Quote:
Originally Posted by Metro-One
Just some cut and dry facts about the Surrey LRT from the project's environmental and socio-economic review:
Opening Day:
40 metre platforms with 30 metre long cars.
capacity of 2,040 pphpd
Current peak hour capacity on the 99 B-Line is 3,700 pphpd
So technically, yes, upon opening the LRT will have less capacity than a B-Line.
However, in the future the system can be expanded to 60 metre stations.
This will give a build out capacity of 4,080 pphpd (380 people more than the 99 B-Line)
For comparison, the Canada Line currently has a peak capacity of 6000 pphpd, expandable to a build out capacity of 15,000 pphpd.
So the ultimate build out capacity for the Surrey LRT is a mere 27% that of the Canada Line's build out capacity.
Then there is the fact that the LRT will travel much slower and less frequently than Skytrain.
All these facts are especially troubling for the Langley extension.
Yes, 1/3 of Metro-Van's population lives south of the Fraser, so shouldn't we invest in building a far more robust system for the future of this area??
But this is what Surrey wants. So in the end it will only be Surrey to blame (though for the Langley extension the province should really stop pandering to the city).
These are all facts from the official documents themselves.
I am sure Reecemartin will say "if you add this, fudge that, calculate this yourself, etc... you can get a much higher capacity"
Well, I am going to preemptively say none of that matters, because once again these stats are from the official plans themselves. This is the capacity they are building for. This is what is going to get built. And any fudging done afterwards will either be minimal increases in capacity or will require super expensive major rebuilds, which is why we should re-think this project now in the first place.
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The capacity of a 30m car is 250 with standees so 500 for a 60m car. The frequency is planned to be every 5 minutes (12 trains per hour). 12 * 500 is 6000 cut and dry. I don't know why you are so critical of doing this math, its no different than the math Translink is using or planners use, no university degree needed. I just used the vehicle capacity and the frequency it's simple no fudging required. I don't know whether the 2040 number you have is from some official document but, 2040 would be a 30m car at 8-minute frequency, not 5, and the document on the Translink website says trains every 5 minutes. Clearly, the numbers are being fudged however not by me. Nonetheless, anyone can calculate these numbers based on vehicle capacity and frequency.
You are so critical of my numbers but they are also based on official documents so I would love to figure out where the discrepancy is.
Edit: In fact it just confuses me why anyone would argue that buses that aren't on a busway are offering higher capacity. The LRT vehicles are bigger and can come just as frequenly, indeed that means that an LRT should at a minimum be able to match the capacity of a bus because again X * Frequency >= Y * Frequency when X >= Y
The Canada Line is going to need expensive rebuilds to reach 15,000 ppdph its stations are going to struggle to handle even double the current ridership. Vancouver City Centre is already going to need a South Exit sooner than that.
As always I am very much in favour of extending the Expo Line on Fraser Highway, however, the extension to Langley isn't going to happen with the current Surrey LRT budget and ending the Langley Line at 176st in a field doesn't make sense, it needs to get to Willowbrook at a minimum.
Edit #2: You are also comparing the 99 B-Line's capacity to the Surrey LRT, last time I checked the 99 B-Line operates in Vancouver, not Surrey. The
96 B-Line operates in Surrey so if we are talking about comparing capacity before and after then we should be using THAT for comparison, its dishonest to suggest that Surrey ever has had anything close to 99 B-Line level service on this corridor. Obviously that level of service isn't necessary today but its relevant because it is being suggested that capacity is going down on this route.
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