded metro in Canada AND in the West Coast. Why pick on Broadway (set to be one of the city's densest regions, just waiting on the SkyTrain extension) or Main (already built or planned at Olympic Village, Mount Pleasant and QE Park), rather than SFH arterials that aren't redeveloping at all?

Originally Posted by Vin

Hence we need a taller tower with a revolving restaurant for an even better view than Empire Landmark's. That should be the condition from CoV for project approval.

There's an idea. Same tall revolving restaurant, but without the rain-stained Brutalist earthquake magnet underneath it.