Winnipeg City Transit/Rapid Transit

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by GarryEllice

I really don't get why people are complaining. It's not like this is some huge new expense on top of the existing system. It's just a reorganization of the bus service that already existed. If anything this is the ideal time to open it, so that any kinks can be worked out before large numbers of people start using it.

Makes sense, the only thing that really needs to be adjusted is the frequency that buses are run, with next to no passengers aside from the two peak times frequency can be cut back drastically!

[robertocarlos]

Shopped at River Safeway on Thursday at 3-4 pm and took the bus home. There were 8 people on the bus and it was the first of two buses, 16 and 18, at the same time.
It was nice getting dropped off right in front of TNS.

[ssiguy]

Any vids of the entire route?

[LilZebra]

Yes!

[dmacc]

It's been just over a week now for SWRT and I've been noticing more people using the stations along the dogleg. Nothing much but saw a few vehicles parked at the park and ride. Good to see some are using it, even during the pandemic.

[scryer]

Originally Posted by dmacc

It's been just over a week now for SWRT and I've been noticing more people using the stations along the dogleg. Nothing much but saw a few vehicles parked at the park and ride. Good to see some are using it, even during the pandemic.

I'm surprised too. Hopefully it will be a good sign of things to come as it would be nice if Winnipeg could get higher ridership numbers to further support a desire for rapid transit solutions.

I guess we won't find out until after the pandemic is over.

[buzzg]

Is there a sizable park and ride at Kildonan Place? Would be smart for transit to market U of M students that drive in from north of the city to park and ride the 47 there now that it should be considerably faster, and they all have bus passes already.

[LilZebra]

Originally Posted by dmacc

It's been just over a week now for SWRT and I've been noticing more people using the stations along the dogleg. Nothing much but saw a few vehicles parked at the park and ride. Good to see some are using it, even during the pandemic.

I saw a male worker get on at northbound at Seel and get off at Beaumont last week. So some are even using it for such short distances. Not everyone's using it for U of M to downtown travel.

And I'm surprised that Beaumont Station is not in the middle of nowhere, like the cycling environmentalist would have us believe. There are houses pretty close to that and the othe stations like Clarence and Chevrier.

When the weather warms up a bit more (ahem) I'll give the pedestrian path a try.

[bomberjet]

Originally Posted by buzzg

Is there a sizable park and ride at Kildonan Place? Would be smart for transit to market U of M students that drive in from north of the city to park and ride the 47 there now that it should be considerably faster, and they all have bus passes already.

There's a park and ride area beside the Canadian Tire along the internal mall roadway. Not as large as the lots on the southwest transitway.

[dmacc]

Originally Posted by LilZebra

I saw a male worker get on at northbound at Seel and get off at Beaumont last week. So some are even using it for such short distances. Not everyone's using it for U of M to downtown travel.

And I'm surprised that Beaumont Station is not in the middle of nowhere, like the cycling environmentalist would have us believe. There are houses pretty close to that and the othe stations like Clarence and Chevrier.

When the weather warms up a bit more (ahem) I'll give the pedestrian path a try.

The Beaumont Station does have homes just to the south of it although the Seel Station would serve them just fine as well. Beaumont can serve the Fulton grove development... if it ever goes ahead. Though I feel the Seel and Beaumont could have just been combined.

A couple weeks ago when we were having nice weather the pedestrian path was so busy it was almost hard to social distance.

I've seen a fair amount of people that seem to be from the industrial park to the west of the line using the stations.

[GarryEllice]

Originally Posted by buzzg

Is there a sizable park and ride at Kildonan Place? Would be smart for transit to market U of M students that drive in from north of the city to park and ride the 47 there now that it should be considerably faster, and they all have bus passes already.

I don't think the new 47 is as much of a game changer as it is being perceived. There was already a direct route from KP to the UofM, the 75, which is actually faster than the 47.

The extended 47 is not even as fast as the former 47+161 combination. Yeah, that required a transfer downtown, but then you got a non-stop ride to campus on the 161. The 160 (now the 47) can be painfully slow on Pembina at busy times, as people get on and off at every stop.

[buzzg]

Originally Posted by GarryEllice

I don't think the new 47 is as much of a game changer as it is being perceived. There was already a direct route from KP to the UofM, the 75, which is actually faster than the 47.

The extended 47 is not even as fast as the former 47+161 combination. Yeah, that required a transfer downtown, but then you got a non-stop ride to campus on the 161. The 160 (now the 47) can be painfully slow on Pembina at busy times, as people get on and off at every stop.

Yeah I don't know much about those routes, was more just asking if it would make sense to have a park and ride on the north side of the city for U of M staff/students that come from out of town or just that area (who have transit passes anyway) since presumably it will be faster now, and wouldn't need to pay for a parking spot.

[GarryEllice]

Originally Posted by buzzg

Yeah I don't know much about those routes, was more just asking if it would make sense to have a park and ride on the north side of the city for U of M staff/students that come from out of town or just that area (who have transit passes anyway) since presumably it will be faster now, and wouldn't need to pay for a parking spot.

