Halifax Stanfield International Airport Developments

[Takeo]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Of course if HIAA had their ILS working on the longer runaway, this would need not have occurred.

Well we don’t really know that. We can speculate but we don’t know that. That’s for the TSB to determine. And all accidents are the result of a series of events of course. It’s never just one thing. The out of commission ILS on the longer runway may well have been a contributing factor but it would not be the only factor. The winds were well within spec for a 47 but perhaps they changed at the last second or were gusting. Crew resource management may have also been a factor. Visibility. Confusion. ILS down. Etc. Whatever the final determination is, it will be a series of factors.

[Takeo]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Of course if HIAA had their ILS working on the longer runaway, this would need not have occurred.

p.s. I also read that there’s another instrument landing system pilots can use other than ILS (it’s another three letter acronym) but the Sky Cargo 47 was not equiped to use that system.

[Marty_Mcfly]

Originally Posted by Takeo

p.s. I also read that there’s another instrument landing system pilots can use other than ILS (it’s another three letter acronym) but the Sky Cargo 47 was not equiped to use that system.

That would be the RNAV approach on runway 32. You're right that the 747 was not equipped to fly that approach, but even if they were the latest weather conditions at YHZ were below the minimum threshold to fly a RNAV approach, so it's likely that even if they were capable of flying that approach that they wouldn't have been able to anyway. The ILS 14 was their only option, even if it wasn't a good option. It's likely that if runway 05/23 were open they could have utilized the ILS on 23 and been fine, but you need to adapt to your conditions and circumstances, and know when you've been defeated.

Ultimately this will be pilot error. The only questionable thing about all this is why YHZ decided to wait so long in the year to shut down their main runway for work when the bad weather season is upon us. But even still, the pilots need to make better decisions under these circumstances. Moncton is only 20 minutes of flight time away.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Cargo jet that overshot Halifax airport runway dismantled

[MonctonRad]

This perspective makes that runway look awfully short.

I know this effect is because of the telephoto lens, but still, it kinda make you wonder what the frig the pilots of this aircraft were thinking, especially with a tail wind and a wet runway........

If I had been minding my own business driving by on the Old Guysborough Road when this happened, I would have been scared shitless.......

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

This perspective makes that runway look awfully short.

I know this effect is because of the telephoto lens, but still, it kinda make you wonder what the frig the pilots of this aircraft were thinking, especially with a tail wind and a wet runway........

If I had been minding my own business driving by on the Old Guysborough Road when this happened, I would have been scared shitless.......

And yet you can see there is plenty of room at the far end if they wanted to lengthen it.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

And yet you can see there is plenty of room at the far end if they wanted to lengthen it.

Actually, I don't think that's the case. If you use the 'measure distance' feature on Google Maps, you will find the following:

- Longer runway = 3.17 km
- Shorter runway = 2.35 km
- Distance from shorter runway to Old Guysborough Road = 308 m
- Distance from shorter runway to highway 102 (measured in the direction of the runway along center line) = 500 m

Presuming that the distance to OGR is some kind of required minimum distance from a roadway (all of which was needed in this case - but I don't know the spec), then that only allows for an additional 200m, or 0.2 of a km.

Can't say whether it would be a worthwhile investment, but it's not a lot of extra length to be gained. I'm guessing anything would be better than nothing in this case.

It's hard to say, however, that it would have been enough to prevent this issue as I imagine the plane decelerated more rapidly once the landing gear was sheared off and it dug its way into the turf at the end of the runway. If there was an extra 200 m of slick pavement, it may have still slid off the end.

https://goo.gl/maps/z7Z7qmSsTR32

On the other hand, if it were possible to build a runway overpass to cross over hwy 102, then there would be lots of additional runway space available. But, it would be very expensive, if it could pass all the regulatory requirements. And would depend on whether the land on the other side of the highway was available, etc. etc.

https://goo.gl/maps/er2kRnikWVv

[hoser111]

There is mention in the airport master plan(https://halifaxstanfield.ca/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/Master-Plan-Summary.pdf) about an eventual parallel runway to 05-32 which would require realignment of Old Guysborough Rd. I would suspect that any consideration for lengthening of 14-32 would be at that end. There is a significant drop in grade from where the start of runway 14 is to where highway 102 lies that would take a crap load of fill to level out. If they're already considering changing OGR, it'd probably make more sense to do it at that end, IMO.

