The Official Saint John, NB Project Thread

[OldDartmouthMark]

Hey All, just wanted to say I was in Saint John for the weekend and was really impressed with how well the old masonry buildings have been preserved and refurbished, and what a nice walkable downtown it is now. It's probably been 10 years since I have spent any time there and I noticed a distinct improvement from then.

Also finally managed to get into the Imperial theatre and was very happy to see how well it has been restored. I know it was done some time ago, but this is the first time I've experienced it in person.

Even driving around some of the older residential areas near the downtown I was struck by the sheer number of very ornate 19th century buildings that are still in use, some in lesser states of repair, but still remaining and with potential to become things of beauty again as the area continues to improve.

Being from Halifax, I really have the impression that we've not done nearly as well to preserve our heritage buildings as Saint John. It seems like the norm in Halifax is still to tear down 100-year-old buildings and build new, unimpressive architecture. When an older building actually is retained, it's usually just the façade, and very rarely are the key elements of the interior remaining once it's done. For old-style theatres, we don't have anything that remotely compares to the Imperial, the only thing slightly close that remained was the Oxford, but it was not nearly as ornate and impressive (built in the 1930s), and it's now closed anyhow, soon to become offices or condos the last I heard.

Anyhow, I just wanted to give my positive impressions of SJ. To me it really feels as if it's on the upswing. I plan to return there this summer to have a chance really walk the downtown and enjoy the ambiance (and some craft beer) in nicer weather.

[MonctonRad]

If uptown SJ can be rejuvenated in the appropriate way, preserving the best of the past, including historic streetscapes, it could become a real jewel of the east coast.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

If uptown SJ can be rejuvenated in the appropriate way, preserving the best of the past, including historic streetscapes, it could become a real jewel of the east coast.

Already on its way.

[Fischbob]

Thanks for posting - always nice to hear the impressions of those paying a visit.

The Imperial truly is a great venue and we're incredibly lucky to have it. It could have met the same fate as the Paramount across the square but there were some forward thinking individuals in the '80s and '90s who were able to rally the community in support of its lengthy restoration.

The momentum Uptown in recent years has been palpable, and IMO things are continuing to head in the right direction with more upper floor residential conversions and proposals like 91 King and Union/Wellington gradually bringing in more residents, who in turn can support more and more diverse businesses. We're now also starting to see proposals outside of the traditional "hot zone", such as 36 St. James (former Salvation Army shelter) in the South End, Cliff Street in Waterloo Village, and reinvestment along Union. The private sector component of the Coast Guard site remains elusive, but with all the other investments happening on the Peninsula I'm not overly concerned about having to wait.

Enjoy your next visit, and if it turns out to be foggy, just think of it as free air conditioning!

[OldDartmouthMark]

Thanks very much for the Imperial Theatre link - I had been wondering about its history and how it had transitioned over the years. Thankfully there were those with foresight that could see the value even in its aging state.

In my lifetime I don't recall anything near as elegant in Halifax. There was a Capitol Theatre in Halifax at the foot of Spring Garden Road (location of the current Maritime Centre) that was in a similar vein, but not nearly as nice as the Imperial. It was torn down in the 1970s, and I don't have any memories of actually being in it, but I would have been quite young at the time. Below is a link with some info:
http://cinematreasures.org/theaters/12220

I am glad to hear that things are moving along in a good direction. I will be sure to look deeper into this thread to learn more about SJ's upcoming and current projects.

One thing that I didn't mention about my visit (and previous ones) was the people - I have always found the people of Saint John to be very friendly and welcoming, and I wasn't disappointed this time. It's always been a positive experience, and I look forward to returning soon. Regarding the fog, we're not strangers to that in Halifax, though I understand Saint John can take it to another level! It's all good either way, a bit of a trade off for being near water, but well worth it.

[southieSJ]

It's grand! We really need to get past the NIMBYism. Given our situation we have to stop letting a vocal minority win every time. Saint John needs the jobs that will come with the cannabis facility over west on Lancaster ave.

Originally Posted by Fischbob

Crowded agenda for tomorrow's PAC meeting. A few highlights:

- Adaptive reuse of the former Cornerstone Baptist Church at Leinster and Carmarthen with plans to convert the church into a wedding/banquet venue along with an ancillary office and dwelling unit.
- New digital marquee for the Imperial Theatre.
- Adaptive reuse of the former Salvation Army men's shelter at Canterbury and St. James to renovate the building for 25 one- and two-bedroom market rental apartments. Conceptual sketch below:



- Rezoning of a portion of the Petro-Canada redevelopment at Bayside and Mount Pleasant East is back on the agenda.
- Rezoning of the parcels at 453 Boars Head and 573 Woodward to allow a residential development consisting of 21 semi-detached houses, one 12-unit building and two 24-unit buildings. Site plan below:



- Finally, rezoning of the soon-to-be-former T4G office on Lancaster Avenue to allow for a cannabis processing facility. Several letters of opposition were received for this one.