What I was trying to say, though, is that it's not faster now. The new 47 is slower than an existing option, the 75 via Lag and Bishop (44 minutes on the 75, 51 minutes on the 47). It's also slower than the previous option of taking the 47 to downtown and then transferring to the very fast 161 which no longer exists. Park and ride still makes sense, of course, but no more sense than it already made.

[buzzg]

With the feds announcing they're going to fast track shovel-ready infrastructure post-COVID (prioritzing green, transit, etc) it seems like the perfect opportunity for Transit to figure out what the hell they're doing with EBRT and get some stimulus funds.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by buzzg

With the feds announcing they're going to fast track shovel-ready infrastructure post-COVID (prioritzing green, transit, etc) it seems like the perfect opportunity for Transit to figure out what the hell they're doing with EBRT and get some stimulus funds.

I'm not optimistic. There have been so many infrastructure programs over the years and the City has been so utterly hopeless at capitalizing on them in a meaningful way when it comes to transit. I mean, maybe they'll get a few bucks to fix up the barns on North Main or whatever, but EBRT?

[bomberjet]

There was this new fangled idea of BRT from KP to U of M. But hey, crazy idea right.

As Esquire mentioned, Winnipeg for whatever reason never really capitalizes on any of these programs. Recently Winnipeg got a couple million for bus barns, while the next day Edmonton received 1 billion for transit.

[Andy6]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

There was this new fangled idea of BRT from KP to U of M. But hey, crazy idea right.

As Esquire mentioned, Winnipeg for whatever reason never really capitalizes on any of these programs. Recently Winnipeg got a couple million for bus barns, while the next day Edmonton received 1 billion for transit.

Where did Edmonton get $1 billion from?

[esquire]

Originally Posted by Andy6

Where did Edmonton get $1 billion from?

Ottawa. Edmonton has been far more successful than Winnipeg in snagging federal funding for transit projects.

[Winnipegger]

Can I just chime in here for a second, as someone who has pretty good knowledge about how these things work? Federal governments like shovel ready projects, especially during or right after a recession, because they want credit for handing out the cash before the next election cycle begins which is amplified by pictures of massive infrastructure projects being built. They don't want to give municipalities six million dollars to fund a bunch of studies and designs that will take another 10 years to award and construct. They want to hand cash over to get stuff built ASAP. And guess what: the projects that cities have shovel ready is largely a function of what the local population and elected officials think should be a priority given their budget constraints.

Which brings me to my next point: Winnipeg doesn't have the next legs of rapid transit shovel ready because our elected officials have realized that the money isn't there to do the work and that citizens simply wouldn't want to take a tax hike to pay for it. Therefore we haven't gone out and spent $5 million to get a class 3 estimate on what a grade-separated EBRT looks like because we know we can't afford it and we know cheap-ass Winnipeggers would never want to pay for it.

So yeah, places like Edmonton and Calgary and Vancouver and Ottawa can get money infused into massive infrastructure projects because the people in those cities value those projects, expect their elected officials to plan for them, and expect to pay higher property taxes to fund those projects, thus a lot of major projects in other cities become "shovel ready" because planning for them is in the works before cash is ever handed out.

In Winnipeg, it's different. The capital budget is largely taken up by filling potholes (local and regional street renewal takes up almost a third of the capital budget) and constructing waste water projects (North End, South End, and main renewals/replacements). We don't have a lot of cash left over for BRT planning, interchanges, community centres, or other major infrastructure projects. Why? Because people simply don't want to pay for it, as reflected in our low property taxes. So we aren't going to blow millions of dollars running studies on projects we know we will never do because that is also a waste of tax dollars. The result is that when the Feds come running to municipalities asking where they can shovel a bunch of cash, we get caught with our pants down and end up doing lame things like fixing bus garages and rennoing community centres because that's all we planned for and because that's all we were prepared to pay for.

So the next time you see a Winnipegger complain about missed federal funding opportunities, look them straight in the eye and tell them it's their own fault because at the end of the day, it all comes down to citizen priorities and Winnipeggers have made it abundantly clear that we'd rather have low tax and pay for nothing than have high tax and pay for something.

[LilZebra]

Originally Posted by esquire

I'm not optimistic. There have been so many infrastructure programs over the years and the City has been so utterly hopeless at capitalizing on them in a meaningful way when it comes to transit. I mean, maybe they'll get a few bucks to fix up the barns on North Main or whatever, but EBRT?

The plan is to replace the Carruthrs Barn/North Garage with a brand new one located in East Kildonan near a new Transcona rapid transit line. But until recently, due to indecision on exactly where to put this line -- via Provencher or Marion in St. B., or more like the current 47 down Higgins, the plan to replace it has been in limbo.


I thought for a second that "EBRT" means "electrified BRT". Wish people would not get my elderly hopes up and actually spell it out as "Eastern BRT". LOL.