[OldDartmouthMark]

That makes much more sense, though realigning a road isn't cheap either. Might have to move one of the holes on the golf course as well!

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

Might have to move one of the holes on the golf course as well!

Nah, those planes on final approach are just another hazard.......

[Keith P.]

I had forgotten about the grade change as one approaches the 102 from the end of that runway. The runway would need to be rotated about 30 degrees at its NW end to allow a longer run, so essentially an entirely new runway. Probably not gonna happen.

[ghYHZ]

American Airlines is returning to YHZ in Summer 2019:

Daily from PHL and Weekends from LGA

http://news.aa.com/news/news-details/201...s-Seats-to-Paris-And-Madrid/default.aspx

[J81]

Originally Posted by hoser111

There is mention in the airport master plan(https://halifaxstanfield.ca/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/Master-Plan-Summary.pdf) about an eventual parallel runway to 05-32 which would require realignment of Old Guysborough Rd. I would suspect that any consideration for lengthening of 14-32 would be at that end. There is a significant drop in grade from where the start of runway 14 is to where highway 102 lies that would take a crap load of fill to level out. If they're already considering changing OGR, it'd probably make more sense to do it at that end, IMO.

Not a parallel runway. A parallel taxiway on the south side of the current 05-23.
Not sure why this would be needed honestly.

[hoser111]

Originally Posted by J81

Not a parallel runway. A parallel taxiway on the south side of the current 05-23.
Not sure why this would be needed honestly.

Page 6 - The airfield has sufficient capacity to accomodate future demand in hourly and annual aircraft movements beyond 2030. It is estimated that increased capacity will be required beyond the planning period which can be met by a new parallel runway to Runway 05-23 located southeast of the airport.

[Keith P.]

Do the runway numbers themselves (05-23 and 14-32) mean anything? I was always curious about the numbering scheme.

[hoser111]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Do the runway numbers themselves (05-23 and 14-32) mean anything? I was always curious about the numbering scheme.

Yep, they do. They indicate the heading(as it relates to compass bearing) with the last digit truncated. So runway 05 is 50 degrees. The opposite end is 180 degrees out. So 50+180=230, so runway 23.

[q12]

Terminal Reno update:

[here4theride]

Originally Posted by J81

Not a parallel runway. A parallel taxiway on the south side of the current 05-23.
Not sure why this would be needed honestly.

Not only did I read the concept of a new parallel runaway to 05-23 I also saw a diagram showing the location. It is located on the southeast side of the tower, basically at the end of the secondary runway and extends more or less the same relative distances as the main runway. Of course Old Guysborough Rd would need to be moved.

If I can find the diagram again, I will post. PS, I agree, there is no immediate need for this, however the airport has to spend our "Airport Improvement Fees" so I wouldn't rule it out vice lowering the fees.

[q12]

As reported by ghYHZ

United airlines is bringing back non-stop flights to Chicago.

Summary of non-stop flights operated to the United States from Halifax Stanfield:

Boston

Air Canada 2x Daily
Westjet 1x Daily

New York area airports

United Airlines EWR 3x Daily
Delta LGA 1x Daily Seasonal
American Airlines LGA 1x Weekly Seasonal

Philadelphia

American Airlines 1x Daily Seasonal

Chicago

United Airlines 1x Daily Seasonal

Orlando

Air Canada up to 5x Weekly Seasonal
Westjet up to 3x Weekly
Air Transat 2x Weekly Seasonal
Sunwing 1x Weekly

Tampa

Air Canada up to 5x Weekly Seasonal

St. Petersburg

Sunwing 1x Weekly Seasonal

Fort Lauderadale

Air Canada 1x Weekly Seasonal
Air Transat 2x Weekly Seasonal

[Keith P.]

I always found it odd that flying to/from Boston offered no choices other than Air Canada and now a Westjet flight. I would think that a Boston connection would be popular and wonder why no US carriers have done this.

I have used the US carriers to fly from here into LaGuardia a few times and that is pretty convenient. It's unfortunate those are only summer season flights.