[Ire Narissis]

Originally Posted by southieSJ

It's grand! We really need to get past the NIMBYism. Given our situation we have to stop letting a vocal minority win every time. Saint John needs the jobs that will come with the cannabis facility over west on Lancaster ave.

I read through the letters of objection, and the loudest, most vocal one immediately lost all credibility to me when he described T4G as a "Call Centre".

If he really cares so much about what occupies the building, he would do well to demonstrate it by correctly identifying the category of business that's in it currently.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by Ire Narissis

I read through the letters of objection, and the loudest, most vocal one immediately lost all credibility to me when he described T4G as a "Call Centre".

If he really cares so much about what occupies the building, he would do well to demonstrate it by correctly identifying the category of business that's in it currently.

For some reason tons of New Brunswickers think tech companies are just call centres.

[Fischbob]

BREAKING: The Church of St. Andrew and St. David on Germain Street is up for sale, according to a real estate agent's posts on social media.

Sign of the times, I suppose. I hope this one doesn't languish the way Gothic Arches has, and that we get a solid adaptive reuse project in a reasonable timeframe.

Speaking of Gothic Arches, the owner is now pitching a microbrewery concept in an attempt to bring a buyer or partner on board to save the building. I wish him luck.

[ColSJ]

http://huddle.today/developer-plans-25-unit-apartment-building-in-south-end-of-saint-john/

Additionally information on the proposed redevelopment of the old Salvation Army building.

[Fischbob]

Another type of accommodation is coming to the Uptown - a "boutique hostel" called BunkHaus that will be located at 36 Water Street.

https://sjcommercialre.com/2018/04/19/boutique-hostel/

Ingrid hopes that BunkHaus will help draw more travelers to the city and is excited to bring affordable yet chic accommodations to the Uptown core. The hostel will offer both private rooms and custom timber-frame bunks with stair access the top beds. As for the common area there will be a fresh new communal kitchen, long harvest table for sharing meals, and a lounge area for guests to relax and meet one another. The addition of a minibar as well as an outdoor patio with hammocks and heat lamps are also part of the plan but will come later. On-site laundry and free Wi-Fi will be vailable too.

With traditional Saint John architecture of 12ft high ceilings, exposed brick, and large windows, there will be no problem making this space a home using local art, plants, and comfortable Scandinavian-inspired furnishings. Guests will feel right at home here as they share meals, music, and memories together in the communal spaces designed to bring people together.

[ColSJ]

Welp... Jeremiah’s in the market is closed for good and for anyone who’s ever been there I’m sure you feel the same outrage I’m feeling. This was an economic thriver of the market and now it’s gone. Our prime minister spends over 8 million dollars on a rink at parliament hill just blocks away from the largest outdoor rink in North America (Rideau canal) but not a dollar from any level of government to assist Jeremiah’s to get back on its feet has come up. Honestly I think someone should start a go fund me and raise money for jeremiah’s. I recognize it’s a health hazard that caused the close but at the end of the day everything involves money. The staff were so friendly and I know Saint John loved their food and service.

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by ColSJ

I recognize it’s a health hazard that caused the close but at the end of the day everything involves money. The staff were so friendly and I know Saint John loved their food and service.

So...here's the Food Premises Inspection Form posted for Jeremiah's, April 16, 2018.

This seems to have nothing to do with money and everything to do with GNB revoking their licence for repeatedly failing to meet medical health standards. No idea why anyone would be outraged with that and I have no idea why you would feel the need to tie this in with what money the Federal Governmnet of Canada ties to hockey arenas on Parliament Hill.

In fact, they may not even be closed for good, as the owner is waiting to see if the licence will be restored. Non-story.

[Fischbob]

Originally Posted by JHikka

So...here's the Food Premises Inspection Form posted for Jeremiah's, April 16, 2018.

Makes you wonder how many other food vendors at the Market are dealing with rodent issues - I would venture to say all of them are vulnerable considering they occupy space in the same building. Was Jeremiah's doing a worse job at rodent mitigation than other tenants or was this simply luck of the draw and a similar series of inspections at another given vendor would also result in a license revocation? Time to rifle through some inspection reports.

EDIT: Here's a recent one for Sagrati's - also reporting rodent droppings in the kitchen area. Interestingly, the inspector's notes state that "The expectation in the market is to monitor your facility daily for the presence of rodent droppings and clean and sanitize as necessary". The re-inspection date on that one is April 16th, the same date as Jeremiah's re-inspection. Presumably Sagrati's passed or we'd be hearing of its closure as well.

[ColSJ]

Originally Posted by JHikka

So...here's the Food Premises Inspection Form posted for Jeremiah's, April 16, 2018.

This seems to have nothing to do with money and everything to do with GNB revoking their licence for repeatedly failing to meet medical health standards. No idea why anyone would be outraged with that and I have no idea why you would feel the need to tie this in with what money the Federal Governmnet of Canada ties to hockey arenas on Parliament Hill.

In fact, they may not even be closed for good, as the owner is waiting to see if the licence will be restored. Non-story.

According to the Telegraph Journal and the newly posted sign at the location they’re closed for good. I don’t know if you’ve ever been there but if you have you’d know that when you’re ordering food you can watch everything they do when they make your sandwich. Ive never noticed anything that set me off about their handling of the food. I’ve aten there hundreds time and I’ve never felt sick after eating their food. Now... why I tie this into money and governments. First of all this was a goverment department that shut it down, second of all everything has to do with money. Whatever upgrade the owner would have to make would cost money, and if it was affordable I see no reason why he wouldn’t go forward with applying the necessary adjustments to fix the problem. This is the oldest market in North America and what message is Saint John sending to the world when their local government isn’t willing to step in and aide such a high profile business but a 8.8 million dollar rink? Oh sure!! Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying every time a business gets itself into trouble the government should step in and give them money cause that would become a financial issue, what I am saying is the Gov’s should recognize this is one of the most thriving businesses in the market, one that attracts people to the market, and also employees a number of people. If you take a look at the market today you’d know there’s a number of empty spots, and if Jeremiah’s has the capability to close, all businesses in the market are vulnerable. And the last thing we need is another historic building going into a freefall. The building is government owned so they should be responsible for keeping it clean and a business should not be punished for their failure to do so

[JHikka]

Originally Posted by ColSJ

First of all this was a goverment department that shut it down,

Because they violated medical health guidelines upon inspection and re-inspection.

Originally Posted by ColSJ

second of all everything has to do with money. Whatever upgrade the owner would have to make would cost money, and if it was affordable I see no reason why he wouldn’t go forward with applying the necessary adjustments to fix the problem.

If you read the inspection form you would know the issue is rodent droppings not being cleaned and removed from the premises. They repeatedly did nothing to alleviate this problem, apparently.

If this is a structural problem with City Market, as pointed out by Fischbob with other vendors who have met their inspections, perhaps something can be done to renovate however the rodents are accessing vendor spaces.

[ColSJ]

Originally Posted by JHikka

Because they violated medical health guidelines upon inspection and re-inspection.


If you read the inspection form you would know the issue is rodent droppings not being cleaned and removed from the premises. They repeatedly did nothing to alleviate this problem, apparently.

If this is a structural problem with City Market, as pointed out by Fischbob with other vendors who have met their inspections, perhaps something can be done to renovate however the rats are accessing vendor spaces.

For the record I’m totalling aware of what caused Jeremiah’s to loss their license but at the end of the day who owns the market? Jeremiah’s or the gov? People have lost their jobs because the owners of the building THE GOV couldn’t properly maintain their own building. Welcome to New Brunswick!!

[thefishingnut]

What is it that Trudeau is supposed to be giving them money for, a broom and some cleaning clothes?

[cdnguys]

Mice at city market is not something new. It has all the factors - located in an old densely populated area, heat, food smell, food droppings, doors constantly being opened and closed. No one is to blame but the owner - contaminated food can take the life of someone who’s immune system is compromised. Doing a quick check for rodent droppings is part of the tenant’s morning routine in the market even though the city takes measures to mitigate it. The chief medical officer made the only correct decision to be made. I hate to see it close but they need to accept responsibility.

In another note, can anyone confirm rumour that the parking garage overlooking St Andrew’s green was sold and will be torn down to construct condos?

[cdnguys]

Originally Posted by ColSJ

For the record I’m totalling aware of what caused Jeremiah’s to loss their license but at the end of the day who owns the market? Jeremiah’s or the gov? People have lost their jobs because the owners of the building THE GOV couldn’t properly maintain their own building. Welcome to New Brunswick!!

Building is owned by the City of Saint John. It is properly maintained. Mice can enter Irving’s house in Rothesay. If you look at other vendor inspection reports there are no issues. You don’t clean your premises properly it will attract mice.